May 9, 2025

Episode 635- Star Wars Andor Part 2 review

Episode 635- Star Wars Andor Part 2 review
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Star Wars

In this episode of Trek Talking and Beyond, host Uncle Jim and his panel of experts discuss various topics related to Star Trek and its universe. They introduce themselves and share personal anecdotes, followed by an overview of the podcast's structure, including fan shout outs and upcoming discussions on Star Trek polls and ethical dilemmas presented in Voyager episodes. The conversation delves into the moral implications of actions taken by characters in the series, particularly focusing on the ethical dilemmas faced by captains in dire situations. The conversation delves into the themes of sacrifice, morality, and character development in both Star Trek and Andor. It explores the complexities of choices faced by characters in dire situations, reflecting real-life dilemmas and societal issues. The narrative structure of Andor is likened to mini-movies, emphasizing the importance of character arcs and the need for leadership in chaotic times. The discussion also highlights the moral complexities of rebellion, particularly through the character of Luthen, and the interplay of choices and consequences in storytelling. They discuss themes of sacrifice, personal relationships, and the moral dilemmas faced by the characters. The conversation also touches on the importance of canon and continuity in the Star Wars universe, as well as the overall storytelling quality of the series. The participants share their impressions and ratings of the episodes, and conclude with a segment on Star Trek birthdays and a humorous message from William Shatner regarding Star Wars Day. Let's see what's out there...ENGAGE!

WEBVTT

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King Ways Fox Beer look is acting very weird. Captain

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Pike's this goes wife King ons and me after like Boimer,

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Tendi Starbaransom is very hard, spot Drive Black Alert, Tortillo

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has gone perserve It's bad laugh Edward is any is

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Pakistan Wolfs were Checkov's wearing Red Teeter's cat Kim packsack.

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You has had enough for that, BENI of make it.

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So everybody, let's.

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Go about the series as upon. Now about the series.

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I'm coming to you art services now talk about the

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series Cooks, the Harmless show Loud.

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What mean, Trekkies and Trekkers around the globe and the

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occasional Star Wars fan as well. It is Thursday, May A,

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twenty twenty five. Welcome the trek Talking and Beyond, Episode

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six hundred and thirty five. I'm your most excellent host,

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Uncle Jim.

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I'm good and I like ecology.

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Guys, my incredible, my awesome trucking Portland with our very

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own toy all. How you doing? I get that, I

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understand that completely. And also from Portland, yeah, that'll happen

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from time to time. And also from Portland, we have

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our very own miracle worker David. How you doing tonight, David.

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I'm pretty good. I'm pretty good.

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I found out that I was a noome.

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Thank you. Oh okay, you'll learn something new every day.

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I'll get our genetics run at some point.

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Oh boy. And sticking with our Portland theme, yeah, I

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would like to say welcome to the podcast to Eric,

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was also at Portland. How you doing tonight, Eric.

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I'm doing pretty good, man. I got my shelves back

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up here. I switched some stuff out. I got my

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playmates enterprise up here. Now, I got my DS nine

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positions so you can see it a little bit better.

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But just to make sure that the elephant in the

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room is taken care of. Yes, I did overtrim my

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mustache just a little bit. But it'll look good in

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about a week or so.

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Oh are we going to have to have an Eric's

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mustache poll now for the next time.

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I'm just saying they're there there. I'm very careful about

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how I keep my mustache. And this morning I was

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I was doing one of those things where I was like, and.

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I was like, now, I got to cut the whole

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thing down anyway.

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All right, all right, and let's swing out to Las

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Vegas and check out with Charles, how's your mustache?

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Charles hit a little bit of trimming incident with it

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earlier in the week. I think we got I think

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we finally got the rein out for a little while

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and the wind out, and I think things are getting

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a little better.

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Excellent. I see the palm trees, which is a good thing. Ye,

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very good thing. So guys, uh, we're looking to have

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a some female opinions on the podcast here. I've been

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putting a posts on our Facebook page and sharing them

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all over the place. If you would like to be

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on the show, just go to trek Talking dot com,

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click on the little green talkback mic in the bottom

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right hand corner and record us a message. Tell us

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why you would like to join us on the show,

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and hopefully we'll pick you and you can join us

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on Trek Talking and beyond. We'd love to have you.

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We'd also love you to have you help us run

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the podcast by become a bid by becoming a patron

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on Patreon. That's right, we have a Patreon page Patreon

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dot com back slash Trek Talking Podcast. Go over there

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and for only two dollars a month, two dollars, that's right,

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Cheaper than a cup of coffee at McDonald's. You can

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help support this podcast, and there's all kinds of great

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stuff that you can find over there as well. If

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you don't want to become a patron, you can find

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a link to our PayPal account and make any type

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of donation that you would like. We would really appreciate that.

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So on tonight's podcast, we're going to be talking about

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and Or Part two episodes four, five, and six. And

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as you can see, I got my Star Wars shirt

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on tonight, I'm ready to go. We also have our

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Fans shout outs where we thank fans just like you

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all around the globe for listening and supporting our podcast.

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We have our Star Trek polls. How far would you

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go to save a friend or a loved one?

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I wonder.

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How?

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We also have Star Trek Birthday is what Star Trek

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actor do you share a birthday with? Well find out

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on our Star Trek Birthday section and tonight and what's

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going on around the Star Trek universe. Will William Shatner

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ever make a director's cut of Star Trek five the

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Final Frontier? Well, I personally hope that he does, but

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you can find out tonight we also have We also

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have a Pike is making appearents in one twelfth scale

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and Paul will tell you all about that. And Enterprise

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went out with a whimper. I wonder why, and I

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think that Charles is going to tell us about that

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on our Star Trek News section. And you can head

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over to our Facebook page Trek Talking and Beyond, and

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at the top of the page you'll see a pinpost

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with the Livelong and Prosper logo asking you to tell

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us where you're listening from. Just fill that out there

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least some emojis because that gets my attention, and then

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tune into the next episode and listen to our fans

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shout out section see if your name is mentioned. So, Eric,

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would you like to get us started with our fans

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shout outs for tonight?

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I absolutely would.

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My very first fan shout out goes out to I

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believe the most what I'll consider remote area that I

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think We've got a fan shout out going out to.

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We are saying hello this week to Barry Bruce Eiinish,

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who is saying hello to us from Pa'll watch a

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come on right on the Newfoundland border up there in Quebec.

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Canada just a smidge below that fifty fifth parallel, so

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we're talking northern remote Quebec area. Barry Bruce Eiinish. It

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is so satisfying to know that the Internet has brought

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our message to the masses, and even out there in

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an area that is pretty far from any big cities.

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You are familiar with our podcast and familiar of course

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with Star Trek because it is a global phenomenon. As

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Paul often likes to remind us, thank you so much

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for listening to our podcast and for supporting us. Let

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me just say that, despite what our politics might say

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at the moment, I love Canada summers and I really

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really appreciate all of the support from our brothers and

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sisters north of the border there. So thank you, Barry

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Bruce Eiinish. This week, thank you as well to Alexandro Petrello,

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who's saying hello to us from Campagna City in Sal Paulo, Brazil,

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and they sent us a livelong and prosper a peace

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sign and some horns. Yeah, Alexandro, thank you so much.

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Rock and roll right back to you. I love it

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when somebody gets a little bit intense about it, because

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if you haven't noticed I could.

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Be that way sometimes.

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Thank you so much for supporting our podcast. Thank you

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as well this week to Harvey Goldstein, who's saying hello

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to us from Peterborough in the UK. We always have

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tons and tons of support from our brothers and sisters

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just across the pond, and you're sending us that beautiful,

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livelong and prosper sign, and I say peace and long

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life to you, Harvey. And last but not least, on

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my list, we are saying hello this week to David Wollanscroft,

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who is also in the UK, hailing from Manchester, Lancashire.

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They say you'll live long and prosper, as Spock would say,

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with a hand salute, and they sent us myriad emojis.

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We've got a person lifting weights, we've got a strong arm,

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we've got some thank you hands, and we've got a fox.

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And a bee.

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I wish I could read that as a sentence. I'm

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sure there's a hidden message in there.

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David.

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Maybe you should, you know.

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Send us another message to let us know what all

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those emojis meant. But we really really liked them, and

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we really really appreciate our support from all the folks

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over there in the UK. So, David Wallanscroft, thank you

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so much for saying hello this week. And Charles, I'm

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gonna spin that globe and send it over to you brother.

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Thank you.

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Eric.

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Let's start off with a warm welcome from Virginia Beach, Virginia.

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Dave Flanagan.

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Didn't we have.

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A crew member by flanagain back in Tea?

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Absolutely did?

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Yep?

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Yep a red shirt?

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Yeah, ah, hope Dave's not a red shirt. Also, welcome

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to from northeast Texas.

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Doug Bates. Welcome, Doug.

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Welcome from Fort Laudville, Florida from his little tricky corner.

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Brett Michael.

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Do you sing?

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Brett?

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I'm sure you've heard that joke before. And from one

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of my favorite visiting cities, Seattle, Washington. Welcome, Greg Nichols.

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Glad to have you here, Greg, David, who's on your list?

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Yeah?

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Thank Charles.

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I would like to say and sorry for butchering the name.

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I'm trying to pronounce you as best I could, but

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from Wie Tristany, I think that's how you pronounced it.

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But she's hailing in from Michigan. And thanks for the

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toy and listening to a podcast, So yeah, next time,

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my list is Elma Claude, Livelong and Poplar Pointrage, Wisconsin, USA.

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Next time my list is Martin Rolo from Waterbury, Connecticut.

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Thanks for you all for listening. And last time my

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list is Todd Earn from Mississippi. And I think we're

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having trouble with Paul right now, so I'm assuming we

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can justtion this.

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Off to Eric.

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Absolutely, I will cover Paul for now till he can

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get his sech issues taken care of. We would love

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to say hello to somebody all the way over in

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the Netherlands. Yes, that amazing country where over fifty percent

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of the land area is below sea level. Did you

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know that that's right? The Dutch are all about dams levies.

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In fact, they're the world leaders in floating architecture. Can

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you tell him Dirden out as an architect a little

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bit here? Well, one way or another, We're gonna say

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hello this week to Hank de Brovji, who's saying hello

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to us from Nizmegen in the Netherlands. And Hank, we

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really appreciate your support over there. Your country is one

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of those ones that I really really like to visit

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because it's so unique in the world. In terms of

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how the people live, how the people eat, and how

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the people build their dwellings. Thank you so much for

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supporting our podcast. Saying hello this week to top fan

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Steve a Heris, who's also over in the UK, England

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in the Eastern Midlands. Steve, you are a top fan

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and that means you interact with us a lot on

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our new ish Facebook page and we really really appreciate

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your support. Hopefully you're spending lots of thumbs up on

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all of Jim's amazing posts every week. Hello as well

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this week to Ice and Carl, who's hailing on all

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frequencies from hanover Deutsche Land. Ice, and thank you so

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much for saying hello to us from right in the

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middle of Europe.

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There.

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Germany has so many cool different areas, so many places

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to visit, and being about twenty five percent German myself,

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I can tell you that I love pretty much all

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of the food there as well. Thank you so much,

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Heysen Carl for saying hello to us this week. And last,

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but not least, on Paul's list, we're saying hello to

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Till Reloaded. That sounds like a contrived name to me,

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although I guess somebody's last name could be Reloaded, but

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Till Reloaded is saying hello to us from Austria. Grats

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a city in diarrhea to be Siah. I don't know

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what that means exactly, but Till we really appreciate your support.

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And Austria is another one of those amazing countries out

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there that has been through so.

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Much throughout the years.

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But you have good food, good people, good architecture. Some

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of your palaces there are really really off the hook.

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Sorry I'm geeking out on architecture today, guys. I can't

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really help it. But when I hear about these places,

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all I think about is the types of buildings these

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people build. So Till Reloaded, thank you so much for

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supporting our podcast. I'm gonna spin that globe and Jim's

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gonna bring it back state side.

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Thank you so much, Eric, and we hope that Paul

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finds a way to rejoin us because the show's just

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not the same without Paul, and we need someone to

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do our awesome Star Wars story for us. So Paul,

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get that thing of work and buddy. So while we're

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waiting for Paul, I want to say hello and thank

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you to Alan Steven who's listening to us in Maine,

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the home of Stephen King. We also want to stay

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hello to Stephanie Rourke who's listening to us in Michigan.

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Thank you, Stephanie. And I have a top fan on

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00:13:29.240 --> 00:13:33.080
my list. That means that Brandon Cowles interacts with us

250
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a lot on our Facebook page, answering polls, leaving comments

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that kind of thing. Thank you so much, Brandon, and

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he's from Kentucky, Live Long, and prosper And last but

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not least on my list, I'd like to say hello

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and thank you to Jerry Powell who's listening to us

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in Costa Mesa, California. Thank you so much, Jerry. And

256
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if you would like to be mentioned on a future

257
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fan shout out, please head over to our Facebook page

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Trek Talking and beyond. You'll see the Livelong, and Prosper

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pin to the top of the page. Just tell us

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where you're listening from and if you leave some emojis,

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that usually gets my attention. And when you see your

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heart next to your name from Trek Talking, you want

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to tune into the next podcast and hear your name

264
00:14:14.799 --> 00:14:18.879
mentioned on a fan shout out. And with that all done,

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it's time for our Star Trek polls.

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Lin Lin Lin you know me like no win what

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you thought about the showlen. We try to share.

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Your opinions with all of our minions out there because

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they listen worldwid.

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So tell us just what you think. Get together, we.

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Will all Trey Canara and robulin An.

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All right, guys. Every week on our Facebook page, I

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like to post lots of some fun ones, some tough ones,

274
00:15:01.679 --> 00:15:04.399
some interesting ones. You can go there and find all

275
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the polls and vote on the poles and without any

276
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further ado David Roll the tape.

277
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Lieutenant Torres won't allow you as to have anything to

278
00:15:14.120 --> 00:15:17.559
do with her treatment because of that majorit. We've gathered

279
00:15:17.559 --> 00:15:21.200
some corroborating evidence you committed a series of atrocities during

280
00:15:21.200 --> 00:15:26.000
the Kardassian War. Thousands of Majorans died on your surgical tables.

281
00:15:26.080 --> 00:15:26.720
That's absurd.

282
00:15:27.399 --> 00:15:30.639
I'm only a hologram, and I have no memory of

283
00:15:30.679 --> 00:15:31.360
those events.

284
00:15:32.559 --> 00:15:36.840
Your program, despite all its brilliance, is based on his work,

285
00:15:37.600 --> 00:15:38.799
and now we're reaping.

286
00:15:38.480 --> 00:15:45.039
The benefits of those experiments. Medically, ethically, it's wrong. We

287
00:15:45.120 --> 00:15:47.919
may have to delete your program. What about our patient?

288
00:15:49.559 --> 00:15:51.360
I suppose I'd have to try and treat her on

289
00:15:51.399 --> 00:15:54.840
my own no offense, but you need me.

290
00:15:55.120 --> 00:15:59.480
I realized that you're a physician. You know there's always

291
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a price to pay for the advancement of medical science.

292
00:16:02.519 --> 00:16:04.320
Sometimes that price is too high.

293
00:16:05.320 --> 00:16:05.759
Torture.

294
00:16:06.200 --> 00:16:09.759
I cured the fostosa virus, didn't I. So these experiments

295
00:16:09.799 --> 00:16:13.879
you say I conducted obviously helped me devise a treatment.

296
00:16:14.320 --> 00:16:17.399
Doesn't justify using people in laboratory experiments.

297
00:16:17.480 --> 00:16:22.360
During the occupation, I was forced to improvise. I used

298
00:16:22.440 --> 00:16:24.240
what resources.

299
00:16:23.559 --> 00:16:25.879
I had, and ethical considerations.

300
00:16:26.120 --> 00:16:31.840
Ethics are arbitrary. How do you suppose your own database

301
00:16:31.960 --> 00:16:36.320
was developed? Half the medical knowledge acquired on Earth came

302
00:16:36.360 --> 00:16:38.720
through experiments on lower animals.

303
00:16:38.240 --> 00:16:39.320
But not people.

304
00:16:39.720 --> 00:16:43.399
It's convenient to draw a line between higher and lower species,

305
00:16:43.440 --> 00:16:44.039
isn't it?

306
00:16:44.120 --> 00:16:46.840
Your kind of barbarism ended a long time ago, or

307
00:16:46.840 --> 00:16:48.000
at least it should happen.

308
00:16:48.200 --> 00:16:52.120
What difference does it make how long ago the research occurred.

309
00:16:52.559 --> 00:16:55.799
What matters is that we can use it to help

310
00:16:55.919 --> 00:16:57.080
patients today.

311
00:16:57.519 --> 00:16:59.159
Are you going to delete.

312
00:16:58.759 --> 00:17:03.679
My program and all of the research it contains, or

313
00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:07.920
are we going to use it to save Balana's life?

314
00:17:08.200 --> 00:17:12.000
Still wrestling with your ethical subroutines.

315
00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:13.880
Take my advice. It's a waste of time.

316
00:17:14.720 --> 00:17:17.440
What's important is that we saved.

317
00:17:17.119 --> 00:17:18.400
Two lives today.

318
00:17:18.720 --> 00:17:24.119
You need me delete my program, and you violate the

319
00:17:24.160 --> 00:17:27.359
first oath you took as a physician, do no harm.

320
00:17:27.680 --> 00:17:29.519
You have no right to say those words.

321
00:17:29.559 --> 00:17:33.240
You're going to erase my program, doctor, but you can never

322
00:17:33.400 --> 00:17:37.039
change the fact that you've already used some of my research.

323
00:17:37.359 --> 00:17:38.200
Where was your.

324
00:17:38.079 --> 00:17:44.599
Conscience when Balana was dying on that table? Ethics, morality, conscience?

325
00:17:44.799 --> 00:17:47.759
Funny how they all go out the airlock when we

326
00:17:47.839 --> 00:17:51.000
need something. Are you and I really so different?

327
00:17:54.440 --> 00:17:54.960
Wow?

328
00:17:55.160 --> 00:17:57.799
What a deep, deep, deep one? All right, Eric, So

329
00:17:58.279 --> 00:18:00.319
for those of you who have guessed, what is the

330
00:18:00.359 --> 00:18:01.480
poll question this week?

331
00:18:01.599 --> 00:18:03.799
Eric, Yeah, this is a really good one. In the

332
00:18:03.880 --> 00:18:07.400
Voyager episode Nothing Human, which is not one of those

333
00:18:07.440 --> 00:18:09.680
episodes that people think of when they think of best

334
00:18:09.759 --> 00:18:13.200
Voyager episodes, but I think that set of clips might

335
00:18:13.200 --> 00:18:17.039
have strayed into the area of some of the best

336
00:18:17.200 --> 00:18:21.319
Voyager we've seen. Bolonataures is joined with a scorpion like

337
00:18:21.400 --> 00:18:25.359
creature and removing it will kill them both. The doctor

338
00:18:25.400 --> 00:18:29.960
programs the Holidack to recreate the brilliant Cardassian exobiologist Krell

339
00:18:30.119 --> 00:18:34.920
Massett Masset made advances in medical research by experimenting on

340
00:18:35.039 --> 00:18:40.000
Bajorans during the Cardassian occupation of Beijor. The doctor used

341
00:18:40.000 --> 00:18:44.680
the unethically obtained knowledge to save her. Would you have

342
00:18:44.799 --> 00:18:48.880
done the same? And eighty seven percent of our poll

343
00:18:49.039 --> 00:18:53.480
responders said yes, they would have used that unethically obtained

344
00:18:53.680 --> 00:18:58.279
knowledge to save Bolonatres. Thirteen percent said that they would not.

345
00:18:59.160 --> 00:19:02.559
And as is my privilege as the poll reader, I

346
00:19:02.640 --> 00:19:05.279
will say that I one hundred percent agree with the

347
00:19:05.279 --> 00:19:09.559
minions on this one. Listen, it's clear that this hologram

348
00:19:09.720 --> 00:19:13.039
and voyager does a nice job of kind of separating

349
00:19:14.359 --> 00:19:20.079
the personal choice of this aspect of the question by

350
00:19:20.119 --> 00:19:22.720
making this guy a hologram, right. I think that they

351
00:19:22.720 --> 00:19:24.960
probably could have hit a little bit harder with this

352
00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:27.759
episode had they actually made it a person, a real

353
00:19:27.839 --> 00:19:30.839
sentient person that was not programmed to do the things

354
00:19:30.880 --> 00:19:33.920
that they did, somebody who actually had to choose to

355
00:19:34.079 --> 00:19:40.039
experiment on Bajoran's But generally speaking, once the deed is done,

356
00:19:40.640 --> 00:19:43.599
if you can use that research to save other people,

357
00:19:44.200 --> 00:19:47.240
then I think you should. Now there are plenty in

358
00:19:47.279 --> 00:19:50.319
the doctor, actually not the doctor, but the other doctor.

359
00:19:51.119 --> 00:19:54.759
Massette actually makes this point in this clip where he says,

360
00:19:54.799 --> 00:19:57.720
you know, you used to experiment on animals back in

361
00:19:57.720 --> 00:20:00.480
the day, and there's there are plenty of vgans in

362
00:20:00.519 --> 00:20:02.880
our society, for example, that would say that is not

363
00:20:02.920 --> 00:20:06.599
only completely unethical, but we shouldn't benefit from that, and

364
00:20:06.640 --> 00:20:09.839
we should actually reject the results that we get from

365
00:20:09.839 --> 00:20:12.839
that sort of stuff. But in my mind's I once

366
00:20:12.839 --> 00:20:16.519
the deed is done, you should, uh, you should use

367
00:20:16.559 --> 00:20:19.759
what knowledge you have to save other people. Does that

368
00:20:19.759 --> 00:20:23.319
mean you should keep doing unethical things. No, let's be clear,

369
00:20:23.680 --> 00:20:27.119
you should stop the process of doing unethical things. But

370
00:20:27.519 --> 00:20:30.039
if it's been done, it feels to me like it's

371
00:20:30.039 --> 00:20:31.759
okay to use that knowledge. I don't know what do

372
00:20:31.799 --> 00:20:34.960
you guys think?

373
00:20:35.720 --> 00:20:41.039
Yeah, I agree with you. I'm thinking in the same

374
00:20:41.319 --> 00:20:47.799
way that you explained it, because why not use something

375
00:20:47.839 --> 00:20:52.640
to save somebody's life there? Why throw it away? You know?

376
00:20:53.400 --> 00:20:55.559
I mean, I'm pretty sure there's a lot of ethical

377
00:20:55.640 --> 00:20:59.160
questions that might come up for all sorts of different things.

378
00:20:59.200 --> 00:21:01.799
But I think I have to agree with the million

379
00:21:01.880 --> 00:21:05.799
John this. Yeah, this, I think much that here was.

380
00:21:08.119 --> 00:21:09.119
And you know.

381
00:21:10.519 --> 00:21:13.960
What's the word I agree with the minion I kind

382
00:21:13.960 --> 00:21:15.960
of I'm trying to remember what he did now, but yeah,

383
00:21:16.039 --> 00:21:19.559
so uh yeah, I think I think you're right, Eric, Yeah,

384
00:21:20.000 --> 00:21:24.720
it's uh, he should be using the knowledge that they've

385
00:21:24.759 --> 00:21:25.440
already obtained.

386
00:21:26.599 --> 00:21:34.119
All right, let's back on technological weirdness going. For some reason,

387
00:21:34.200 --> 00:21:37.400
I'm only on this app. I don't know why, but

388
00:21:37.640 --> 00:21:38.440
that seems to be.

389
00:21:41.599 --> 00:21:44.680
And this is the this is the first time problem

390
00:21:44.880 --> 00:21:45.160
in the.

391
00:21:45.119 --> 00:21:49.000
Past hopefully don't work. Yeah, I don't remember this episode

392
00:21:49.079 --> 00:21:52.319
very well, but but if I'm getting the gist of it, basically,

393
00:21:52.400 --> 00:21:56.240
it's like the malfeasance is in his past. It's already

394
00:21:56.279 --> 00:22:01.480
been done, right, so.

395
00:22:01.240 --> 00:22:04.559
And he's a hologram and was actually programmed to experiment.

396
00:22:04.920 --> 00:22:06.720
So it's just you know, the knowledge.

397
00:22:07.880 --> 00:22:10.759
It's a slippery slope ethics wise, but but you know,

398
00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:13.960
they're in a situation where they can't undo it, right.

399
00:22:14.039 --> 00:22:19.440
They can't apply an ethical litmus test to something retroactively, right,

400
00:22:19.519 --> 00:22:21.200
you can't go back and do it. It's just like

401
00:22:21.200 --> 00:22:24.559
if you you were digging around in like Hitler's bunker, right,

402
00:22:25.319 --> 00:22:28.279
and somehow you came to wha who knew it? But

403
00:22:28.960 --> 00:22:33.559
you know, Joseph Mengela discovered a cure for cancer and

404
00:22:33.599 --> 00:22:36.759
it was never and no one ever knew, right, would

405
00:22:36.799 --> 00:22:40.799
you keep that cure from cancer, cure for cancer hidden

406
00:22:41.480 --> 00:22:44.359
and not release it to the world just because it

407
00:22:44.480 --> 00:22:48.400
was developed during the reign of the Third Ranch and

408
00:22:48.480 --> 00:22:50.799
their ethical Yeah, I think I just came up with

409
00:22:50.799 --> 00:22:54.400
a good book idea. But you know, but you know,

410
00:22:55.160 --> 00:22:58.240
you know, I say, Okay, well, you know, it's almost like,

411
00:22:58.400 --> 00:23:00.359
you know, it may sound callous, but it's like, well,

412
00:23:00.359 --> 00:23:03.960
maybe some good can come out of the bad stuff sometimes, right,

413
00:23:04.079 --> 00:23:06.200
I mean, it's just there was a way to stop

414
00:23:06.240 --> 00:23:09.279
these experiments from happening. Of course you would want to

415
00:23:09.279 --> 00:23:12.000
do that, but all you can do is go forward

416
00:23:12.000 --> 00:23:14.559
from the present time where you are in time and

417
00:23:14.559 --> 00:23:16.839
space and try to do the right thing moving ahead,

418
00:23:17.480 --> 00:23:19.160
all right. So I don't know if I've answered the

419
00:23:19.240 --> 00:23:23.759
question or not, but those are just my thoughts.

420
00:23:26.559 --> 00:23:29.279
Well, I think it did a good job, how about you, Charles.

421
00:23:34.200 --> 00:23:36.319
I kind of agree with Paul on this one. It's

422
00:23:36.319 --> 00:23:39.799
a slippery slope there. Ethics in general can be kind

423
00:23:39.799 --> 00:23:46.000
of slippery, and just dealing with he was talking about

424
00:23:46.039 --> 00:23:49.839
researching on animals and I kind of felt jumped the

425
00:23:49.839 --> 00:23:53.079
same direction Paul that It's like, yeah, I don't think

426
00:23:53.079 --> 00:23:55.640
it's the animal research that bothered me as much as

427
00:23:55.640 --> 00:24:02.680
some of the research done let's say, during World War Two. Yes,

428
00:24:02.759 --> 00:24:04.759
it's a positive research, it is.

429
00:24:08.039 --> 00:24:08.400
I mean.

430
00:24:08.559 --> 00:24:11.160
One of the interesting things that Massett actually makes as

431
00:24:11.160 --> 00:24:15.200
a point there, which I've always kind of found personally challenging,

432
00:24:15.359 --> 00:24:18.200
is He's like, where do you draw the line? And

433
00:24:18.319 --> 00:24:21.200
I think that there are a lot of people who say, well,

434
00:24:21.240 --> 00:24:24.400
you know, what's the difference between a dog and a cow?

435
00:24:24.480 --> 00:24:26.559
Why do we eat the cow and not eat the dog?

436
00:24:26.839 --> 00:24:29.359
And you know, I'm not here to debate that right now,

437
00:24:29.400 --> 00:24:31.799
but it is kind of an arbitrary line that I

438
00:24:31.839 --> 00:24:35.680
think everybody sort of not only accepts for themselves, but

439
00:24:35.920 --> 00:24:40.039
accept as part of a sociological construct. And in this case,

440
00:24:41.240 --> 00:24:45.519
he makes a really good point that the question is, Okay,

441
00:24:45.559 --> 00:24:49.279
we have this knowledge available to us, will we use it?

442
00:24:50.079 --> 00:24:50.319
You know?

443
00:24:50.359 --> 00:24:52.440
And the doctor's like, ah, it's unethical to use it,

444
00:24:52.519 --> 00:24:54.039
but yeah, but yeah.

445
00:24:53.799 --> 00:24:54.559
We have it.

446
00:24:55.119 --> 00:24:57.759
You know, should we save somebody's life with what we know?

447
00:24:58.039 --> 00:25:02.240
Even if it was a terrible way of obtaining that knowledge.

448
00:25:03.680 --> 00:25:05.039
Which I said, it's kind of.

449
00:25:06.599 --> 00:25:10.200
Possible going either way, though, I think the means do

450
00:25:10.319 --> 00:25:13.920
have the right idea was to save a life, especially

451
00:25:14.000 --> 00:25:18.960
in a situation where you can't get to other scientists

452
00:25:18.960 --> 00:25:22.119
to help you because they're out in middle of nowhere,

453
00:25:26.799 --> 00:25:28.680
all right for a main Bridge characters.

454
00:25:31.720 --> 00:25:34.000
Yeah, her contract said she wasn't going to die, so

455
00:25:35.319 --> 00:25:37.960
it didn't matter. So I think one of the things

456
00:25:38.200 --> 00:25:42.119
in this particular part I think Paul is right. I

457
00:25:42.160 --> 00:25:47.480
think if it happened a generation or longer before you,

458
00:25:48.319 --> 00:25:51.000
I think you have an easier time accepting it. But

459
00:25:51.200 --> 00:25:54.440
in this particular episode, there was a clip. Part of

460
00:25:54.440 --> 00:25:56.680
this clip which David and I had to cut out

461
00:25:57.319 --> 00:25:59.720
is one of the Bajoran members of the crew from

462
00:25:59.759 --> 00:26:03.480
the Mind Key. His parents had been tortured and murdered

463
00:26:03.480 --> 00:26:07.480
by Massette on Beajor, and he was completely against the

464
00:26:07.519 --> 00:26:11.000
whole thing because for him it was personal. And I

465
00:26:11.039 --> 00:26:15.000
think I think you draw the line at time. I

466
00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:20.400
think that's where the line gets drawn because it's hard

467
00:26:20.440 --> 00:26:23.480
for us. We could try to understand it and try

468
00:26:23.519 --> 00:26:26.279
to figure it out, but it's hard for us to truly,

469
00:26:27.039 --> 00:26:29.880
you know, feel it because it didn't directly affect us

470
00:26:29.880 --> 00:26:32.920
because we weren't even born at that time, and you know,

471
00:26:33.039 --> 00:26:36.519
nobody in our families would have been you know that

472
00:26:37.039 --> 00:26:39.799
our currently life would have been around during that time,

473
00:26:40.119 --> 00:26:44.319
so the personal effect on us isn't there, which and

474
00:26:44.359 --> 00:26:47.079
when you remove that, it's an easy decision to make.

475
00:26:47.839 --> 00:26:51.119
When you insert that, that makes it very difficult. And

476
00:26:51.200 --> 00:26:55.240
so I think that the minions are right. You use

477
00:26:55.279 --> 00:26:58.480
it if you can. But I think if if this

478
00:26:58.759 --> 00:27:01.599
had happened sooner, I think that it would have been no,

479
00:27:01.759 --> 00:27:04.839
because the pain is too fresh, you know. I mean,

480
00:27:04.960 --> 00:27:08.000
just as an example, I lost my aunt in the

481
00:27:08.000 --> 00:27:11.200
World Trade Center. She was on the eighty fourth floor

482
00:27:11.279 --> 00:27:14.640
and disintegrated. Pooh, nothing left of her. They had an

483
00:27:14.640 --> 00:27:17.559
empty coffin. All they found was some DNA left of her.

484
00:27:18.000 --> 00:27:21.440
That affects me personally. So on nine to eleven, I

485
00:27:21.519 --> 00:27:23.880
have a personal It's a different feeling for me than

486
00:27:23.920 --> 00:27:26.599
the rest of the country because it directly affected me.

487
00:27:27.200 --> 00:27:30.119
Not so much my daughter, but me, And I think

488
00:27:30.160 --> 00:27:32.960
this question is the same way I think people that

489
00:27:33.599 --> 00:27:36.759
would have remembered Massett and what he did, people that

490
00:27:36.799 --> 00:27:41.000
survived those concentration camps. You know, you have to respect

491
00:27:41.079 --> 00:27:44.039
their feelings. But in the long run, I think, yes,

492
00:27:44.440 --> 00:27:47.039
the minions are right, and I agree with them. So

493
00:27:47.519 --> 00:27:52.880
that's what I got to say. All right, So David,

494
00:27:52.920 --> 00:28:02.920
you want to run the next video.

495
00:28:00.279 --> 00:28:04.960
Ten isograms. If I understand your calculations, that's enough to

496
00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:07.799
increase your warp factor by a zero point zero three

497
00:28:07.880 --> 00:28:11.799
percent for one month. Unfortunately, that boost wouldn't get you

498
00:28:11.960 --> 00:28:15.400
very figh so you'd need to replenish the supply, and

499
00:28:15.480 --> 00:28:19.519
that means killing another life form and then another. How

500
00:28:19.519 --> 00:28:20.960
many lives would it take to get you back to

501
00:28:21.000 --> 00:28:25.440
the alpha quadrant? I think you know the reason we're

502
00:28:25.559 --> 00:28:29.440
under attack. These aliens are trying to protect themselves from you.

503
00:28:30.759 --> 00:28:35.519
Sixty three that's how many more will take. Every time

504
00:28:35.599 --> 00:28:38.279
I'd sacrificed one of those lives, a part of me

505
00:28:38.480 --> 00:28:39.559
is lost as well.

506
00:28:40.279 --> 00:28:42.799
I might believe that if I hadn't examined your research.

507
00:28:43.559 --> 00:28:47.599
These experiments were meticulous and they were brutal. If you'd

508
00:28:47.599 --> 00:28:49.799
felt any remorse, you'd never have continued.

509
00:28:50.400 --> 00:28:53.640
Starfleet Regulation three, paragraph twelve. In the event of a

510
00:28:53.680 --> 00:28:56.240
minute destruction, a captain is authorized to preserve the lives

511
00:28:56.279 --> 00:28:58.480
of his crew by any justifiable means.

512
00:28:58.759 --> 00:29:02.240
I doubt that protocol mass murder, and my judgment it

513
00:29:02.319 --> 00:29:03.920
did unacceptable.

514
00:29:04.319 --> 00:29:07.680
We had nothing. My ship was in pieces, our delithium

515
00:29:07.759 --> 00:29:11.119
was gone, we were running on thrusters. We hadn't eaten

516
00:29:11.160 --> 00:29:12.279
in sixteen days.

517
00:29:14.240 --> 00:29:16.839
We constructed a containment field that would prevent the life

518
00:29:16.839 --> 00:29:18.480
form from vanishing so quickly.

519
00:29:19.880 --> 00:29:20.880
But something went wrong.

520
00:29:23.279 --> 00:29:24.079
Get it there.

521
00:29:25.559 --> 00:29:26.640
Which try to send it back?

522
00:29:31.160 --> 00:29:33.279
We can't, but it was too late.

523
00:29:35.519 --> 00:29:38.880
We examined the remains and discovered it could be converted.

524
00:29:38.480 --> 00:29:43.319
To enhance our propulsion systems. It was already dead. What

525
00:29:43.440 --> 00:29:45.440
would you have done?

526
00:29:45.720 --> 00:29:48.000
We traveled over ten thousand light years in less than

527
00:29:48.000 --> 00:29:48.640
two weeks.

528
00:29:48.759 --> 00:29:50.160
We'd found our salvation.

529
00:29:51.000 --> 00:29:52.000
How could we ignore it?

530
00:29:52.720 --> 00:29:55.039
By adhering to the oath you took his star Fleet

531
00:29:55.079 --> 00:29:58.799
officers to seek out life, not destroy it.

532
00:29:58.799 --> 00:29:59.640
It's easy to cling to.

533
00:29:59.640 --> 00:30:02.000
Princip when you're standing on a vessel with its bullheads

534
00:30:02.039 --> 00:30:04.279
intact man by a crew that's not starving.

535
00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:05.599
It's never easy.

536
00:30:06.000 --> 00:30:08.079
But if we turn our backs on our principles, we

537
00:30:08.119 --> 00:30:12.200
stop being human. I'm putting an end to your experiments

538
00:30:12.519 --> 00:30:14.319
and you are here by relieved of your command.

539
00:30:16.640 --> 00:30:17.680
Wow.

540
00:30:17.839 --> 00:30:20.680
That's a pretty deep one. So if you haven't figured

541
00:30:20.680 --> 00:30:22.799
it out, what is our poll question? This week?

542
00:30:22.960 --> 00:30:25.599
Eric Genis is about one of my favorite episodes of

543
00:30:25.680 --> 00:30:30.000
Voyager ever. In the two part Voyager episode Equinox, Captain

544
00:30:30.079 --> 00:30:33.039
Ransom No, not the one who lifts weights all the time.

545
00:30:33.519 --> 00:30:36.759
Also stuck in the Delta quadrant, has been harvesting bio

546
00:30:37.000 --> 00:30:41.640
energy from nucleogenic creatures to enhance their warp drive, traversing

547
00:30:41.799 --> 00:30:44.880
ten thousand light years in a week. If you were him,

548
00:30:45.480 --> 00:30:48.920
would you have done the same thing to save your crew?

549
00:30:50.039 --> 00:30:53.039
And this is a very interesting question to me, and

550
00:30:53.119 --> 00:30:54.599
I think we can probably talk about this for a

551
00:30:54.640 --> 00:30:56.880
long time. This is like one of those episodes that

552
00:30:57.000 --> 00:31:01.200
to me warrants almost an entire episode of trek talking.

553
00:31:01.240 --> 00:31:06.359
But fourteen percent of our Pole respondents said absolutely, Ransom

554
00:31:06.400 --> 00:31:09.000
did the right thing. He had to get his crew

555
00:31:09.079 --> 00:31:11.359
home and so whatever it takes.

556
00:31:12.720 --> 00:31:13.240
Was correct.

557
00:31:13.480 --> 00:31:16.319
And he actually references that in that clip that we

558
00:31:16.440 --> 00:31:20.960
just saw too. Starfred regulations say something about the captain

559
00:31:21.000 --> 00:31:23.880
can do whatever needs to happen to save his crew.

560
00:31:24.000 --> 00:31:28.039
So fourteen percent said yes. Eighty six percent of our

561
00:31:28.119 --> 00:31:34.240
respondents said no, Ransom was not justified in killing these

562
00:31:34.359 --> 00:31:39.519
nucleogenic creatures in order to get his crew home more quickly.

563
00:31:41.200 --> 00:31:43.759
And so, you know, I have to say, this is

564
00:31:43.799 --> 00:31:47.480
one of the rare occasions when I actually agree with

565
00:31:47.519 --> 00:31:52.079
the minions on both of these poll questions. You know,

566
00:31:53.279 --> 00:32:00.559
if it's I think card moral compass, right. I think

567
00:32:00.680 --> 00:32:04.000
Jane Way is also a moral compass for us. She

568
00:32:04.400 --> 00:32:09.400
is presented with so many impossible situations during the course

569
00:32:09.400 --> 00:32:14.039
of Voyager, and she always finds that third option. And

570
00:32:14.480 --> 00:32:17.799
I think that that is a testament to the ingenuity

571
00:32:17.839 --> 00:32:21.319
that humans have where they see, you know, it's this

572
00:32:21.680 --> 00:32:24.720
or this, No, what if we did this instead? And

573
00:32:24.720 --> 00:32:27.680
that would be the better of the of the two options,

574
00:32:27.720 --> 00:32:31.440
is the third option. And here Ransom, I think, you know,

575
00:32:32.039 --> 00:32:34.160
he makes some good points. He's like, you would have

576
00:32:34.200 --> 00:32:37.000
done the same if your crew is starving, if people

577
00:32:37.039 --> 00:32:42.599
are dying, et cetera. You know, wouldn't you kill a creature?

578
00:32:42.960 --> 00:32:46.039
And I would think that in this case it seems

579
00:32:46.039 --> 00:32:50.319
particularly poignant because we can't communicate with these creatures, and

580
00:32:50.480 --> 00:32:55.920
although they maybe appear sentient, you know, humans don't generally

581
00:32:55.960 --> 00:32:59.079
have a problem killing animals to eat them.

582
00:33:00.079 --> 00:33:00.839
If we can't.

583
00:33:00.640 --> 00:33:05.359
Communicate with a creature, we're less likely to save that

584
00:33:05.440 --> 00:33:09.599
creature's life in sacrifice of a human life. So I

585
00:33:09.759 --> 00:33:12.319
completely get what Ransom is saying here, and I think

586
00:33:12.319 --> 00:33:15.000
that's one of the amazing things about this episode is that,

587
00:33:15.039 --> 00:33:18.759
to me, you can argue this one either way. And

588
00:33:18.920 --> 00:33:22.160
probably be correct. I just tend to end up on

589
00:33:22.200 --> 00:33:24.359
the side of the minions on this one because I

590
00:33:24.440 --> 00:33:28.039
believe that Jane Way has the ability to always come

591
00:33:28.119 --> 00:33:31.200
up with that third option. Ransom may not have that ability,

592
00:33:31.200 --> 00:33:34.200
and maybe that's his failing as a captain, But in

593
00:33:34.240 --> 00:33:37.680
this case, I think he was wrong to kill these beings.

594
00:33:38.680 --> 00:33:40.880
They don't say how many he has already killed, but

595
00:33:40.920 --> 00:33:43.880
they say he needs to kill another sixty three to

596
00:33:43.960 --> 00:33:47.480
make it happen. So anyway, that's my take on it.

597
00:33:47.519 --> 00:33:48.880
I'd love to hear what you guys have to say,

598
00:33:48.920 --> 00:33:51.920
because to me, this one does not have a cut

599
00:33:51.960 --> 00:33:54.799
and dry correct answer to it.

600
00:33:54.839 --> 00:33:57.599
Isn't it strange how both pole questions came from Voyager

601
00:33:57.640 --> 00:33:58.039
this week?

602
00:33:58.720 --> 00:34:01.599
I love it and has so many of these great

603
00:34:01.640 --> 00:34:05.160
ethical debates within it, as does Next Generation and a lot.

604
00:34:04.960 --> 00:34:06.000
Of good Star Trek.

605
00:34:06.039 --> 00:34:08.039
But yeah, yeah, I kind of like how they're both

606
00:34:08.119 --> 00:34:09.239
Voyager based this week.

607
00:34:09.760 --> 00:34:13.159
Well, so Massette said in the last clip that humans

608
00:34:13.159 --> 00:34:16.639
had no problem experimenting on animals, right, we heard him

609
00:34:16.639 --> 00:34:19.920
say that. We also, as Eric just said, we have

610
00:34:19.960 --> 00:34:24.360
no problem eating hamburgers and bacon and whatnot. So you

611
00:34:24.360 --> 00:34:27.559
know or you know any and you know meat for

612
00:34:27.599 --> 00:34:28.079
that where.

613
00:34:27.960 --> 00:34:31.599
Carnivore do animals, well.

614
00:34:31.519 --> 00:34:35.400
There there are places where they eat dog, so there

615
00:34:35.400 --> 00:34:38.760
are and horses, I mean, so yeah, so we're not

616
00:34:38.880 --> 00:34:44.679
above that. But rabbits, squirrels, you know. But in the Federation,

617
00:34:45.079 --> 00:34:49.960
I don't think they do that anymore.

618
00:34:50.239 --> 00:34:52.920
I think everything is they don't kill animals to eat.

619
00:34:52.920 --> 00:34:57.760
It's replicated. So we've advanced. So so in the world

620
00:34:57.760 --> 00:35:01.239
of Star Trek, that's not happening and anymore. But we're

621
00:35:01.280 --> 00:35:04.000
answering this question as we're sitting here today right now, right.

622
00:35:04.039 --> 00:35:06.159
We're not pretending that we're in the future, right, We're

623
00:35:06.199 --> 00:35:08.960
answering it as if it was us. Right, So as

624
00:35:09.000 --> 00:35:11.199
if it was us, I would say, yeah, I think

625
00:35:11.239 --> 00:35:14.320
that a ransom was on the right track because these

626
00:35:14.320 --> 00:35:17.280
animal these are just animals, no different than a cow

627
00:35:17.360 --> 00:35:19.639
or pig, or a rabbit or a deer.

628
00:35:21.039 --> 00:35:22.920
But do we know that do we know that they're

629
00:35:22.920 --> 00:35:23.559
not sentient?

630
00:35:23.920 --> 00:35:27.039
Well, we know we don't. We don't know that they

631
00:35:27.079 --> 00:35:30.880
that they were. We don't know that they aren't. If

632
00:35:31.159 --> 00:35:33.679
if they are, it changes everything. But if they aren't,

633
00:35:33.679 --> 00:35:38.360
it's no different than killing a cow making hamburger, you know, basically,

634
00:35:38.760 --> 00:35:40.440
So you know you can go either way.

635
00:35:41.159 --> 00:35:44.199
A cow is sentient. All these animals you're talking about

636
00:35:44.199 --> 00:35:47.199
eating are sentient, right, They just don't have what we

637
00:35:47.280 --> 00:35:52.119
recognize as the civilization. Right, they're all sentient beings. If

638
00:35:52.159 --> 00:35:54.480
you say that, you can't wouldn't that everything would be

639
00:35:54.559 --> 00:35:58.079
different if they were sentient, then then you would be

640
00:35:58.440 --> 00:36:02.360
committing genocide, not being a vegetarian, and a lot of

641
00:36:02.360 --> 00:36:04.880
people would hold up that concept there. So it's not

642
00:36:04.920 --> 00:36:09.159
just sentience, right, because we you know, obliterate sentient beings

643
00:36:09.159 --> 00:36:11.079
all the time. You know, oh my god, it's a

644
00:36:11.079 --> 00:36:13.000
spider on the counter, I'm gonna kill it. That's a

645
00:36:13.039 --> 00:36:13.760
sentient being.

646
00:36:14.360 --> 00:36:19.280
Well, in the sense of measure of it is consciousness.

647
00:36:19.280 --> 00:36:22.280
It has thoughts, its will as emotions, right, I mean yeah,

648
00:36:22.480 --> 00:36:24.960
I mean not maybe not an insect, but but you know,

649
00:36:25.079 --> 00:36:28.280
but a mouse, for example, it has emotions, right, it does.

650
00:36:28.320 --> 00:36:31.320
It's a sentient being. A whale has a sentience, right.

651
00:36:31.360 --> 00:36:35.559
But it's just we choose to be very It's all

652
00:36:35.559 --> 00:36:38.000
about convenience for us as a species who were willing

653
00:36:38.039 --> 00:36:40.119
to kill, right, I mean, that is the history of

654
00:36:40.679 --> 00:36:41.639
human civilization.

655
00:36:43.679 --> 00:36:47.079
Well, I'm I'm wondering, Paul. So one of the ways

656
00:36:47.159 --> 00:36:50.199
that I, in my own personal life have started to

657
00:36:50.320 --> 00:36:54.599
define sentiences, and for better or worse, is by some

658
00:36:54.639 --> 00:36:57.480
of the principles set up in that amazing Next Generation

659
00:36:57.559 --> 00:37:00.800
episode Measure of a Man. And I don't think that

660
00:37:02.480 --> 00:37:06.440
consciousness and emotions are the line in the sand that

661
00:37:06.519 --> 00:37:09.199
sort of takes you from sentient to non sentient. Right,

662
00:37:09.280 --> 00:37:13.079
It's the it's the ability to understand who you are.

663
00:37:13.679 --> 00:37:18.239
It's the ability to make decisions based on empathy and

664
00:37:18.280 --> 00:37:21.840
that sort of stuff. I think that that that episode

665
00:37:21.920 --> 00:37:24.920
kind of helps us define, you know, at least in

666
00:37:24.960 --> 00:37:28.760
a secular humanist kind of way, what sentience is. And

667
00:37:28.800 --> 00:37:31.159
I would I would I would argue that a spider

668
00:37:31.239 --> 00:37:35.320
is not sentient, you know, I don't. I don't know

669
00:37:35.360 --> 00:37:40.159
that a spider understands other spiders, or that there's another

670
00:37:40.239 --> 00:37:46.719
creature there, or that it's you know, actions have consequences

671
00:37:46.840 --> 00:37:47.800
or that kind of stuff.

672
00:37:48.559 --> 00:37:51.239
It depends on what what you ascribed to, right. A

673
00:37:51.239 --> 00:37:54.360
Buddhist would say that all life is worth preserving, right

674
00:37:54.519 --> 00:37:58.119
that Like if you mean, I have a difficult time

675
00:37:58.239 --> 00:38:00.719
killing bugs in my house, right, so I tend to

676
00:38:00.920 --> 00:38:03.360
catch them in a jar and let them go, right,

677
00:38:03.440 --> 00:38:06.639
Because it's like, you know, it's always like, what end

678
00:38:06.679 --> 00:38:09.599
of the spectrum are you on? Right, some gigantic being

679
00:38:09.840 --> 00:38:13.239
came to Earth, and from their perspective, I'm the spider.

680
00:38:13.360 --> 00:38:16.840
I'd like to be let go, don't squish me, right,

681
00:38:16.880 --> 00:38:18.800
I'd like and I'd like, and not just because I'm

682
00:38:18.800 --> 00:38:22.400
perceived as being this insignificant little thing. I'd like to

683
00:38:22.440 --> 00:38:25.280
be given the benefit of the doubt that my existence manners,

684
00:38:26.159 --> 00:38:28.360
you know. But it's this, this whole thing with Ransom

685
00:38:28.679 --> 00:38:32.400
is really challenging because correct me if I'm wrong, right,

686
00:38:32.440 --> 00:38:37.159
But it's the equinox is the ship. Yeah, their ship

687
00:38:37.199 --> 00:38:39.880
is marooned out into the delta quadrit, just like the

688
00:38:40.000 --> 00:38:43.239
Voyager is, right, correct. So in that situation, I think,

689
00:38:43.719 --> 00:38:48.159
you know, ethics become a lot less important. I think

690
00:38:48.159 --> 00:38:51.000
when it's the struggle for survival for people, at least,

691
00:38:51.000 --> 00:38:53.079
that's the history of mankind.

692
00:38:53.159 --> 00:38:53.239
Right.

693
00:38:53.280 --> 00:38:55.760
If you have a bunch of folks and it's the

694
00:38:56.400 --> 00:38:58.639
it's the nineteenth century, and they're in the middle of

695
00:38:58.679 --> 00:39:02.199
the Canadian Yukon, right, and they're like, you know, a

696
00:39:02.320 --> 00:39:06.880
dozen people trying to get through the winter in a fort, right,

697
00:39:06.960 --> 00:39:10.639
and it's you know, twenty degrees below zero, but there's

698
00:39:10.639 --> 00:39:16.440
buffalo nearby is you know, rabbits nearby, Right, They're going

699
00:39:16.519 --> 00:39:20.400
to kill those animals to survive without compunction, right, because

700
00:39:20.400 --> 00:39:24.480
it's all a question of the circumstances are so dire,

701
00:39:25.159 --> 00:39:27.760
you know, all of a sudden, these high minded ethical

702
00:39:27.800 --> 00:39:30.360
things go out the window when it's a question of survival.

703
00:39:30.400 --> 00:39:32.159
And I think that's kind of where Ransom seems like

704
00:39:32.199 --> 00:39:34.079
he's coming from that clip. I mean, I could only

705
00:39:34.119 --> 00:39:36.320
hear it, I couldn't see it, but he seems like

706
00:39:36.400 --> 00:39:38.320
he's coming from this point of like, hey, this is

707
00:39:38.360 --> 00:39:42.880
do or die. There's survival mode here. Yeah.

708
00:39:42.920 --> 00:39:46.079
Yeah, I was not aware that starf That was the

709
00:39:46.079 --> 00:39:49.280
first time I ever heard when Ransom said Starfleet has

710
00:39:49.320 --> 00:39:52.199
a mandate that captains can do anything they deem necessary.

711
00:39:52.239 --> 00:39:56.559
I don't remember ever hearing that anywhere except from Ransom

712
00:39:56.559 --> 00:39:58.480
in this episode, So that that's the new.

713
00:39:58.400 --> 00:40:01.400
One one, and he may be taking a liberal interpretation

714
00:40:01.719 --> 00:40:04.239
of that rule, but I think I think the rule

715
00:40:04.400 --> 00:40:09.719
is basically like safety of your crew is your number

716
00:40:09.760 --> 00:40:13.039
one prerogative as the captain of the ship, and so

717
00:40:13.079 --> 00:40:16.079
I think he's kind of extending that a little bit

718
00:40:16.519 --> 00:40:19.159
here in that statement that he said, you know, we

719
00:40:19.239 --> 00:40:21.920
can do anything to save our crew. I'm not sure

720
00:40:22.000 --> 00:40:25.280
that's specifically true. I haven't read the Federation charter.

721
00:40:25.199 --> 00:40:30.159
But that's maybe not specifically true.

722
00:40:30.480 --> 00:40:34.360
Well, Tim Russ told us a very similar answer when

723
00:40:34.400 --> 00:40:37.400
you asked him about two X. I did, yeah, and

724
00:40:37.559 --> 00:40:40.239
Tim Russ basically said the same thing. It's the captain's

725
00:40:40.239 --> 00:40:44.840
responsibility to save the crew at all costs. Well, that's paraphrasing,

726
00:40:44.880 --> 00:40:48.199
but he said something very similar to that. Yeah, so

727
00:40:48.679 --> 00:40:49.599
maybe that is a thing.

728
00:40:49.639 --> 00:40:52.599
And I nodded and agreed because it was Tim Russ.

729
00:40:52.599 --> 00:41:00.960
But I didn't feel like, yeah.

730
00:41:00.760 --> 00:41:03.679
You might have to do a evil captain one day.

731
00:41:03.920 --> 00:41:04.960
Yeah, evil captain.

732
00:41:05.199 --> 00:41:07.000
Well, and so that's a great question.

733
00:41:07.079 --> 00:41:09.000
Like I don't want to like spend too much time

734
00:41:09.000 --> 00:41:11.320
on this, but like that's a great question. Is Ransom

735
00:41:11.440 --> 00:41:13.440
and evil captain? Because of what he did?

736
00:41:13.519 --> 00:41:13.719
Right?

737
00:41:13.920 --> 00:41:16.559
I just I think we could debate that for like

738
00:41:16.599 --> 00:41:19.159
twenty minutes and nobody would.

739
00:41:18.920 --> 00:41:19.719
Be right or wrong.

740
00:41:20.679 --> 00:41:23.000
That's what That's why this episode is so amazed. It's

741
00:41:23.039 --> 00:41:25.599
like one of the top like ten Voyager episodes ever

742
00:41:25.719 --> 00:41:26.159
for sure.

743
00:41:26.760 --> 00:41:30.800
Yeah, if I remember the episode correctly, didn't Ransom come

744
00:41:30.840 --> 00:41:34.079
around at the end and sacrifice himself to so voyager

745
00:41:34.079 --> 00:41:38.840
could escape or something he did, I remember correctly, Yeah,

746
00:41:39.440 --> 00:41:41.880
and he sent his crew on the voyager so that

747
00:41:41.920 --> 00:41:42.440
they would.

748
00:41:42.320 --> 00:41:46.400
Survive, which was the third option, right, something like that.

749
00:41:46.760 --> 00:41:49.800
Yeah, So Paul, what what did you hide with the

750
00:41:49.880 --> 00:41:51.360
minions or against.

751
00:41:52.639 --> 00:41:53.800
You know, I'm not really sure.

752
00:41:55.840 --> 00:41:57.599
That's what's so great about this question.

753
00:41:58.320 --> 00:42:02.119
I don't necessarily like just I've seen over the last

754
00:42:02.159 --> 00:42:04.559
few years the trouble we get into by aligning with

755
00:42:04.719 --> 00:42:08.800
sides and tribalism, and I'm trying to stay out of it, right,

756
00:42:08.880 --> 00:42:11.679
And there's just so much with these shows too. It's

757
00:42:11.719 --> 00:42:14.320
just like a lot of it fell as it reflects

758
00:42:14.360 --> 00:42:17.199
like the times that we live in. Right, It's just

759
00:42:17.239 --> 00:42:20.800
like pretty much right now, right, And we would say

760
00:42:20.800 --> 00:42:24.039
if like you asked, you know, I'm going to just

761
00:42:24.079 --> 00:42:27.360
pick a round number seventy eighty percent. Maybe most of

762
00:42:27.400 --> 00:42:29.440
us here, maybe we have different views of us on

763
00:42:29.880 --> 00:42:35.199
the trexperts. Right, are we throw capital punishment or are

764
00:42:35.199 --> 00:42:41.639
we against capital punishment? Do a lot of nodding, but.

765
00:42:41.679 --> 00:42:44.039
Yeah, no, I've against it.

766
00:42:44.119 --> 00:42:48.119
Yeah, right for a pole question. Yeah, but here's the thing, right,

767
00:42:48.519 --> 00:42:50.440
I think where we are right now in the last

768
00:42:50.480 --> 00:42:53.079
like say, twenty years, I think we're mostly against it,

769
00:42:53.119 --> 00:42:54.440
I think for the most part. And it's kind of

770
00:42:54.440 --> 00:42:58.960
shocking where against right. Go watch The Ultimate Computer though. Okay,

771
00:42:59.119 --> 00:43:03.159
when Kirk is trying to mind f with the M

772
00:43:03.239 --> 00:43:06.519
five to get it to shut itself down, right, and

773
00:43:06.519 --> 00:43:08.840
he goes in there and he's saying, you know, you've

774
00:43:08.880 --> 00:43:11.039
committed that. He says, scan the ships. Is there any

775
00:43:11.079 --> 00:43:11.800
life on board?

776
00:43:12.639 --> 00:43:12.880
Right?

777
00:43:13.000 --> 00:43:16.360
And he goes, no life, and he goes, you've committed murder.

778
00:43:16.400 --> 00:43:20.280
And then Kirk says, what is the penalty for murder?

779
00:43:21.960 --> 00:43:27.079
Like it's a universal thing? Right? And M five goes death, right, and.

780
00:43:27.000 --> 00:43:28.840
He says the times I mean.

781
00:43:29.480 --> 00:43:32.119
So apparently in whatever Kirk's era, right, and he goes,

782
00:43:32.119 --> 00:43:34.719
this unit must die and it kills itself. Right. Yeah, So,

783
00:43:35.320 --> 00:43:38.880
but in the sixties and in that you know, enlightened

784
00:43:38.960 --> 00:43:41.679
version of the Federation of Planets, right, apparently the capital

785
00:43:41.719 --> 00:43:45.159
punishment was still the law of the land everywhere, at

786
00:43:45.199 --> 00:43:47.800
least from Kirk's perspective. But you know, who knows. But

787
00:43:47.840 --> 00:43:49.880
it's just really interesting. I mean, you could just you know,

788
00:43:50.760 --> 00:43:53.480
dig a hole forever with these questions. It's crazy. We

789
00:43:54.440 --> 00:43:55.440
got Star Wars to talk.

790
00:43:55.360 --> 00:43:58.800
About in the episode in the Cage though in the

791
00:43:58.840 --> 00:44:03.239
episode the Cage, Admiral whatever his name was, says that

792
00:44:03.360 --> 00:44:06.679
the only death penalty left on the record on the

793
00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:08.719
books is visiting Tallows.

794
00:44:09.639 --> 00:44:13.960
That's right, that's right. A little contradictory, yeah, a little bit.

795
00:44:14.599 --> 00:44:17.039
So, David, I know you're chomping at the bit here.

796
00:44:17.079 --> 00:44:19.639
So what do you think with dominions against dominions? Where

797
00:44:19.679 --> 00:44:21.719
do you fall on the spectrum?

798
00:44:21.840 --> 00:44:26.039
I'm I'm kind of both. It really depends, really, honestly,

799
00:44:26.599 --> 00:44:28.039
I would go off in the long thing, but we

800
00:44:28.159 --> 00:44:30.920
got to always talk about so I'm kind of in

801
00:44:30.960 --> 00:44:33.599
the middle. It really depends on the situation. I mean,

802
00:44:33.639 --> 00:44:36.840
just think of looking at Ransomtive. He thought he was

803
00:44:36.840 --> 00:44:39.039
the only one in the delta quiet, no help from home,

804
00:44:39.199 --> 00:44:41.559
no help him anywhere, and so he just thought what

805
00:44:41.679 --> 00:44:44.119
he had to do with best. So yeah, I would

806
00:44:44.559 --> 00:44:47.119
say that I'm kind of in the middle. It depends.

807
00:44:48.599 --> 00:44:51.119
All right, Well, let's swing out to the where the

808
00:44:51.159 --> 00:44:54.360
palm trees are swaying, and let's say what Charles has

809
00:44:54.360 --> 00:44:54.840
to say.

810
00:44:55.159 --> 00:44:56.840
I was going to say I was waiting to get

811
00:44:56.840 --> 00:45:01.719
a chance, uh okay, and kind of feeding a little

812
00:45:01.719 --> 00:45:04.960
bit off a pall At this point, He's like Okay,

813
00:45:05.119 --> 00:45:07.679
well there are some buffalo out there, we can eat them.

814
00:45:08.280 --> 00:45:10.599
Yes, you might eat them, but.

815
00:45:10.559 --> 00:45:16.440
Are you going to sacrifice the entire flock to overfeed

816
00:45:17.079 --> 00:45:18.480
the group past spring?

817
00:45:20.559 --> 00:45:20.639
No.

818
00:45:21.920 --> 00:45:26.480
Yes, he did kill one creature and it did help

819
00:45:26.719 --> 00:45:31.559
the ship survive. So maybe we sacrificed one or two

820
00:45:31.599 --> 00:45:34.719
creatures to keep the ship a lot she to keep

821
00:45:34.760 --> 00:45:38.480
the ship alive and keep the crew alive, not sacrifice

822
00:45:38.519 --> 00:45:44.599
a population to save yourself. Yes, we sit there and

823
00:45:44.639 --> 00:45:47.840
we do eat cows, but we also help in the

824
00:45:47.920 --> 00:45:51.639
reproductive style of bringing more cows in, so there's a

825
00:45:51.679 --> 00:45:55.960
constant amount of cows in existence. We're no longer doing

826
00:45:56.000 --> 00:46:00.840
it where we're a society trying to put a put

827
00:46:00.920 --> 00:46:05.239
an animal to extinction just to keep just for our

828
00:46:05.280 --> 00:46:09.800
survival and food. We keep that going, so we're not

829
00:46:09.920 --> 00:46:12.480
just we're not killing him to extinction. We're just killing

830
00:46:12.519 --> 00:46:17.400
them and maintaining stocks so we can keep the society living.

831
00:46:19.639 --> 00:46:22.239
So yes, I can understand where you may be sacrificed

832
00:46:22.320 --> 00:46:30.119
one or two but survive. Sacrificing dozens hundreds trying to

833
00:46:30.159 --> 00:46:32.800
make sure you can get home faster, I think was

834
00:46:33.519 --> 00:46:38.239
not was unethical. Yes, he thinks he's saving his crew,

835
00:46:38.360 --> 00:46:44.320
but he's sacrificing a society to save himself. So I

836
00:46:44.360 --> 00:46:46.320
agree with the minions on this one. He did make

837
00:46:46.360 --> 00:46:47.280
the wrong choice.

838
00:46:49.960 --> 00:46:52.480
Well, there you have it. See, sometimes I can pick

839
00:46:52.480 --> 00:46:53.400
a pretty good question.

840
00:46:54.159 --> 00:46:56.639
Yeah, I'm telling you, man, we could talk for an

841
00:46:56.679 --> 00:46:58.280
hour about this topic right now.

842
00:46:58.320 --> 00:46:59.760
It's it's so good.

843
00:47:00.360 --> 00:47:03.320
Well, but we have to check out the force, as

844
00:47:03.320 --> 00:47:05.960
my shirt said right here, and we have to have

845
00:47:06.039 --> 00:47:08.960
and I'm excited to talk about about this bunch. And

846
00:47:09.000 --> 00:47:11.320
we're going to have Paul jump in and give us

847
00:47:11.360 --> 00:47:14.039
a recap like we like we always do before we

848
00:47:14.440 --> 00:47:18.000
start our conversation. So the Mike and George, Paul, well, the.

849
00:47:18.039 --> 00:47:20.360
Gym, I'd like to I'd very much like to do that,

850
00:47:20.440 --> 00:47:23.280
and I will. I will, But there's a little bit

851
00:47:23.320 --> 00:47:26.079
of a wrinkle has emerged before we do a recap

852
00:47:26.079 --> 00:47:29.360
of the episodes. So if with your indulgence, gentlemen, I'd

853
00:47:29.360 --> 00:47:32.320
like to acknowledge this wrinkle. Well, it's not really up

854
00:47:32.360 --> 00:47:36.719
to me. It's up to the person who's asking me

855
00:47:36.800 --> 00:47:40.400
to do this, if that's okay. But I have been

856
00:47:40.440 --> 00:47:47.719
recently visited by ISB Lieutenant dedram Miro, and dedram Miro

857
00:47:47.840 --> 00:47:52.599
has got a problem okay. She's very unhappy with how

858
00:47:52.639 --> 00:47:56.239
we left things last week, right, and she feels that

859
00:47:56.519 --> 00:48:00.719
before we go in and do a full on assessm

860
00:48:00.840 --> 00:48:04.199
or you know, summary of this next batch of episodes,

861
00:48:05.400 --> 00:48:07.400
she just wants to make sure that Uncle Jim is

862
00:48:07.480 --> 00:48:11.280
okay because she feels that Uncle Jim was, you know,

863
00:48:11.519 --> 00:48:14.280
kind of had a very bad initial reaction to the

864
00:48:14.320 --> 00:48:18.280
first batch of episodes last week. And so before we continue,

865
00:48:18.840 --> 00:48:21.519
Lieutenant Miro has asked me to find out how did you,

866
00:48:22.159 --> 00:48:25.480
generally speaking without going all the way deeper and having

867
00:48:25.760 --> 00:48:28.400
more time to talk later, Jim, how did you feel

868
00:48:28.400 --> 00:48:31.480
about this next batch of episodes? Did you were you

869
00:48:31.519 --> 00:48:36.000
a little bit more? We're we're curious.

870
00:48:36.159 --> 00:48:38.960
Well, I'm waiting for you to do your recap, and

871
00:48:39.000 --> 00:48:40.880
I'm going to go first, I know, but we're we're.

872
00:48:40.719 --> 00:48:43.039
Kind of mixing that up. I got some feedback from

873
00:48:43.039 --> 00:48:45.559
other people in the ISD saying we were going to

874
00:48:45.639 --> 00:48:49.440
avoid uh, you know, last word on the subject syndrome.

875
00:48:49.480 --> 00:48:51.039
So just give us a hint. We want a movie

876
00:48:51.119 --> 00:48:53.920
trailer of your reactions. Are you feeling a little better?

877
00:48:56.480 --> 00:48:57.159
Well not so much?

878
00:48:57.480 --> 00:49:00.079
Yeah, no, no, I I want to share what I

879
00:49:00.119 --> 00:49:03.079
have to say for the review but I was. I've

880
00:49:03.119 --> 00:49:07.159
watched these these last three a couple of times, so

881
00:49:07.360 --> 00:49:10.440
that's a good thing. And I was, so I was

882
00:49:10.480 --> 00:49:14.320
so enamored that I actually watched the next three as well. So,

883
00:49:14.760 --> 00:49:16.119
and that's all I'm going to say about it.

884
00:49:16.719 --> 00:49:19.079
Okay, good because dedram Merrow has a gun to my

885
00:49:19.119 --> 00:49:21.599
head and if I did not do this, I was

886
00:49:21.679 --> 00:49:23.639
going to get in a lot of trouble. This is

887
00:49:23.679 --> 00:49:24.360
not someone you.

888
00:49:24.320 --> 00:49:25.320
Want to want to do that.

889
00:49:25.400 --> 00:49:30.960
You know. She's very strict. Okay, all right, So I

890
00:49:30.960 --> 00:49:32.480
just want to get that out of the way, you know,

891
00:49:32.559 --> 00:49:35.599
because you know, this show is no good unless you

892
00:49:35.760 --> 00:49:37.880
Every now and then something happens that you didn't expect.

893
00:49:38.000 --> 00:49:41.159
So I think that's you know, that's why these things happened.

894
00:49:41.239 --> 00:49:43.679
So you never know who's going to pop by. So

895
00:49:43.840 --> 00:49:46.679
we're talking about tonight, guys, real quickly. We'll just kind

896
00:49:46.679 --> 00:49:48.840
of blow through here. We're talking about season two of

897
00:49:49.039 --> 00:49:51.440
and Orm, and we've already talked about episodes one, two,

898
00:49:51.480 --> 00:49:54.559
and three. So we're moving into the second arc, the

899
00:49:54.599 --> 00:49:58.400
second year, if you will, three b B Y, three

900
00:49:58.559 --> 00:50:01.840
years before the Battle of the avon right, and we're

901
00:50:01.880 --> 00:50:05.199
talking about the next the second arc of this season,

902
00:50:05.519 --> 00:50:08.639
which is episodes four, five, and six. Okay, just to

903
00:50:08.800 --> 00:50:11.559
make sure we get there, So a little time passes

904
00:50:11.599 --> 00:50:15.440
between these three episode arcs every single pass so a

905
00:50:15.480 --> 00:50:18.760
little time has passed. And we now see that Cassian

906
00:50:18.800 --> 00:50:22.519
and bis are they're like living together, right, and they're

907
00:50:22.599 --> 00:50:26.159
kind of between missions, and Bix is having a rough go. Okay,

908
00:50:26.280 --> 00:50:28.800
she's having a lot of nightmares. There are a lot

909
00:50:28.840 --> 00:50:32.079
of references between them to this mission that they were

910
00:50:32.119 --> 00:50:35.000
on that we never really see, but this happened during

911
00:50:35.039 --> 00:50:38.519
this interim period right where they had to kill an

912
00:50:38.559 --> 00:50:42.239
imperial soldier, right, And she's kind of having a hard

913
00:50:42.239 --> 00:50:45.639
time coping with that. It's not doing her any favors,

914
00:50:45.679 --> 00:50:50.079
and she's asking herself is she any better than her

915
00:50:50.159 --> 00:50:54.840
torturer from season one, right, doctor Gorrist Right. And Cassian

916
00:50:54.960 --> 00:50:56.840
is also having a hard time struggling with how it

917
00:50:56.880 --> 00:50:59.079
is to be normal. Right. At one point, they go

918
00:50:59.199 --> 00:51:03.159
shopping just like you know, practically Travis Bickle, Right, he's

919
00:51:03.239 --> 00:51:04.880
just like, you're talking to me, what do you want?

920
00:51:04.960 --> 00:51:07.280
He's just like he's on edge, right, He's just completely

921
00:51:07.800 --> 00:51:09.679
there's a lot of friction between the two of them

922
00:51:09.880 --> 00:51:13.079
that we see. Things aren't necessarily going that well, and

923
00:51:13.159 --> 00:51:14.800
we really are spending a lot more time on the

924
00:51:14.840 --> 00:51:19.599
planet Gorman now, where Cyril has been promoted there and

925
00:51:19.639 --> 00:51:21.440
he's supposed to figure out a way to worm his

926
00:51:21.480 --> 00:51:24.880
way into the Gorman resistance. Right. He knows that he's

927
00:51:24.960 --> 00:51:28.599
being observed by the Gorman Front there to see how

928
00:51:28.639 --> 00:51:31.039
he's behaving, right, so he does a lot of these

929
00:51:31.079 --> 00:51:34.400
theatrical things to sort of prove himself, right, and the

930
00:51:34.480 --> 00:51:37.440
Gormans approach him and they invite him to a meeting.

931
00:51:37.480 --> 00:51:40.760
And the Gormans, the Gorman Front are very much like

932
00:51:40.840 --> 00:51:44.199
the French Resistance during World War Two. Okay, they're very

933
00:51:44.239 --> 00:51:46.599
stylized like that in terms of the clothing that they wear,

934
00:51:46.920 --> 00:51:49.679
and at one point they're even speaking their language, which

935
00:51:49.800 --> 00:51:52.519
they do in a very French style, which is really

936
00:51:52.559 --> 00:51:56.199
really interesting. Right, And so Cyril's running back and he

937
00:51:56.320 --> 00:52:01.840
reports to Dedra and we learned that the city council

938
00:52:01.880 --> 00:52:05.800
members there in Gorman are are part of this Gorman

939
00:52:05.840 --> 00:52:10.440
Front resistance movement. Meanwhile, back over on Corussant, right, man

940
00:52:10.559 --> 00:52:13.559
Mathma is really getting a look at how dysfunctional the

941
00:52:13.599 --> 00:52:17.320
Senate is. This is all post wedding, right, and there

942
00:52:17.320 --> 00:52:21.000
are she confides to her husband and their limma. Right,

943
00:52:21.000 --> 00:52:24.519
there's more celebratory banquets being given by new senators than

944
00:52:24.559 --> 00:52:30.079
there is actual work being done in the Senate. Sounds familiar.

945
00:52:30.199 --> 00:52:31.880
A lot of a lot of the things on and

946
00:52:32.039 --> 00:52:35.400
ors sound familiar in real life. Right, So she's kind

947
00:52:35.400 --> 00:52:37.480
of really getting the point where I think there's a

948
00:52:37.519 --> 00:52:40.480
tipping point coming for her. Right. Meanwhile, we go to

949
00:52:40.519 --> 00:52:43.320
the planet to car and old favorite from Rogue one.

950
00:52:43.400 --> 00:52:45.840
We really get a good look here at our buddy

951
00:52:45.880 --> 00:52:51.880
Sawguerera again, right, And Wilman is now with Sawgerera. Wilman,

952
00:52:51.920 --> 00:52:54.000
who we knew from the Farm Planet the first three

953
00:52:54.000 --> 00:52:57.519
episode of our he's with sar Guerrera and he's helping

954
00:52:57.519 --> 00:53:00.960
them learn how to harvest this incredibly highly volatile rocket

955
00:53:00.960 --> 00:53:06.840
fuel called rydonium. Right, And saws partisans are a bad

956
00:53:06.920 --> 00:53:09.159
batch of folks, right, They are just look like they're

957
00:53:09.159 --> 00:53:12.360
completely unhinged. Rydonium will do things to you if you

958
00:53:12.440 --> 00:53:15.719
breathe too much of it. Right, And I think when

959
00:53:15.719 --> 00:53:20.000
everybody saw Rogue one, right, and we saw Sagerera with

960
00:53:20.039 --> 00:53:22.400
his breathing mask, we just assumed he had like some

961
00:53:22.679 --> 00:53:26.360
problem that he was breathing oxygen to help him breathe better.

962
00:53:26.480 --> 00:53:28.800
I don't think that's the case now. I think he's

963
00:53:28.840 --> 00:53:31.440
taking hits of Rye doonium that he's kind of hooked

964
00:53:31.480 --> 00:53:33.440
on it, right. I think you have to almost look

965
00:53:33.440 --> 00:53:35.960
at rogue one a completely different way now based on

966
00:53:36.039 --> 00:53:38.039
his behavior. But we'll talk more about that in a

967
00:53:38.079 --> 00:53:41.760
subsequent episode. In just a couple of minutes. Meanwhile, amongst

968
00:53:41.800 --> 00:53:46.159
the ISB, their undercover agent Lannie Is Lannie Young is

969
00:53:46.159 --> 00:53:51.360
building trust with a Deadro's former assistant, right, And he

970
00:53:51.480 --> 00:53:55.480
tells Luthen right when he goes back and reports to

971
00:53:55.559 --> 00:53:57.639
Luthan Rail because this is this guy who's like in

972
00:53:57.679 --> 00:54:01.079
the ISB, but he's also like undercover for the rebels, right,

973
00:54:01.119 --> 00:54:03.920
And he tells Luthen that Dedra has been tasked with

974
00:54:03.960 --> 00:54:10.280
taking over Gorman right again this planet, And so Luthen

975
00:54:10.480 --> 00:54:14.920
asked Cassian to go there, and he leaves Bix by

976
00:54:14.960 --> 00:54:18.880
herself in her apartment, where she starts resorting to self

977
00:54:18.920 --> 00:54:21.679
medication if you will, to sort of deal with the

978
00:54:21.719 --> 00:54:25.360
PTSD of everything she's been going through. So that, my friends,

979
00:54:25.559 --> 00:54:28.760
is the first of these three episodes ever been to Gorman.

980
00:54:29.000 --> 00:54:31.000
Should I keep going? Go to the next two? Do

981
00:54:31.119 --> 00:54:36.079
it all? Right. Episode two is called I Have Friends Everywhere, right,

982
00:54:36.199 --> 00:54:40.320
and things are starting to get crazy. While Cassian is

983
00:54:40.519 --> 00:54:43.639
out on Gorman, Luthen checks in on Bis right to

984
00:54:43.679 --> 00:54:45.599
see what she's up to. He was originally thinking about

985
00:54:45.599 --> 00:54:50.119
giving her a mission, but he's checking in while Cassian's away,

986
00:54:50.199 --> 00:54:52.760
and he's not happy to see her, you know, kind

987
00:54:52.760 --> 00:54:55.960
of blitzed out on drugs, watching endless episodes of Good

988
00:54:55.960 --> 00:54:59.760
Morning Gorizon, right, which is pretty hilarious the way it's depicted, right,

989
00:55:00.400 --> 00:55:03.400
but realistic, right, I mean it's like the Fox News

990
00:55:03.440 --> 00:55:09.159
of Corroussant essentially. So back on Gorman, Cyril stages this

991
00:55:09.320 --> 00:55:12.039
dramatic confrontation with the ISB for the benefit of all

992
00:55:12.079 --> 00:55:18.239
the potential Gorman front rebels who might be watching him, right,

993
00:55:18.519 --> 00:55:24.719
and then they convince Cyril to give them the delivery

994
00:55:24.800 --> 00:55:28.440
schedule of all the Imperial supply vehicles to confirm that

995
00:55:28.519 --> 00:55:33.480
what's being built opposite the plaza is in fact an armory, right,

996
00:55:33.519 --> 00:55:35.440
which is what they're afraid of. Because there's a lot

997
00:55:35.440 --> 00:55:39.159
of references to what we've heard about outside of the

998
00:55:39.199 --> 00:55:43.400
movies and shows, but in the expanded universe, the original

999
00:55:43.440 --> 00:55:46.679
Gorman massacre, okay, which we've not seen. This is before

1000
00:55:46.760 --> 00:55:49.960
this time. There was a Gorman massacre years ago where

1001
00:55:50.000 --> 00:55:53.039
Grandma Tarkin landed. His imperial statists were on a whole

1002
00:55:53.039 --> 00:55:57.079
plaza full of you know, civilians killing everybody. Right, So

1003
00:55:57.119 --> 00:56:01.400
that's what that memorial is in the plaza, uh is

1004
00:56:01.440 --> 00:56:04.519
there to commemorate that. And the idea that their worst

1005
00:56:04.559 --> 00:56:08.760
fears is that the the Empire would be building an armory.

1006
00:56:08.840 --> 00:56:10.880
There is looking in the face of the it's like

1007
00:56:10.920 --> 00:56:12.639
a slap in the face, right, to build it right

1008
00:56:12.639 --> 00:56:13.280
in the face.

1009
00:56:13.079 --> 00:56:16.239
Of a shadow, Right, it'll put a shadow over the.

1010
00:56:16.199 --> 00:56:20.760
Momential, literal and figurative. Right. So it's so they're they're

1011
00:56:20.840 --> 00:56:24.239
very unhappy. And you know, Cyril is all excited to

1012
00:56:24.280 --> 00:56:30.440
be doing all the spycraft with his girlfriend, right deadra Right, Yeah,

1013
00:56:30.639 --> 00:56:34.000
I know, I know there is no Cyril action figure yet,

1014
00:56:34.039 --> 00:56:36.239
So okay, you're gonna have to talk to you know,

1015
00:56:36.320 --> 00:56:37.519
Steve Evans at Hasbro.

1016
00:56:37.719 --> 00:56:39.800
But I love that there's a dedro one though. That's

1017
00:56:39.840 --> 00:56:40.400
so cool.

1018
00:56:40.719 --> 00:56:43.119
I was so happy and they just nailed her. Right,

1019
00:56:43.239 --> 00:56:46.320
she's just you know, just looks passed. She's even got

1020
00:56:46.360 --> 00:56:48.440
the tight bun on the back of her head. She's

1021
00:56:48.519 --> 00:56:53.239
it's a really great, great figure. I was happy, so

1022
00:56:53.920 --> 00:56:57.000
Cassie and gets this false identity all set when he

1023
00:56:57.119 --> 00:57:00.039
visits Gorman, right, because Gorman is like the Milan of

1024
00:57:00.880 --> 00:57:04.280
the Galactic Empire. Right, It's where fashion is done, you know,

1025
00:57:04.320 --> 00:57:06.559
and everything like that. So he gets himself all dandied

1026
00:57:06.639 --> 00:57:10.719
up as like this fashion designer, this alternative, you know,

1027
00:57:10.800 --> 00:57:14.119
non threatening persona to infiltrate Gorman and find out what's

1028
00:57:14.119 --> 00:57:16.440
going on there. And he has a short moment with

1029
00:57:16.559 --> 00:57:19.840
the Bellhop at his hotel where the bell Hop talks

1030
00:57:19.840 --> 00:57:22.559
about his father saving him from that original Gorman massacre

1031
00:57:22.599 --> 00:57:24.760
that happened back in the day from mof Target, right.

1032
00:57:25.400 --> 00:57:29.320
And it's really interesting because at this point in his character,

1033
00:57:29.400 --> 00:57:33.280
our Cassian is really reluctant to take action. Right. He's

1034
00:57:33.360 --> 00:57:37.000
been very protective of Bicks. I think he's still reeling

1035
00:57:37.039 --> 00:57:39.679
from the Feriks massacre at the end of season one,

1036
00:57:40.039 --> 00:57:42.360
and he's playing it safe in everything he does. Right,

1037
00:57:42.400 --> 00:57:44.719
He's like, you know, he wants to make sure Bicks

1038
00:57:44.760 --> 00:57:48.559
doesn't get in harm's way. He's really constantly worried we

1039
00:57:48.639 --> 00:57:51.119
better not do this, or something bad is going to happen. Right,

1040
00:57:51.199 --> 00:57:53.199
and this starts you see this here when he first

1041
00:57:53.280 --> 00:57:56.000
meets with the Gorman Front, right, our French Revolution, French

1042
00:57:56.360 --> 00:58:00.800
Resistance vote, Right, he's chastising them for being too trusting. Right,

1043
00:58:01.920 --> 00:58:07.039
He's discouraging Carol Rylands and his daughter Enza, who are

1044
00:58:07.599 --> 00:58:10.679
you know, the main spearhead of the Gorman Front. He's

1045
00:58:10.760 --> 00:58:11.880
discouraging them.

1046
00:58:12.119 --> 00:58:12.320
Right.

1047
00:58:13.360 --> 00:58:16.559
They don't think that doing nothing though, is really an option,

1048
00:58:17.199 --> 00:58:19.760
as I can kind of relate to, right, But you know,

1049
00:58:19.880 --> 00:58:24.559
Cassie's basically saying, you know it's too risky, you're too trusting.

1050
00:58:25.440 --> 00:58:27.440
But you know, anything you do, as much as you

1051
00:58:27.519 --> 00:58:29.960
want to do anything, is playing into the Empire's hands.

1052
00:58:29.960 --> 00:58:32.480
And he's basically warning them they're looking to set you up,

1053
00:58:32.639 --> 00:58:37.559
which they are. Right. Meanwhile, back at ISB, Cyril gets

1054
00:58:37.559 --> 00:58:41.519
an enthusiastic good job from major party Gas. Right, it's

1055
00:58:41.559 --> 00:58:45.679
just hilarious. Cyril's all excited, goes to Dedro and he's like,

1056
00:58:45.719 --> 00:58:47.840
this is the greatest day of my life. Right, He's

1057
00:58:47.880 --> 00:58:51.840
actually being you know, acknowledged and appreciated for doing something,

1058
00:58:52.000 --> 00:58:54.320
even if it is nefarious deeds for the Empire.

1059
00:58:54.480 --> 00:58:54.639
Right.

1060
00:58:55.960 --> 00:59:02.000
So back with Sagerera, things again a little crazy over there, right,

1061
00:59:02.800 --> 00:59:06.079
Wilman is tasked with training one of sas partisans. Right,

1062
00:59:06.159 --> 00:59:09.679
a guy named Pluti on how to steal ridonium, right,

1063
00:59:09.760 --> 00:59:13.039
this high test bocket fuel. Right, and Pluti is just

1064
00:59:13.119 --> 00:59:16.519
a little last too many questions right there, And initially

1065
00:59:16.760 --> 00:59:19.719
it sounds like Saw might you know, when he gets

1066
00:59:19.760 --> 00:59:23.719
what he needs, kill Wilman, But Pluti just asked one

1067
00:59:23.760 --> 00:59:29.400
question too many, and so shockingly, Saw kills him instead,

1068
00:59:29.639 --> 00:59:33.239
and Wilman ends up having to perform the ridonium heist. Right.

1069
00:59:33.800 --> 00:59:40.639
And here is this amazing, amazing performance that we see here, right,

1070
00:59:40.679 --> 00:59:44.360
it's just phenomenal because we really see from Saguerera he

1071
00:59:44.480 --> 00:59:48.480
reveals just how crazy the ridonium gas has made him. Right,

1072
00:59:49.320 --> 00:59:52.159
He even refers to the gas as his sister. He

1073
00:59:52.239 --> 00:59:54.400
calls the gas his sister. And I don't know if

1074
00:59:54.440 --> 00:59:58.079
any of y'all have watched the Clone Wars episodes, right,

1075
00:59:58.199 --> 01:00:01.760
that animated series, which is wonderful, But we learn about

1076
01:00:01.920 --> 01:00:06.280
U Saw's early days, right, and his sister, his actual

1077
01:00:06.360 --> 01:00:11.199
sister named Stela, died during the Clone Wars. Right. She

1078
01:00:11.360 --> 01:00:14.159
was like his moral compass and he's never recovered from

1079
01:00:14.199 --> 01:00:17.760
losing her. And so now he's all high on rhydonium gas.

1080
01:00:17.800 --> 01:00:20.400
And he even thinks that the Gas is like his sister. Right,

1081
01:00:20.440 --> 01:00:25.920
he admits to being crazy, basically saying that revolution is

1082
01:00:25.960 --> 01:00:30.360
not for the same right because kind of akin to

1083
01:00:32.199 --> 01:00:36.960
what we've heard previously from Luth and rail Right, he

1084
01:00:37.239 --> 01:00:40.039
knows that he's going to be dead before the Empire

1085
01:00:40.119 --> 01:00:43.840
is defeated, and so his headspace is not in a

1086
01:00:43.880 --> 01:00:48.440
good place at all. But he's encouraging Wilman to do

1087
01:00:48.480 --> 01:00:52.280
the same thing. Breathe the Gas, join the Revolution, be

1088
01:00:52.440 --> 01:00:54.559
like me. I mean, it's like it's manic and it's

1089
01:00:54.559 --> 01:00:58.960
crazy and it's zelotry, and it shows how infectious that

1090
01:00:59.000 --> 01:01:03.400
stuff is. Fascinating scene. But man, Forrest is just on

1091
01:01:03.519 --> 01:01:06.000
fire there. I mean, I just love what he does.

1092
01:01:06.639 --> 01:01:08.559
Did you guys, like, well you we'll all say, but

1093
01:01:08.599 --> 01:01:11.159
I mean one of the best scenes so far. Would

1094
01:01:11.199 --> 01:01:11.519
you say?

1095
01:01:13.400 --> 01:01:13.639
Yeah?

1096
01:01:13.719 --> 01:01:17.599
I mean I didn't even know how to feel about him.

1097
01:01:17.800 --> 01:01:20.400
I mean, we'll talk more about this, but like, yeah,

1098
01:01:20.440 --> 01:01:22.719
it was so good that I was just kind of like, oh,

1099
01:01:22.760 --> 01:01:24.239
I love him, Oh I hate him?

1100
01:01:24.280 --> 01:01:25.800
God? Why is he such a dick? God?

1101
01:01:25.840 --> 01:01:28.320
Why is he so awesome? All at the same time.

1102
01:01:28.679 --> 01:01:39.280
Everybody on this show this season, right fix cassieon Wilmon saw.

1103
01:01:40.000 --> 01:01:43.079
Everybody has got so much trauma in their background, right

1104
01:01:43.079 --> 01:01:45.280
that they're recovering from. People are just trying to get

1105
01:01:45.320 --> 01:01:48.119
on and do something right. But it's just like, but

1106
01:01:48.360 --> 01:01:51.159
a real big theme within this is, you know, I think,

1107
01:01:51.760 --> 01:01:53.280
when have you had enough? And when do you have

1108
01:01:53.320 --> 01:01:56.360
to start blowing shit up right before it kills you? Right,

1109
01:01:56.400 --> 01:01:59.880
It's like you almost have to start committing these acts

1110
01:02:00.199 --> 01:02:03.559
going mad from not committing it. So it's a fascinating

1111
01:02:03.760 --> 01:02:06.480
you know, when is too much and too much a

1112
01:02:06.519 --> 01:02:08.719
dilemma that they find themselves in. So that's how that

1113
01:02:08.800 --> 01:02:12.559
second end episode ends, is with this craziness with roydonium Gas,

1114
01:02:12.559 --> 01:02:16.159
the Sagerera. Okay, come into the big number three here,

1115
01:02:16.239 --> 01:02:21.000
moving to the and again that episode, the second one

1116
01:02:21.079 --> 01:02:25.480
was called I Have Friends Everywhere, right, and we're talking

1117
01:02:25.480 --> 01:02:29.039
about spies and folks in the underground and resistance. So

1118
01:02:29.159 --> 01:02:32.079
let's move on to the third of these three episodes,

1119
01:02:32.400 --> 01:02:37.000
Wash a festive evening and things get nuts. Luthen meets

1120
01:02:37.039 --> 01:02:41.000
up with Cassian, right, and Cassian has been reluctant for

1121
01:02:41.119 --> 01:02:44.960
Gorman to do anything risky at all. He's been advising

1122
01:02:45.000 --> 01:02:48.599
them against doing things right, but Luthen's okay, with it,

1123
01:02:48.840 --> 01:02:55.440
and if something really bad happens to Gorman, he's probably

1124
01:02:55.639 --> 01:02:58.880
alright with that sacrifice because the bad things that happened

1125
01:02:58.920 --> 01:03:01.880
last season on Farahpherix is way on the boonies, right.

1126
01:03:01.960 --> 01:03:04.840
It's like, no one really cares if bad things happen

1127
01:03:04.920 --> 01:03:07.320
to Feryx, right because it's way out in the you know,

1128
01:03:08.599 --> 01:03:10.760
in the east Jesus right, no one's ever heard of it, right,

1129
01:03:11.039 --> 01:03:12.880
So it didn't make much of an impact. But if

1130
01:03:12.880 --> 01:03:16.719
something really bad happened on Gorman, you know, the fashion

1131
01:03:16.800 --> 01:03:22.000
capital of the Republic, right of the Empire, right, that

1132
01:03:22.079 --> 01:03:25.159
would really get people's attention. Right, So he's almost okay

1133
01:03:25.400 --> 01:03:28.800
that if really something bad happens with Gorman getting crushed,

1134
01:03:29.079 --> 01:03:32.159
because that planet is so prominent that they get hurt,

1135
01:03:32.199 --> 01:03:35.320
those larger outside systems are going to actually take notice

1136
01:03:35.320 --> 01:03:40.840
of the Empire's brutality. That is an ethical conundrum, I'm sure, right,

1137
01:03:40.920 --> 01:03:44.760
But he's willing to make these really brutal decisions for

1138
01:03:44.840 --> 01:03:48.639
the big picture win. So it's pretty crazy. So characters

1139
01:03:48.679 --> 01:03:50.920
we haven't seen for a while since season one, Vell

1140
01:03:51.039 --> 01:03:54.239
and Sinta. They are other rebellions who work a lot

1141
01:03:54.280 --> 01:03:57.199
with Cassian. So they are sent to work with Gorman

1142
01:03:57.840 --> 01:04:01.119
together because cass Scene is going to go back and

1143
01:04:01.159 --> 01:04:04.920
look after Bicks for a while, right, And when he does,

1144
01:04:05.119 --> 01:04:07.840
Kathine really gets in Luthern's face about checking it on

1145
01:04:07.880 --> 01:04:10.239
Bis behind his back, and there's a big confrontation that

1146
01:04:10.320 --> 01:04:14.599
goes on there. We get a very interesting scene back

1147
01:04:14.599 --> 01:04:17.960
at ISB where a major part of Gas is explaining

1148
01:04:18.000 --> 01:04:21.519
that doctor Gorst's torture methods are going to be expanded.

1149
01:04:22.039 --> 01:04:25.079
He's going to franchise Doctor Gorst like a McDonald's, right,

1150
01:04:25.199 --> 01:04:27.920
and the torture is going to be happening everywhere. And

1151
01:04:28.480 --> 01:04:31.400
there's this wonderful scene where one of the you know,

1152
01:04:31.679 --> 01:04:35.440
the younger Imperials, is all excited, Oh so this this

1153
01:04:35.599 --> 01:04:39.119
job is it's an honor. It's just it's one of

1154
01:04:39.159 --> 01:04:44.159
the best lines of the season. It's like it's an assignment.

1155
01:04:44.639 --> 01:04:46.360
Calibrate your enthusiasm.

1156
01:04:46.559 --> 01:04:48.599
I mean, that's a good line.

1157
01:04:49.079 --> 01:04:52.320
He's great. I love that. Calibrate your enthusiast. I want

1158
01:04:52.320 --> 01:04:52.920
a T shirt.

1159
01:04:53.280 --> 01:04:55.360
It's like bad. I feel like I need a T

1160
01:04:55.480 --> 01:04:56.199
shirt that has that.

1161
01:04:57.239 --> 01:05:00.760
I would wear it every day. So we're seeing that

1162
01:05:00.880 --> 01:05:03.280
Vell and Sinta, who are very much a couple, right,

1163
01:05:03.400 --> 01:05:07.800
Let's let's not hide that, right, they are really gonna

1164
01:05:07.800 --> 01:05:09.719
have to be involved with everything going on here with

1165
01:05:09.880 --> 01:05:14.480
the Gorman front there and all of those folks and

1166
01:05:14.519 --> 01:05:18.239
their resistance. Right, And they're talking about trying to make

1167
01:05:18.280 --> 01:05:20.800
their relationship more of a priority, while at the same

1168
01:05:20.880 --> 01:05:23.760
time realizing that Luthen sees they're worth more to him

1169
01:05:23.760 --> 01:05:28.239
separately than together. And that's never a line like, that's

1170
01:05:28.280 --> 01:05:33.719
never good news, right, So that's that's a bummer. Then

1171
01:05:33.760 --> 01:05:37.519
things get crazy. Luthen's assistant Claya, who helps him run

1172
01:05:37.559 --> 01:05:43.960
the gallery, right, his cover identity, right, Sculdon, who it's

1173
01:05:44.000 --> 01:05:45.840
hard to keep track of all these folks, I realize, right,

1174
01:05:45.840 --> 01:05:49.000
I'm stopping names like crazy. But you know, Sculden's the

1175
01:05:49.000 --> 01:05:53.000
one who is there, like the billionaire who mana. Mathma

1176
01:05:53.320 --> 01:05:56.719
had to do the arranged marriage with Scolden's son, right,

1177
01:05:56.719 --> 01:05:59.840
who I don't think has anything, is not interested in marriage.

1178
01:05:59.840 --> 01:06:04.800
But Skulden's like this big art patron, right, and he's

1179
01:06:04.960 --> 01:06:07.559
totally filthy, rich and modern. Mathma had to marry her

1180
01:06:07.639 --> 01:06:10.920
daughter off into that family. But Sculdon has now discovered

1181
01:06:10.960 --> 01:06:13.800
that somehow there's a fake in his art collection. Right,

1182
01:06:14.119 --> 01:06:18.599
How did he find out? Because the rebels, including Clea,

1183
01:06:18.880 --> 01:06:23.320
put a listening device in one of his art objects

1184
01:06:23.320 --> 01:06:25.800
in his collection, so they bugged his art collection to

1185
01:06:25.880 --> 01:06:28.960
learn more about him. Right. So now they're really into

1186
01:06:29.000 --> 01:06:33.280
trouble because Scolden's going to basically have all of his

1187
01:06:33.320 --> 01:06:36.159
shit examined right to see if there's other frauds in there,

1188
01:06:36.199 --> 01:06:38.079
and if he does, they're going to find that bug

1189
01:06:38.119 --> 01:06:40.400
that they planted. So they got to get that bug

1190
01:06:40.519 --> 01:06:42.880
out of one of those pieces during the middle of

1191
01:06:42.920 --> 01:06:46.639
Scolden's big art show full of imperial dignitaries. So it's

1192
01:06:46.679 --> 01:06:49.440
a little tense thing. So they have no other option

1193
01:06:49.559 --> 01:06:51.679
but to try to get the clay has to go

1194
01:06:51.719 --> 01:06:53.639
in there and remove the bug from this one piece

1195
01:06:53.679 --> 01:06:57.960
of art in plain sight. Yikes. A little bit of

1196
01:06:58.000 --> 01:07:00.920
a change here in terms of the lay of the

1197
01:07:01.000 --> 01:07:04.400
land in the Galactic Senate, right, because we have some

1198
01:07:04.519 --> 01:07:07.719
casting changes here from what we've seen previously in other

1199
01:07:09.000 --> 01:07:13.119
Star Wars prequels, right, and other aspects of the show.

1200
01:07:13.599 --> 01:07:18.519
In the past, Bail Organa, Senator Laya Organa's father was

1201
01:07:18.519 --> 01:07:21.840
always played by Jimmy Smiths, but that's had a situation

1202
01:07:21.880 --> 01:07:24.679
had to recast the role, right because Jimmy Smith is

1203
01:07:24.719 --> 01:07:27.719
doing like a Dexter reboot and he's he's just they

1204
01:07:27.719 --> 01:07:29.800
couldn't work out the scheduling as much as they want to,

1205
01:07:29.840 --> 01:07:34.440
so they cast Benjamin Bratt now to replace him as

1206
01:07:34.480 --> 01:07:37.360
bail Organa. And I think they've handled it just fine.

1207
01:07:37.480 --> 01:07:39.480
I think it's just one of those things that happens, right.

1208
01:07:39.599 --> 01:07:43.159
Creative stuff is difficult. Actors have lots of jobs scheduling

1209
01:07:43.159 --> 01:07:45.400
as well, and I think they made a great choice.

1210
01:07:45.719 --> 01:07:49.679
And I think Benjamin Bratt is now bail Organa, so

1211
01:07:49.800 --> 01:07:51.440
we'll get used to him in this role for a

1212
01:07:51.440 --> 01:07:53.760
bit so and whether or that will be forever, who knows.

1213
01:07:54.159 --> 01:07:56.039
But he's doing a really good job and I don't

1214
01:07:56.079 --> 01:08:01.280
think it's too distracting at all. As this episode wraps up, okay,

1215
01:08:01.320 --> 01:08:04.400
we're basically cutting back and forth between two big major

1216
01:08:04.519 --> 01:08:08.199
climaxes that are happening here. We've got the art show

1217
01:08:08.280 --> 01:08:14.880
party with mon Mathma, Luthan, Claia, Krenick, and Young right.

1218
01:08:15.079 --> 01:08:17.720
All during this art show party, okay, and well that's

1219
01:08:17.760 --> 01:08:20.600
going on. Vell and Sinta are on this big heist

1220
01:08:20.640 --> 01:08:21.760
with the Gorman front.

1221
01:08:21.840 --> 01:08:22.039
Right.

1222
01:08:22.279 --> 01:08:25.560
They're all being watched the whole time by Cyril and

1223
01:08:25.600 --> 01:08:29.119
the ISB while they're doing this heist, and I love

1224
01:08:29.239 --> 01:08:33.399
during the art show party, right, there's this great scene

1225
01:08:33.479 --> 01:08:37.520
with mon Mathma and director Krenick just trading these politically

1226
01:08:37.640 --> 01:08:41.439
charged barbs with each other. It's awesome, right, and she's

1227
01:08:41.520 --> 01:08:44.319
just basically trying to do everything she can to just

1228
01:08:44.359 --> 01:08:47.000
go to him and keeping distractive while Clay is over

1229
01:08:47.039 --> 01:08:49.920
there basically making her hand bleed trying to get the

1230
01:08:50.079 --> 01:08:52.800
listening device out of this piece of art that it's

1231
01:08:52.840 --> 01:08:56.840
inn't it. So it's a really tense, very entertaining scene.

1232
01:08:57.359 --> 01:09:00.840
And then, of course during the heist, because it's, you know,

1233
01:09:01.520 --> 01:09:06.279
a heist on an imperial occupied planet, nothing goes right, right.

1234
01:09:06.880 --> 01:09:12.640
Two of the Gorman Front partisans, Drina and Sam, they

1235
01:09:12.680 --> 01:09:16.239
both do things they weren't supposed to do, right. Drina

1236
01:09:16.279 --> 01:09:18.960
gets distracted helping an old lady cross the street, and

1237
01:09:19.079 --> 01:09:22.520
Sam brings a blaster along even when he was told

1238
01:09:22.800 --> 01:09:27.319
specifically not to do it by Velncenta. Right, he brings

1239
01:09:27.319 --> 01:09:29.880
a blaster along anyway, So they're both doing these things

1240
01:09:29.880 --> 01:09:33.199
they're not supposed to do. One of the members of

1241
01:09:33.239 --> 01:09:36.800
the city council, guy named Lauzine, wanders into the heist,

1242
01:09:37.000 --> 01:09:40.039
not knowing what's going on, and there's a big skirmish,

1243
01:09:40.319 --> 01:09:43.239
weapons are fired that should never have been there, and

1244
01:09:43.359 --> 01:09:49.479
Sinta is killed right tragically, and it's another meaningless death

1245
01:09:49.640 --> 01:09:52.359
like Brassos from the first arc right at the end

1246
01:09:52.359 --> 01:09:55.119
of Arc one. It's the same kind of thing. The

1247
01:09:55.159 --> 01:09:57.760
whole point I think that's being made here is that

1248
01:09:57.800 --> 01:10:00.039
there's so much chaos going on that it just he

1249
01:10:00.119 --> 01:10:02.520
used too much for anyone to keep track of. You're

1250
01:10:02.520 --> 01:10:05.319
hearing that even amongst the imperials. They say that in

1251
01:10:05.359 --> 01:10:09.079
the ISB. The same thing is happening within the chaos

1252
01:10:09.079 --> 01:10:13.479
of the early that band of two factions of rebels

1253
01:10:13.520 --> 01:10:15.079
kind of going out each other. We saw in the

1254
01:10:15.079 --> 01:10:17.800
first three episodes. There's just too much chaos. No one

1255
01:10:17.800 --> 01:10:22.520
in is control. The alliance needs to form. They need

1256
01:10:22.560 --> 01:10:25.279
a leader, right, they don't know it yet, but they

1257
01:10:25.319 --> 01:10:27.239
need somebody like mon Moth not to step up and

1258
01:10:27.279 --> 01:10:31.520
become a leader because there's all this fragmentation of chaos happenings.

1259
01:10:32.119 --> 01:10:35.920
Luthen's you know, a wetworks guy. You know, he's not

1260
01:10:36.079 --> 01:10:39.319
an inspirational leader in the same way, So it's a

1261
01:10:39.640 --> 01:10:43.359
there's a lot of necessity for that. So all these

1262
01:10:43.399 --> 01:10:46.359
tragedies keep happening, and then the episode ends in a

1263
01:10:46.399 --> 01:10:50.399
really cool way, I think, with Bix's torturer, doctor Gorris,

1264
01:10:50.520 --> 01:10:53.640
suddenly realizing that he's being ambushed in his torture facility

1265
01:10:53.720 --> 01:10:57.640
by Bix herself. And this is great cathartic moment for her,

1266
01:10:57.720 --> 01:11:00.000
right because she ends up putting one of his own

1267
01:11:00.159 --> 01:11:03.520
torture devices on him, you know, gagging him, and then

1268
01:11:03.640 --> 01:11:06.079
blowing up the building that he's in. Right, So it's

1269
01:11:06.199 --> 01:11:11.479
by bye bye isb gorst franchise torture opportunities, And it's

1270
01:11:11.520 --> 01:11:18.359
just very satisfying and cathartic as she blows that building up. Boom.

1271
01:11:18.760 --> 01:11:22.199
That wraps up the four, five and six episodes for

1272
01:11:22.319 --> 01:11:24.960
us in terms of summaries. Ever been to Gorman? I

1273
01:11:24.960 --> 01:11:28.760
have friends everywhere, and what a festive evening. That's a

1274
01:11:28.760 --> 01:11:29.720
lot of talking from me.

1275
01:11:30.640 --> 01:11:33.880
So how about we spind the dial I want to

1276
01:11:33.920 --> 01:11:36.279
go first here? You want to go first?

1277
01:11:36.119 --> 01:11:39.239
Want to go first? Excellent? I want to go first first,

1278
01:11:39.319 --> 01:11:39.840
Uncle Jim.

1279
01:11:40.159 --> 01:11:43.119
All right. Last week I was disappointed.

1280
01:11:43.000 --> 01:11:47.239
Uncle Jim. I appreciate that I found. I appreciate your service.

1281
01:11:48.039 --> 01:11:51.159
I found the pacing. I didn't like it. This week

1282
01:11:51.479 --> 01:11:55.279
episode four, I was like, oh no, oh, no, here

1283
01:11:55.279 --> 01:12:01.000
we go again. But by the end of episode six phenomenal.

1284
01:12:01.680 --> 01:12:04.000
I really really enjoyed it, and I think it's definitely

1285
01:12:04.039 --> 01:12:06.640
going in the right direction, so much so that I've

1286
01:12:06.680 --> 01:12:09.399
already watched the next three episodes, which I'm not going

1287
01:12:09.479 --> 01:12:13.119
to talk about right now. But I enjoyed it. I

1288
01:12:13.119 --> 01:12:17.199
thought it definitely turned the corner for me. Particularly we

1289
01:12:17.279 --> 01:12:22.600
saw Sagarera and his crazed rebellion flying X wings. How

1290
01:12:22.640 --> 01:12:25.720
cool was that? In fact, one of the X wings

1291
01:12:25.800 --> 01:12:27.720
that we see crack, Because I went back and watched

1292
01:12:27.800 --> 01:12:30.319
Rogue one afterwards, one of the X wings that we

1293
01:12:30.359 --> 01:12:33.039
see crashed in the street in Rogue one is one

1294
01:12:33.039 --> 01:12:35.840
of Sagrera's X wings with the black markings on it,

1295
01:12:35.920 --> 01:12:38.760
So I noticed that right away. I thought that was cool.

1296
01:12:39.039 --> 01:12:42.479
Seeing Krenick again exchanging bars with man Mathma, I thought

1297
01:12:42.600 --> 01:12:47.479
was awesome. The fact, I also think, correct me if

1298
01:12:47.520 --> 01:12:51.039
I'm wrong here, but the basis Sagarera was using looked

1299
01:12:51.079 --> 01:12:54.159
exactly like the base that we see the Rebels using

1300
01:12:54.760 --> 01:13:02.239
in Star Wars the movie. Was that forse Awakens? Yes?

1301
01:13:02.399 --> 01:13:04.640
Is that not the It looked just like it to me?

1302
01:13:05.000 --> 01:13:07.680
It is, Yeah, that ends up being it's the car.

1303
01:13:08.560 --> 01:13:11.000
I thought that comes to subsequent rebel bass.

1304
01:13:11.039 --> 01:13:14.800
That was cool mentioning grahamav Tarkin crushing the people. I

1305
01:13:14.840 --> 01:13:20.119
thought was you know, another tie in to Star Wars. Yeah,

1306
01:13:20.239 --> 01:13:23.800
I mean I enjoyed it. I completely enjoyed it, particularly

1307
01:13:23.880 --> 01:13:27.239
the last two episodes of the three. And to me,

1308
01:13:28.279 --> 01:13:30.319
maybe I'm looking at this the wrong way. Maybe my

1309
01:13:30.399 --> 01:13:33.119
truck spirts here can clear this up for me. But

1310
01:13:33.159 --> 01:13:36.199
the way I'm starting to look at at this now

1311
01:13:36.279 --> 01:13:39.800
is that each three blocks of episodes are like a

1312
01:13:39.800 --> 01:13:43.279
little mini movie in an unto themselves and which is

1313
01:13:43.279 --> 01:13:45.960
a lot different than what we're used to watching. You know,

1314
01:13:46.000 --> 01:13:48.439
we're used to watching episodes that that that go in

1315
01:13:48.520 --> 01:13:52.439
chronological order or a long story arc like on Discovery

1316
01:13:52.520 --> 01:13:56.159
or Picard, But in and Or they're doing something different.

1317
01:13:56.199 --> 01:13:58.680
We have these three episode blocks that together tell a

1318
01:13:58.760 --> 01:14:01.520
story and then they're there is a time gap between

1319
01:14:01.560 --> 01:14:03.119
the next block, and then we move on to the

1320
01:14:03.119 --> 01:14:06.399
next block, and each block of episodes tells one part

1321
01:14:06.479 --> 01:14:09.000
of a bigger story. Is that is that? Am I

1322
01:14:09.039 --> 01:14:10.439
looking at it that the right way here?

1323
01:14:10.880 --> 01:14:11.079
Yeah?

1324
01:14:11.119 --> 01:14:11.359
I think.

1325
01:14:11.399 --> 01:14:14.600
So You've got four arcs of three episodes each and

1326
01:14:14.640 --> 01:14:16.760
there's really separated by a year, so I think they're

1327
01:14:16.760 --> 01:14:19.680
like little miniature movies almost really, and you get four

1328
01:14:19.720 --> 01:14:20.000
of them.

1329
01:14:20.199 --> 01:14:22.399
Yeah, they're a little mini movies. So looking at it

1330
01:14:22.439 --> 01:14:26.199
that way, Yeah, I really enjoyed this batch. I really did.

1331
01:14:26.279 --> 01:14:28.520
I didn't feel as bad about it as I did

1332
01:14:28.520 --> 01:14:31.920
about the three. I enjoyed it, and I highly recommend it.

1333
01:14:31.920 --> 01:14:35.079
Seeing Sagarera and how we went crazy sniffing the gas,

1334
01:14:36.119 --> 01:14:40.079
you know, the rebel alliance taking form here, the heist

1335
01:14:40.119 --> 01:14:44.560
of the Imperial weapons, absolutely awesome. I highly recommend it.

1336
01:14:44.960 --> 01:14:46.600
I loved it.

1337
01:14:47.439 --> 01:14:50.920
Nice, We're getting him to come around friends, very cool,

1338
01:14:51.119 --> 01:14:58.960
very cool, excellent. Uh, Eric, well they're.

1339
01:15:00.199 --> 01:15:03.720
You know, It's so funny because I feel like, given

1340
01:15:03.760 --> 01:15:06.479
the task of reviewing three episodes at a time, I'm

1341
01:15:06.600 --> 01:15:09.920
almost overwhelmed because I kind of want to look at

1342
01:15:09.920 --> 01:15:13.319
it from a thirty thousand foot view and talk about

1343
01:15:14.039 --> 01:15:15.760
the general things that are happening, But then there's so

1344
01:15:15.800 --> 01:15:18.720
many specific things that are happening that I'm really really

1345
01:15:19.680 --> 01:15:25.479
interested in. So so here's what I'll say. I can't

1346
01:15:25.760 --> 01:15:28.279
I'm not the guy who's going to keep really really

1347
01:15:28.279 --> 01:15:30.840
good track of the cannon, so I'm not necessarily going

1348
01:15:30.880 --> 01:15:34.159
to recognize when something happens that happened in Rogue one

1349
01:15:34.479 --> 01:15:37.119
or that kind of stuff. The good news is that

1350
01:15:37.199 --> 01:15:39.439
I feel like the way that they're shooting this and

1351
01:15:39.479 --> 01:15:43.039
the way that they're writing this, it appeals to people

1352
01:15:43.199 --> 01:15:45.960
on multiple levels. So if you are the person who's

1353
01:15:46.039 --> 01:15:50.479
keeping track of that stuff on a minute level, you're

1354
01:15:50.520 --> 01:15:53.159
going to notice that Saws X wing is the X

1355
01:15:53.199 --> 01:15:56.680
wing that's crashed in Rogue one, or you're going to

1356
01:15:56.760 --> 01:15:59.399
notice all these finer points. I'm just like, ooh, Saw's

1357
01:15:59.399 --> 01:16:01.159
got some x w that's kind of cool. I'm gonna

1358
01:16:01.199 --> 01:16:03.920
ask if my tre experts a bunch of questions about

1359
01:16:04.039 --> 01:16:07.159
X wings, like I don't. I don't really know where

1360
01:16:07.199 --> 01:16:10.000
the X wings came from. And I learned actually a

1361
01:16:10.039 --> 01:16:14.159
lot this week in our private chat on X wings

1362
01:16:14.199 --> 01:16:18.960
being manufactured by people who were, you know, friendly to

1363
01:16:19.000 --> 01:16:21.560
the rebellion and that kind of stuff. So you should

1364
01:16:21.560 --> 01:16:26.520
look it up if you're if you're interested, I will

1365
01:16:26.560 --> 01:16:32.039
say also that, uh, you know, one of the things

1366
01:16:32.079 --> 01:16:34.640
that's most fascinating about me about this show is that

1367
01:16:35.199 --> 01:16:38.039
we still and I said this last week, we still

1368
01:16:38.039 --> 01:16:41.119
know what's going to happen in the end, Like we

1369
01:16:41.279 --> 01:16:43.840
know what the outcome of all of this stuff is,

1370
01:16:45.159 --> 01:16:49.039
it doesn't matter. I'm still finding this completely riveting. Like

1371
01:16:49.199 --> 01:16:51.760
I think the writing of this show is just so good,

1372
01:16:52.479 --> 01:16:55.439
and I love the dance between the kind of like

1373
01:16:55.760 --> 01:16:59.720
greater concepts that are going on between the Empire and

1374
01:16:59.840 --> 01:17:05.680
the budding rebellion here and the specific small character interactions

1375
01:17:05.720 --> 01:17:11.760
that are happening that then lead to bigger things. I

1376
01:17:11.800 --> 01:17:15.840
can't think of another show except maybe maybe the newer

1377
01:17:15.880 --> 01:17:19.039
Battlestar Galactica show that sort of played with that kind

1378
01:17:19.079 --> 01:17:22.520
of macro and micro view at the same time, and

1379
01:17:22.560 --> 01:17:24.720
I'll say that that's probably one of my favorite parts

1380
01:17:24.760 --> 01:17:28.399
of and Or right now. I also feel like this

1381
01:17:28.479 --> 01:17:33.000
show is literally becoming a template on how to form

1382
01:17:33.079 --> 01:17:35.279
a rebellion against anything.

1383
01:17:37.239 --> 01:17:41.600
Which given that this was shot a little while.

1384
01:17:41.479 --> 01:17:46.760
Ago, and it just feels very very contemporary right now

1385
01:17:46.800 --> 01:17:49.439
and very current with some of the stuff that's going on,

1386
01:17:49.520 --> 01:17:52.079
particularly in this country right now. I'm just like, Wow,

1387
01:17:53.319 --> 01:18:01.560
I absorb stuff when it's particularly relevant to what is

1388
01:18:01.600 --> 01:18:03.760
going on in my life at the moment, and I

1389
01:18:03.800 --> 01:18:06.760
feel like I am really super absorbing this show right

1390
01:18:06.760 --> 01:18:11.199
now because I'm feeling what some of these rebels are feeling.

1391
01:18:11.239 --> 01:18:17.279
I'm feeling the the overarching dominance of this thing that's

1392
01:18:17.359 --> 01:18:22.600
kind of out there and that wants to take what's

1393
01:18:22.680 --> 01:18:26.479
mine or what's ours and twist it in different ways

1394
01:18:26.520 --> 01:18:30.319
and use it for its own purposes. So I don't know,

1395
01:18:30.399 --> 01:18:34.640
I just I'm I'm completely enamored with the writing right now,

1396
01:18:34.680 --> 01:18:36.920
and I feel like it's a confluence of just really

1397
01:18:36.960 --> 01:18:39.640
good writing and the time in.

1398
01:18:39.640 --> 01:18:43.520
Which this is made. I just, I don't know.

1399
01:18:43.840 --> 01:18:46.479
It's hard for me to say more about that. I

1400
01:18:46.520 --> 01:18:51.279
just really dig that. I still think that Luthan is

1401
01:18:51.279 --> 01:18:56.600
probably one of my favorite characters. He he is this

1402
01:18:56.800 --> 01:18:59.960
He's the only person in the show who is just

1403
01:19:00.359 --> 01:19:06.720
brutally invested in the rebellion and he just doesn't care

1404
01:19:07.560 --> 01:19:10.319
who gets lit on fire along the way. And I

1405
01:19:11.840 --> 01:19:17.479
I think that idea of that you have to sacrifice

1406
01:19:17.600 --> 01:19:22.600
so much to make what you know morally needs to

1407
01:19:22.760 --> 01:19:27.760
happen happen is kind of refreshing in some ways. It's

1408
01:19:27.760 --> 01:19:32.600
like it's brutal and it's scary, but it's also he's

1409
01:19:32.640 --> 01:19:36.640
the only character who's kind of got the like unwavering

1410
01:19:36.800 --> 01:19:42.840
moral compass, not relative to personal relationships, not relative to

1411
01:19:43.520 --> 01:19:46.039
micro things that are happening here and there. He's just

1412
01:19:46.119 --> 01:19:48.199
the one who has the vision that's kind of going

1413
01:19:48.239 --> 01:19:54.000
forward and knowing what we know about Manmatha becoming the

1414
01:19:54.279 --> 01:19:59.319
kind of leader of the rebellion, I just feel like

1415
01:19:59.359 --> 01:20:01.359
we know at this point that Luthen's got to die,

1416
01:20:01.800 --> 01:20:04.640
right at some point, this guy has to die. He

1417
01:20:04.800 --> 01:20:08.520
has to have a big sacrifice that happens. I don't

1418
01:20:08.560 --> 01:20:11.039
know what block of episodes it's going to happen in,

1419
01:20:11.560 --> 01:20:14.079
but I'm like ninety nine percent sure that we're gonna

1420
01:20:14.119 --> 01:20:18.520
lose Luthen. And I'm gonna end my talk here with

1421
01:20:18.560 --> 01:20:21.039
my my Luthen theory that I know I've chatted a

1422
01:20:21.079 --> 01:20:24.279
little bit with Paul about. I haven't specifically talked about

1423
01:20:24.279 --> 01:20:26.319
what the theory is, but I know we both have

1424
01:20:26.479 --> 01:20:28.920
theories and I want to just like explore those.

1425
01:20:29.760 --> 01:20:32.119
Oh you want to hear it now, that'd be great.

1426
01:20:32.359 --> 01:20:33.399
I mean, so.

1427
01:20:35.399 --> 01:20:38.399
When mon Mathmas as many Bothins died as you bother in.

1428
01:20:40.119 --> 01:20:42.600
Well, I'm not sure what a botherin is, but but

1429
01:20:42.920 --> 01:20:48.199
I like so, so Paul, I, do you do you

1430
01:20:48.239 --> 01:20:51.880
want to kind of talk about what your theory is

1431
01:20:51.920 --> 01:20:54.920
with Luthen right now? Or or do you want me

1432
01:20:54.960 --> 01:20:57.279
to go first or whatever. I feel like we're probably

1433
01:20:57.319 --> 01:20:59.279
we haven't really talked about this guy, so this is

1434
01:20:59.359 --> 01:21:02.279
kind of like we're both getting out onto the tip

1435
01:21:02.279 --> 01:21:05.079
of the diving board and just sort of a little bit.

1436
01:21:05.000 --> 01:21:10.359
We are we are a little bit right. Let me

1437
01:21:10.439 --> 01:21:11.960
see if I can find one thing here, because I

1438
01:21:12.000 --> 01:21:14.159
have a I wrote something about this the other day,

1439
01:21:14.199 --> 01:21:15.920
but I doubt very much as I can find it,

1440
01:21:19.640 --> 01:21:21.479
you know, when I'm talking about Edie, you know what

1441
01:21:21.479 --> 01:21:26.840
I mean? Yeah, and all the time when Edie and

1442
01:21:27.279 --> 01:21:29.640
Cyril and I gotta be careful when I talk about

1443
01:21:29.720 --> 01:21:35.920
because we're not talking about this week's current. I have

1444
01:21:36.039 --> 01:21:38.079
seen two of the three started.

1445
01:21:39.640 --> 01:21:41.960
So absolutely awesome by the way.

1446
01:21:42.520 --> 01:21:46.039
I don't know if my theory, you know. But okay, whenever,

1447
01:21:46.199 --> 01:21:47.920
like you have to go back to season one for

1448
01:21:47.960 --> 01:21:50.319
this and a little bit of season two, right, but

1449
01:21:51.960 --> 01:21:55.800
I'll be real quick, I promise. But but whenever before

1450
01:21:56.000 --> 01:21:59.319
Edie basically you know, gets her the wind knocked out

1451
01:21:59.319 --> 01:22:01.439
of by dead right. One of the things she would

1452
01:22:01.520 --> 01:22:05.439
always say to uh Cyril is, oh, your uncle Harlow

1453
01:22:05.439 --> 01:22:08.039
will do this. Oh, your uncle uncle Harlow will do that.

1454
01:22:08.199 --> 01:22:11.039
He's always giving advice. Uncle Harlow, uncle Harlow, right, and

1455
01:22:11.079 --> 01:22:16.359
then there's that brief mention of him when dedra Uh

1456
01:22:16.600 --> 01:22:19.439
is getting you know, in her face, right, he goes,

1457
01:22:19.439 --> 01:22:22.399
I've looked up your uncle Harlow and he's just a

1458
01:22:22.680 --> 01:22:24.760
he's a he's a he's like a criminal.

1459
01:22:24.920 --> 01:22:25.079
Right.

1460
01:22:25.239 --> 01:22:29.760
Basically my theory is that Luther and his uncle Harlow. Yeah,

1461
01:22:30.479 --> 01:22:33.720
and that like the uncle that you know, Cyril's you know,

1462
01:22:34.239 --> 01:22:36.560
been always told to go into. Is that what you

1463
01:22:36.600 --> 01:22:37.039
were thinking?

1464
01:22:37.319 --> 01:22:39.600
That is exactly what I was seeing it. It's kind

1465
01:22:39.600 --> 01:22:41.720
of funny because I swear to god, I googled this

1466
01:22:42.319 --> 01:22:44.800
and nobody else was talking about it when I googled.

1467
01:22:44.800 --> 01:22:48.600
But yeah, that's so funny that that you have the

1468
01:22:48.600 --> 01:22:49.000
same thing.

1469
01:22:49.039 --> 01:22:49.359
I love it.

1470
01:22:49.840 --> 01:22:52.560
I love it because it's like you keep hearing about

1471
01:22:52.560 --> 01:22:57.760
this character very mysteriously, right, but a criminal and who

1472
01:22:57.840 --> 01:23:02.880
else is sort of you know flinching.

1473
01:23:03.560 --> 01:23:04.680
Yeah, I love.

1474
01:23:05.960 --> 01:23:08.399
I love Luthan. That's a character I mean, manologue can give.

1475
01:23:08.439 --> 01:23:09.439
At the end of season one.

1476
01:23:10.239 --> 01:23:12.279
I mean, that was that was that was on point,

1477
01:23:12.399 --> 01:23:15.399
and he gives kind of a like similar one this

1478
01:23:15.520 --> 01:23:17.880
time around a little bit when he and Cassian are

1479
01:23:17.960 --> 01:23:20.680
kind of having that interaction and he's talking about the

1480
01:23:20.760 --> 01:23:24.520
nature of sacrifice and like, you know that. The thing

1481
01:23:24.680 --> 01:23:27.279
that I love about Cassian is that like this guy

1482
01:23:27.640 --> 01:23:31.840
leads with his heart and he he's the one who

1483
01:23:31.960 --> 01:23:34.359
like knows the thing that has to happen. And he's like,

1484
01:23:34.439 --> 01:23:38.840
I'm gonna put all of myself into this, not not

1485
01:23:38.840 --> 01:23:44.960
willie nilly, but like his personal relationships matter more to

1486
01:23:45.119 --> 01:23:48.560
him than the ideals of the rebellion. And I feel

1487
01:23:48.560 --> 01:23:51.560
like that's where I would be, like it would be

1488
01:23:51.640 --> 01:23:56.560
hard for me to And and one of the amazing

1489
01:23:56.600 --> 01:23:59.319
things that happens in one of these episodes is is

1490
01:23:59.640 --> 01:24:02.600
luth And is finally like, you know what, I don't

1491
01:24:02.640 --> 01:24:05.079
think this is the guy we need. I think we

1492
01:24:05.159 --> 01:24:10.119
need to actually move on. And and Vell is kind

1493
01:24:10.119 --> 01:24:15.159
of like the next in line of how he's you know, trying.

1494
01:24:14.960 --> 01:24:18.800
To because whatever whatever he wants, whatever he wants Cassian

1495
01:24:18.880 --> 01:24:21.479
to be, he hasn't become that yet.

1496
01:24:20.600 --> 01:24:25.720
He's recognizing that Cassian doesn't have that kind of mindset

1497
01:24:25.760 --> 01:24:32.920
because Cassian's personal dialogue resides in his in his love

1498
01:24:32.960 --> 01:24:37.359
for bicks and and and I think that that's one

1499
01:24:37.359 --> 01:24:40.359
of the really cool things about this show because you

1500
01:24:40.439 --> 01:24:43.479
kind of get this. I think more than any other

1501
01:24:43.520 --> 01:24:46.159
Star Wars that I've seen, except maybe like some of

1502
01:24:46.199 --> 01:24:49.479
the stuff between like Anakin and Padme kind of touches

1503
01:24:49.520 --> 01:24:51.479
on this just a little bit, but it doesn't really

1504
01:24:52.479 --> 01:24:55.439
develop it in the same way in that there's an

1505
01:24:55.479 --> 01:24:58.840
ideal that has to be achieved and then there's like

1506
01:24:58.880 --> 01:25:02.600
the personal relationship, and those two things don't always necessarily

1507
01:25:02.680 --> 01:25:06.479
align with one another, and to me, this show is

1508
01:25:06.720 --> 01:25:09.359
exploring those to the nth degree, and I just I

1509
01:25:09.479 --> 01:25:11.119
just really like it. It's one of the reasons that

1510
01:25:11.159 --> 01:25:13.920
I really love the Cassian character because I feel like

1511
01:25:15.199 --> 01:25:17.439
if I were in this universe, he would be the

1512
01:25:17.439 --> 01:25:18.319
guy that I would be.

1513
01:25:19.479 --> 01:25:23.479
And I kind of also I sometimes wonder also with Luthen, right,

1514
01:25:23.560 --> 01:25:27.960
because Luthen's fascinating to me, right, because I often wonder if,

1515
01:25:28.000 --> 01:25:32.399
like you know, he had that one like weapon, like

1516
01:25:32.479 --> 01:25:35.279
a knife type weapon that was just it was kind

1517
01:25:35.279 --> 01:25:37.640
of war like a bit of a lightsaber in season one,

1518
01:25:37.720 --> 01:25:40.279
and I wonder if there's some like if Luthen's like

1519
01:25:40.359 --> 01:25:43.239
maybe a fallen Jedi at some point, because the Jedi,

1520
01:25:43.439 --> 01:25:45.760
like if you watch like the prequels, right, what do

1521
01:25:45.800 --> 01:25:48.880
they always say? What are the Masters always tell This

1522
01:25:48.920 --> 01:25:52.439
is the problem that Anakin got into. Right, don't form attachments.

1523
01:25:52.520 --> 01:25:56.359
Attachments are bad, right, Like, don't do that, right, You're

1524
01:25:56.359 --> 01:25:59.199
not supposed to have those feelings. Right. But and so

1525
01:25:59.319 --> 01:26:03.720
here we have lou And basically discouraging attachments wherever he can. Right,

1526
01:26:03.840 --> 01:26:09.199
he's discouraging uh Bis, you know, he's discouraging Cassi and

1527
01:26:09.239 --> 01:26:14.640
from you know, Bix's a liability basically saying he's discouraging

1528
01:26:15.800 --> 01:26:24.119
the relationship between Valencinta. Right, He's basically he sees they're

1529
01:26:24.119 --> 01:26:27.520
more valuable apart than together. Right. But meanwhile, right at

1530
01:26:27.560 --> 01:26:30.039
the end of the one episode, he's merely walking off

1531
01:26:30.079 --> 01:26:32.840
with Claya, you know, practically hand in hand. Right. It's

1532
01:26:32.880 --> 01:26:35.079
like he gets to be close to the people, but

1533
01:26:35.199 --> 01:26:37.359
other people don't. So he's like kind of this you know,

1534
01:26:38.039 --> 01:26:41.000
hypocritical guy in some ways. So it's fascinating stuff.

1535
01:26:41.399 --> 01:26:44.800
Absolutely, And there have been times when I've wondered if

1536
01:26:44.840 --> 01:26:47.640
he like, I will admit that there's a part of

1537
01:26:47.680 --> 01:26:51.279
me that was like, is he really a clone or something?

1538
01:26:51.319 --> 01:26:53.800
Because you got the two different hairstyles going on, You've

1539
01:26:53.800 --> 01:26:58.399
got him showing up in different places. You I feel

1540
01:26:58.399 --> 01:27:05.479
like his rebel subterfuge self and his you know, art

1541
01:27:05.920 --> 01:27:10.560
gallery person are I mean, they're similar obviously in a

1542
01:27:10.600 --> 01:27:12.920
lot of ways. They're they're playing two sides of the

1543
01:27:12.960 --> 01:27:16.079
same coin. But I've almost been like, kind of, can

1544
01:27:16.119 --> 01:27:18.600
he literally do all this stuff as one person?

1545
01:27:18.800 --> 01:27:19.920
Or are there actually too?

1546
01:27:20.119 --> 01:27:22.319
I don't really think that there are too, But like

1547
01:27:22.680 --> 01:27:24.159
there was a part of me at one point that

1548
01:27:24.279 --> 01:27:25.920
was like, is luth And a clone.

1549
01:27:27.520 --> 01:27:28.359
Surely one person?

1550
01:27:28.800 --> 01:27:31.920
I don't think But yeah, I don't think so either.

1551
01:27:32.000 --> 01:27:35.600
I think he's just he's a very busy, disturbed guy.

1552
01:27:35.640 --> 01:27:38.159
I mean, he's flying everywhere in that amazing starship of

1553
01:27:38.199 --> 01:27:41.800
his right, He's just you know, zipping around and doing whatever.

1554
01:27:41.920 --> 01:27:44.239
And so I don't know that he's not, but I

1555
01:27:44.760 --> 01:27:47.720
think he's, you know, he's it's going to be really

1556
01:27:47.720 --> 01:27:50.560
interesting when Luthen bows out, you know, I think it

1557
01:27:50.640 --> 01:27:51.279
is what I do.

1558
01:27:51.199 --> 01:27:53.840
You agree that he's going to die at some point?

1559
01:27:54.880 --> 01:27:58.479
I think we're you know, it's it seems like this

1560
01:27:58.560 --> 01:28:02.159
is a show about sacrifice, right, and and and he's

1561
01:28:02.479 --> 01:28:04.880
what is his line from I mean it's almost like

1562
01:28:04.920 --> 01:28:11.239
telegraphing in away from from the monologue and yeah, where

1563
01:28:11.239 --> 01:28:15.199
he says basically he goes, I can't remember the exact

1564
01:28:15.199 --> 01:28:18.439
thing he says, but it goes, I burn my you know,

1565
01:28:18.640 --> 01:28:22.840
burn my candle for sunsets, for sunrise I will never see, right,

1566
01:28:22.920 --> 01:28:25.319
And basically he's talking about what I'm doing right now

1567
01:28:25.399 --> 01:28:27.880
is for a future I won't live to see, right.

1568
01:28:27.920 --> 01:28:30.520
I mean, I think he and Saw both know that

1569
01:28:30.520 --> 01:28:34.479
that what's necessary is to get it done, because you

1570
01:28:34.479 --> 01:28:37.439
have to be willing to just you know, take it,

1571
01:28:38.199 --> 01:28:41.359
you know, to sacrifice yourself. I think that's something like

1572
01:28:41.399 --> 01:28:44.079
that will happen, but I'm not sure how because we

1573
01:28:44.119 --> 01:28:47.079
don't see any reference of him in Rogue one, right,

1574
01:28:47.279 --> 01:28:51.960
But he could also just be somebody who just you know, disappears,

1575
01:28:52.000 --> 01:28:54.199
but I don't see that, So I think he's probably

1576
01:28:54.279 --> 01:28:57.840
going to be you know, it'll be fascinating to see

1577
01:28:57.880 --> 01:29:00.960
what happens, though I'm not gonna say anything else because

1578
01:29:01.000 --> 01:29:04.000
we can't talk about this next batch of episodes. Yeah, well,

1579
01:29:04.199 --> 01:29:07.640
so we're really really really I feel like we got

1580
01:29:07.640 --> 01:29:09.239
to even though he's not seen him. I know Charles

1581
01:29:09.319 --> 01:29:11.560
has deliberately not been watching these episodes because he just

1582
01:29:11.600 --> 01:29:13.319
doesn't have time. But you do want to weigh in

1583
01:29:13.399 --> 01:29:21.479
on anything that sounds intriguing Charles definitely.

1584
01:29:21.560 --> 01:29:26.600
It sounds like a very calm, very wound up story,

1585
01:29:27.680 --> 01:29:30.319
and there sounds like a lot of interesting details coming

1586
01:29:30.399 --> 01:29:34.439
up that's going to tie in to Rogue one, which

1587
01:29:34.439 --> 01:29:41.000
I think should be interesting. But definitely I'm looking for

1588
01:29:41.319 --> 01:29:42.720
And when I do get to see.

1589
01:29:42.479 --> 01:29:46.640
It, Yeah, it's it's a lot going on. It's one

1590
01:29:46.640 --> 01:29:49.960
of those shows you almost want to watch. People have

1591
01:29:50.000 --> 01:29:52.199
different styles, right, But I almost find sometimes if I

1592
01:29:52.239 --> 01:29:53.960
go back and watch it again, if I watch it

1593
01:29:53.960 --> 01:29:56.520
with the subtitles on, I almost get more out of it.

1594
01:29:56.640 --> 01:30:02.119
Sometimes title are required for this right now, because there's

1595
01:30:02.159 --> 01:30:05.439
so many accents going on. I can't understand a damn

1596
01:30:05.479 --> 01:30:07.880
thing sauce as to tell you the truth, unless I

1597
01:30:07.920 --> 01:30:09.600
have the titles on.

1598
01:30:09.920 --> 01:30:12.000
I've got one of those soundbars that pushes up the

1599
01:30:12.039 --> 01:30:14.439
dialogue track right, so it's like a little easier to

1600
01:30:14.479 --> 01:30:18.560
hear it, which is really really fun. But just this

1601
01:30:18.920 --> 01:30:21.439
what they're saying is really complex, and sometimes they're just

1602
01:30:21.520 --> 01:30:24.960
talking in like you know, you know, like like if

1603
01:30:24.960 --> 01:30:27.039
he and I were at the pub, Eric and I

1604
01:30:27.159 --> 01:30:32.720
was just like, do we need to get some cheese? No,

1605
01:30:33.479 --> 01:30:36.560
We're not going to have cheese, ton I. We're just

1606
01:30:36.640 --> 01:30:39.439
having bread, you know, I mean those kind of things, right,

1607
01:30:39.479 --> 01:30:41.039
You're like, what are they really saying, right, because they

1608
01:30:41.039 --> 01:30:43.159
can't talk about the thing that they're really doing, right

1609
01:30:43.199 --> 01:30:46.680
because they would be killed. So it's like like Spielberg's Munich, right,

1610
01:30:46.840 --> 01:30:50.640
very similar to that. Right, there's very hardcore, realistic spy talk.

1611
01:30:50.880 --> 01:30:51.399
It's great.

1612
01:30:52.199 --> 01:30:55.800
So well, David David gets to bring up the caboose

1613
01:30:55.800 --> 01:30:59.840
on this one here, so yeah.

1614
01:30:59.720 --> 01:31:04.720
So well, I enjoyed this very well much. And uh,

1615
01:31:04.760 --> 01:31:07.079
for those who don't know what a botin is, I

1616
01:31:07.119 --> 01:31:09.640
got a picture here that I just found and this

1617
01:31:09.800 --> 01:31:14.439
is what they look like. So those are the guys

1618
01:31:14.479 --> 01:31:18.159
who apparently stole the death Doll plans and sacrificed themselves

1619
01:31:18.199 --> 01:31:19.800
as well. So I'm wondering if we're gonna be seeing

1620
01:31:19.840 --> 01:31:25.279
them later on in the last few of the uh

1621
01:31:25.760 --> 01:31:29.159
coming episode that Android is gonna be doing. But yeah,

1622
01:31:29.319 --> 01:31:34.640
so I myself, I believe that continuity, or in this case, canon,

1623
01:31:36.159 --> 01:31:40.720
is very important for any kind of series. If without canon,

1624
01:31:40.840 --> 01:31:44.880
they've got so many open doors that can get really

1625
01:31:44.880 --> 01:31:48.920
confusion really quick. So to me, canon, when I watched it,

1626
01:31:49.000 --> 01:31:51.600
I watched it for the entertainment of knowing that, Okay,

1627
01:31:51.600 --> 01:31:54.479
this is gonna happen. This is what's gonna take place now.

1628
01:31:54.560 --> 01:31:57.640
And as far as you guys were talking about Lutheran,

1629
01:31:58.079 --> 01:32:00.079
was she gonna die or is she gonna, you know,

1630
01:32:00.159 --> 01:32:03.159
disappear whatnot. I honestly think he's probably going to be

1631
01:32:03.239 --> 01:32:05.760
kidnapped by the Empire. He's probably going to get thrown

1632
01:32:05.800 --> 01:32:09.159
in prision. Probably he might satifice himself, and that's very

1633
01:32:09.199 --> 01:32:12.199
likely to be a case. But yeah, I think he's

1634
01:32:12.199 --> 01:32:16.520
gonna just probably disappear into an imperial prison, probably because

1635
01:32:16.520 --> 01:32:18.560
they're going to capture him. And then now my Mathma

1636
01:32:18.680 --> 01:32:24.880
is going to have to take the way to the

1637
01:32:24.920 --> 01:32:29.119
leader rebellion. So technically I think this show, even though

1638
01:32:29.159 --> 01:32:33.359
I haven't seen the other three yet, so I'm very

1639
01:32:33.399 --> 01:32:36.000
curious of what's going to happen in the next year

1640
01:32:36.680 --> 01:32:43.039
to marry Band of Outlaws here, But honestly I think

1641
01:32:43.439 --> 01:32:52.039
that knowing what happened with Kashian on World one, I mean, heck,

1642
01:32:52.600 --> 01:32:58.800
they might even bring in well, actually they can't bring

1643
01:32:58.880 --> 01:33:01.359
in the woman on Rogue one. I can't remember her name,

1644
01:33:01.399 --> 01:33:05.319
but yeah, never mind, they met. Yeah, I don't think

1645
01:33:05.319 --> 01:33:07.119
they're gonna bring her in because they met in Rogue one.

1646
01:33:07.159 --> 01:33:11.560
So technically k two s O. I think his name is.

1647
01:33:14.039 --> 01:33:16.199
I've seen a trailer and I know that there is

1648
01:33:16.239 --> 01:33:20.000
going to be them him in there. So technically, yes,

1649
01:33:21.720 --> 01:33:23.560
it would be fun to see a lot of the

1650
01:33:23.760 --> 01:33:28.800
returning in this case, legendary characters come back together and stuff.

1651
01:33:28.840 --> 01:33:33.039
But I'm really looking forward to see what's going to

1652
01:33:33.119 --> 01:33:36.079
happen and I can't wait to talk about it next week.

1653
01:33:36.159 --> 01:33:40.319
So yeah, I'm really enjoying it. It's just, uh, it's

1654
01:33:40.319 --> 01:33:43.600
this episode four, five and six definitely got a lot

1655
01:33:43.680 --> 01:33:45.840
more intense. In that whole scene where she was trying

1656
01:33:45.840 --> 01:33:51.159
to get that the listening device out of that art piece,

1657
01:33:51.319 --> 01:33:54.079
I was literally holding my breath. I would like my breathing.

1658
01:33:54.920 --> 01:33:59.199
So yeah, it was. It was intense. I enjoyed it.

1659
01:33:59.880 --> 01:34:03.560
I like it. And are we doing numbers at all or.

1660
01:34:06.319 --> 01:34:06.720
Sure?

1661
01:34:07.279 --> 01:34:12.359
Sure, go ahead, Okay, I would give that thumbed up

1662
01:34:12.399 --> 01:34:16.840
to a nine point five. I enjoyed it more than

1663
01:34:16.960 --> 01:34:17.399
last week.

1664
01:34:17.479 --> 01:34:20.319
Yeah, Eric, Eric had had a couple of things he

1665
01:34:20.359 --> 01:34:21.880
wanted to add to that. I just wanted to make

1666
01:34:21.880 --> 01:34:23.199
sure we heard from David first.

1667
01:34:25.840 --> 01:34:27.159
Uh.

1668
01:34:27.439 --> 01:34:30.119
Yeah, Well, the only things that I was going to

1669
01:34:31.079 --> 01:34:36.359
close with were that I think when they introduced the

1670
01:34:36.520 --> 01:34:39.319
serial character I was a little unclear on whether or

1671
01:34:39.359 --> 01:34:43.319
not he was going to be full on Empire or

1672
01:34:43.359 --> 01:34:45.199
he was actually going to be able to be one

1673
01:34:45.199 --> 01:34:47.800
of those people who has turned to the rebellion. And

1674
01:34:47.840 --> 01:34:50.800
I think we're starting to see that he's definitely aligning

1675
01:34:50.880 --> 01:34:55.880
himself with the Empire right now. However, to me, there

1676
01:34:56.079 --> 01:34:58.720
there's still a little bit of doubt in his character.

1677
01:34:58.960 --> 01:35:02.079
And although he full in with Dedra and he's full

1678
01:35:02.159 --> 01:35:06.840
in with Patrick Gaz and Partrigaz and all those people,

1679
01:35:07.039 --> 01:35:08.960
I feel like there's still a chance for him to

1680
01:35:09.079 --> 01:35:13.920
actually play a role that is rebellion focused. So I'm

1681
01:35:13.960 --> 01:35:17.439
interested to see if that manifests. The only other thing

1682
01:35:17.479 --> 01:35:20.880
I wanted to see was or say, was that I

1683
01:35:20.920 --> 01:35:23.279
really appreciated in one of these episodes. It might have

1684
01:35:23.319 --> 01:35:26.159
been the last one, I can't remember which one, where

1685
01:35:26.800 --> 01:35:30.680
it feels like Monmotha finally kind of gives up on

1686
01:35:30.760 --> 01:35:34.560
the Senate, like she's been trying so hard to turn

1687
01:35:34.640 --> 01:35:39.119
people to her way of thinking to get votes for

1688
01:35:39.199 --> 01:35:42.399
different things, and you kind of see her finally get

1689
01:35:42.520 --> 01:35:45.159
disgusted with it and sort of give up on it.

1690
01:35:45.199 --> 01:35:48.520
And I really appreciated that because it felt like a

1691
01:35:48.600 --> 01:35:52.119
very human moment to me, where she knows what needs

1692
01:35:52.119 --> 01:35:53.760
to happen and she feels like she's put in the

1693
01:35:53.840 --> 01:35:58.000
time to make it happen, and yet it hasn't manifest.

1694
01:35:58.159 --> 01:36:02.960
So that to me was like the biggest step that

1695
01:36:03.000 --> 01:36:09.720
we've seen for her forward becoming the leader of the rebellion.

1696
01:36:10.920 --> 01:36:14.159
And yeah, I mean, I'll give this block episodes and nine,

1697
01:36:14.199 --> 01:36:16.760
I feel like they were super duper solid. The writing,

1698
01:36:17.279 --> 01:36:19.720
I think is some of the best writing that I've

1699
01:36:19.720 --> 01:36:23.319
seen on television, and I'll put that with the first

1700
01:36:23.359 --> 01:36:26.159
block episodes that we saw too. I just in general,

1701
01:36:27.279 --> 01:36:29.640
the concepts that are being developed and the fact that

1702
01:36:29.680 --> 01:36:32.960
they're in this you know, expanded universe, I think is

1703
01:36:33.039 --> 01:36:36.840
really interesting. But moreover, you could watch this show and

1704
01:36:36.880 --> 01:36:40.399
not know a darn thing about Star Wars and still

1705
01:36:40.680 --> 01:36:42.560
completely enjoy it, and that to me is kind of

1706
01:36:42.560 --> 01:36:43.600
what takes it over the top.

1707
01:36:44.920 --> 01:36:47.199
Well, I just wanted to jump back in and say,

1708
01:36:47.319 --> 01:36:49.319
I think one of the reasons why I enjoyed these

1709
01:36:49.359 --> 01:36:51.840
last three blocks and why the next three blocks were

1710
01:36:51.840 --> 01:36:54.039
so incredibly mind boggling, which we're not going to talk

1711
01:36:54.079 --> 01:36:58.760
about till next week, is because the characters that were

1712
01:36:58.840 --> 01:37:02.039
meeting and the situation that we're seeing are closer to

1713
01:37:02.119 --> 01:37:06.079
Star Wars. The first three episodes, really I could have

1714
01:37:06.119 --> 01:37:10.720
passed them completely, wouldn't have mattered. But these three, you know,

1715
01:37:10.760 --> 01:37:14.840
we're starting to see things happening where it's feeling more

1716
01:37:14.880 --> 01:37:17.159
and more like the Star Wars that I grew up with,

1717
01:37:17.319 --> 01:37:20.319
like is on my shirt in nineteen seventy seven, and

1718
01:37:20.399 --> 01:37:24.600
I really like that. I'm really digging that. So I'm

1719
01:37:24.680 --> 01:37:26.640
not as in love with it as you guys to

1720
01:37:26.680 --> 01:37:30.119
go with a nine or ten, but definitely a seven

1721
01:37:30.159 --> 01:37:34.159
point eight for sure. And next week's are gonna is

1722
01:37:34.159 --> 01:37:36.199
gonna be even better, which we'll talk about then. But

1723
01:37:36.479 --> 01:37:38.960
I'm gonna go with a seven point eight for sure.

1724
01:37:39.479 --> 01:37:44.079
And unless Paul wants to jump in and give us

1725
01:37:43.800 --> 01:37:45.479
his number.

1726
01:37:45.920 --> 01:37:49.039
It's tough because, like you, you've got three different episodes, right,

1727
01:37:49.119 --> 01:37:52.039
I mean, yeah, I mean I've been an.

1728
01:37:51.920 --> 01:37:54.000
All a giant movie, all one movie.

1729
01:37:54.279 --> 01:37:56.319
Yeah, I would basically put this. I would say all

1730
01:37:56.399 --> 01:37:57.880
of it so far from me, has been at the

1731
01:37:58.000 --> 01:37:59.760
very least of nine. I think some of the episodes

1732
01:37:59.800 --> 01:38:04.359
have stronger than others, right, But just in general, I

1733
01:38:04.399 --> 01:38:07.680
mean I kind of would almost prefer to really hold

1734
01:38:07.680 --> 01:38:10.039
off until we've seen the whole thing, right, because it's

1735
01:38:10.039 --> 01:38:12.439
in the middle of it, and I'm just not a

1736
01:38:12.560 --> 01:38:16.800
hung up on the whole number rating thing anyway. It's

1737
01:38:16.840 --> 01:38:20.960
just my jam that I think it's amazing. I think

1738
01:38:21.000 --> 01:38:26.880
it's just adult literate, you know, it's just the rating.

1739
01:38:26.880 --> 01:38:30.239
It's just really dark and it's about something. I just

1740
01:38:30.239 --> 01:38:33.880
think it's really amazing and necessary. I think it's just

1741
01:38:33.960 --> 01:38:40.319
it's it's I don't have the same need to connect

1742
01:38:40.319 --> 01:38:43.560
it to you know. I just think it's different than

1743
01:38:43.920 --> 01:38:47.640
the other kinds of style. I'm not looking to align

1744
01:38:47.680 --> 01:38:52.039
it with the same tone from you know, the original trilogy.

1745
01:38:52.279 --> 01:38:54.680
It's just that just doesn't matter to me. It's just like,

1746
01:38:55.560 --> 01:38:58.359
to me, it represents hope that like, okay, in this

1747
01:38:58.520 --> 01:39:01.439
century we find ourselves in now, Like it's I don't

1748
01:39:01.479 --> 01:39:05.039
want to see that we're repeating ourselves at infinitum. I

1749
01:39:05.079 --> 01:39:06.960
want to see that this folks are willing to push

1750
01:39:07.000 --> 01:39:11.720
the envelope, push the boundaries, and to go darker and

1751
01:39:12.359 --> 01:39:19.680
tell stories that are more you know, locked in and

1752
01:39:19.840 --> 01:39:22.560
necessary for where we seem to be heading as a society,

1753
01:39:23.039 --> 01:39:25.760
right And to me, that's the real heroism going on.

1754
01:39:25.840 --> 01:39:29.199
So I'm not looking to see it line up. I mean,

1755
01:39:29.239 --> 01:39:31.000
we've already had a lot of them stuff in the

1756
01:39:31.079 --> 01:39:33.319
end of Rogue one. Right, in terms of lining up

1757
01:39:33.359 --> 01:39:35.039
with the original affility, I want to I want to

1758
01:39:35.039 --> 01:39:38.479
see them go and perfectly willing to have them go

1759
01:39:38.520 --> 01:39:41.840
in other direction. I don't need to be reminded of

1760
01:39:41.880 --> 01:39:44.039
what those other things are they stand upont This is

1761
01:39:44.079 --> 01:39:47.399
something that's new and unique, so I think it should

1762
01:39:47.399 --> 01:39:49.840
just be appreciated on.

1763
01:39:49.760 --> 01:39:54.560
Its own, all right, So, Charles, what's the overall score

1764
01:39:54.600 --> 01:39:57.279
from the truck Spurts four, five and six.

1765
01:39:58.279 --> 01:40:04.319
Well, when we round now members around, we start off

1766
01:40:04.359 --> 01:40:09.439
with about almost an eight last week, and we are

1767
01:40:09.479 --> 01:40:12.920
in eight point eight rounding tw a nine this week,

1768
01:40:13.840 --> 01:40:17.239
so we're up at least a good tense of a point.

1769
01:40:19.439 --> 01:40:23.159
Excellent excellent news. All right, guys. Well, that wraps up

1770
01:40:23.159 --> 01:40:26.239
our discussion on and Or Part two episodes four, five

1771
01:40:26.239 --> 01:40:29.039
and six. Wait till next week, seven, eight, and nine.

1772
01:40:29.520 --> 01:40:32.479
Can't wait? All right, guys, It's time for our Star

1773
01:40:32.520 --> 01:40:42.279
Trek birthdays.

1774
01:40:51.600 --> 01:40:53.039
That was not a clemon.

1775
01:40:52.800 --> 01:40:55.760
Song, all right, guys. We always start out our Star

1776
01:40:55.800 --> 01:40:58.399
Trek birthdays by remembering those members of our Star Trek

1777
01:40:58.439 --> 01:41:01.279
family who are, sadly enough no longer with us, and

1778
01:41:01.359 --> 01:41:02.520
for that we turned.

1779
01:41:02.319 --> 01:41:04.079
To Eric Jim.

1780
01:41:04.159 --> 01:41:07.560
I'm going to abbreviate my remembrances a little bit this

1781
01:41:07.600 --> 01:41:10.760
week because we have ten of them and I just

1782
01:41:10.800 --> 01:41:13.039
want to make sure that we acknowledge these people and

1783
01:41:13.119 --> 01:41:15.399
give a little bit of background information about them. So

1784
01:41:15.439 --> 01:41:18.079
our first remembrance this week is for Donald James Marshall,

1785
01:41:18.479 --> 01:41:21.079
better known simply as Don Marshall, the actor who played

1786
01:41:21.079 --> 01:41:25.920
Lieutenant Boma in the TOS first season episode The Galileo Seven.

1787
01:41:26.279 --> 01:41:29.399
He's also probably best known for playing Dan Erickson on

1788
01:41:29.479 --> 01:41:33.039
the Irwin Allen produced television series Land of the Giants

1789
01:41:33.039 --> 01:41:36.640
from nineteen sixty eight through nineteen seventy, and in addition

1790
01:41:36.720 --> 01:41:42.159
to acting, Marshall provided consultation regarding his work and racial issues,

1791
01:41:42.960 --> 01:41:45.279
and as a result, was once given an award for

1792
01:41:45.359 --> 01:41:48.479
outstanding achievement in his field as a Black achiever in

1793
01:41:48.520 --> 01:41:52.600
the United States. So Donald James Marshall really special actor.

1794
01:41:52.880 --> 01:41:54.840
You should go look him up on IMDb. Lots of

1795
01:41:54.840 --> 01:41:57.399
cool stuff in his thing. We lost him back in

1796
01:41:57.399 --> 01:41:59.680
twenty sixteen at the age of eighty years old. Happy

1797
01:41:59.680 --> 01:42:01.039
Birthday commercial.

1798
01:42:01.760 --> 01:42:02.399
Happy Birthday.

1799
01:42:02.399 --> 01:42:06.800
As well to Theodore Meir Bickel, the actor who portrayed

1800
01:42:06.960 --> 01:42:10.600
Sergei Roshenko in the Next Generation four season episode Family.

1801
01:42:10.680 --> 01:42:13.239
I think you probably recognize him. He was a versatile

1802
01:42:13.359 --> 01:42:16.479
character actor born in Vienna, Austria. He was also a

1803
01:42:16.640 --> 01:42:21.039
master of languages, dialects, and accents, and often played ethnic

1804
01:42:21.159 --> 01:42:25.000
roles such as German officers and even a Serbian king

1805
01:42:25.199 --> 01:42:28.000
at one point. In fact, at one point he actually

1806
01:42:28.000 --> 01:42:34.560
portrayed President Richard Nixon's Secretary of State Henry Kissinger. Wait,

1807
01:42:34.640 --> 01:42:36.560
not his secretary of State, but you don't understand what

1808
01:42:36.640 --> 01:42:39.279
I mean. The UK Secretary of State in the ninety

1809
01:42:39.319 --> 01:42:42.880
eighty nine Watergate movie The Final Days. Theodore miir Bickel

1810
01:42:43.359 --> 01:42:45.359
a really special actor. He lived to be the ripe

1811
01:42:45.359 --> 01:42:48.079
old age of ninety one years old. We lost him

1812
01:42:48.079 --> 01:42:52.960
back in twenty fifteen. Happy Birthday, Theodore bikel Happy Birthday.

1813
01:42:52.960 --> 01:42:56.840
As well to Lance go Legault. He was the actor

1814
01:42:56.840 --> 01:43:00.560
who appeared as Katimak in the Next Generation second season

1815
01:43:00.600 --> 01:43:04.439
episode The Emissary. He's probably best known for his reoccurring

1816
01:43:04.520 --> 01:43:08.960
role as Colonel Decker in the television series The A Team.

1817
01:43:09.039 --> 01:43:11.439
I probably saw every single episode of that show when

1818
01:43:11.439 --> 01:43:13.800
I was It was just the right time and place.

1819
01:43:13.840 --> 01:43:17.039
I think it was like a team and Airwolf.

1820
01:43:16.520 --> 01:43:18.159
For like back to back or something. I don't know.

1821
01:43:18.239 --> 01:43:20.960
I watched all sorts of different things. He did a

1822
01:43:20.960 --> 01:43:23.479
lot of acting along the way, lots of guest appearances

1823
01:43:23.520 --> 01:43:25.880
and stuff. And he also did voice work for cartoons

1824
01:43:25.880 --> 01:43:29.199
and video games, and was the narrator of the tour

1825
01:43:29.359 --> 01:43:36.079
audio tape for Elvis Presley's Graceland Mansion and Museum in Memphis, Tennessee. Yeah,

1826
01:43:36.119 --> 01:43:38.399
he was actually a close friend of Elvis Presley.

1827
01:43:38.399 --> 01:43:38.600
Two.

1828
01:43:38.600 --> 01:43:39.479
You should look that up.

1829
01:43:40.000 --> 01:43:45.479
Happy birthday to Lance Galald Legault. Happy birthday as well

1830
01:43:45.520 --> 01:43:49.119
to Marry Carver. The actress who appeared as Nadette and

1831
01:43:49.359 --> 01:43:53.359
Bernadette Fuller in the Next in the Enterprise for season

1832
01:43:53.399 --> 01:43:58.039
episode Tara Nova. She's probably best known for playing Cecilia Simon,

1833
01:43:58.079 --> 01:44:00.560
the mother to the title stars of the CB television

1834
01:44:00.640 --> 01:44:03.640
series Simon and Simon, which I also saw pretty much

1835
01:44:03.640 --> 01:44:07.760
every episode of from nineteen eighty one to nineteen eighty nine.

1836
01:44:08.119 --> 01:44:10.880
And in addition to being a much sought over actor,

1837
01:44:10.960 --> 01:44:13.720
she taught within the theater department of the University of

1838
01:44:13.760 --> 01:44:18.000
Southern California and received the nineteen eighty six Drama Logue

1839
01:44:18.079 --> 01:44:23.079
Award for Outstanding performance for the stage play A Christmas Memory.

1840
01:44:23.720 --> 01:44:26.399
Mary Carver lost at the ripe old age of eighty

1841
01:44:26.479 --> 01:44:29.039
nine years old back in twenty thirteen. Happy Birthday to her,

1842
01:44:29.880 --> 01:44:32.760
Happy Birthday as well to gen Bell, one of the

1843
01:44:32.880 --> 01:44:36.000
two actresses who played Dancy Crater in the TOS first

1844
01:44:36.119 --> 01:44:40.279
season episode The Man Trap. Born in Chicago but grew

1845
01:44:40.359 --> 01:44:42.520
up in California, she was best known, probably for her

1846
01:44:42.560 --> 01:44:46.279
co starring role as vice principal Jean Pagano in the

1847
01:44:46.319 --> 01:44:51.640
first season of the high school drama series Mister Novak. Unfortunately,

1848
01:44:51.640 --> 01:44:54.079
we lost her to breast cancer all the way back

1849
01:44:54.079 --> 01:44:56.479
in nineteen ninety six at the young age of sixty

1850
01:44:56.520 --> 01:45:02.000
seven years old. Jean bal Happy Birthday, Ta, Happy Birthday,

1851
01:45:02.000 --> 01:45:05.439
as well to Barry Rousseau, also known as John Duke

1852
01:45:05.520 --> 01:45:08.920
Rousseau or sometimes just John Duke. He was the actor

1853
01:45:08.960 --> 01:45:12.520
who appeared twice on the original series, first playing Lieutenant

1854
01:45:12.560 --> 01:45:15.279
Commander Giaddo in the first season episode The Devil in

1855
01:45:15.319 --> 01:45:18.840
the Dark, and then went on to play Commodore Bob

1856
01:45:18.880 --> 01:45:22.680
Wesley in the second season episode The Ultimate Computer. The

1857
01:45:22.680 --> 01:45:26.680
majority of Russeau's additional work in his career were guest

1858
01:45:26.720 --> 01:45:30.560
appearances on other television shows. All the things from the

1859
01:45:30.600 --> 01:45:33.520
seventies and eighties that you can think of. He also

1860
01:45:33.560 --> 01:45:37.239
appeared in the nineteen seventy two feature film The Man.

1861
01:45:37.479 --> 01:45:41.319
Barry Rousseau Lost back in twenty three at the age

1862
01:45:41.479 --> 01:45:45.239
of seventy eight years old. Happy Birthday, Happy Birthday as

1863
01:45:45.279 --> 01:45:51.000
well to John Neville, the extremely accomplished British actor who

1864
01:45:51.039 --> 01:45:53.680
appeared as Isaac Newton in the Next Generation six season

1865
01:45:53.720 --> 01:45:57.800
episode Dissent, perhaps best known for playing two roles, the

1866
01:45:57.840 --> 01:46:02.079
title role in Terry Gilliam's real comic fantasy The Adventures

1867
01:46:02.479 --> 01:46:05.920
of Baron Munchausen and for his reoccurring role as the

1868
01:46:06.079 --> 01:46:09.840
well manicured man on the Fox Network's popular science fiction

1869
01:46:10.000 --> 01:46:15.000
television series The X Files. He did so much stuff,

1870
01:46:15.079 --> 01:46:17.600
you guys. You gotta look up zion dB. There's just

1871
01:46:17.720 --> 01:46:20.840
like so much stuff. A lot of it is theater based.

1872
01:46:20.840 --> 01:46:24.399
He was a classically trained British actor. He also had

1873
01:46:24.439 --> 01:46:27.880
reoccurring roles on several Canadian television series as he spent

1874
01:46:27.920 --> 01:46:30.960
a lot of his life in Canada and actually won

1875
01:46:31.079 --> 01:46:34.760
some Canadian television awards along the way too. So Happy

1876
01:46:34.760 --> 01:46:38.600
Birthday to a very very cool and accomplished actor, John

1877
01:46:38.680 --> 01:46:41.680
Neville Lost back in twenty eleven at the age of

1878
01:46:41.680 --> 01:46:46.119
eighty six years old. Happy birthday as well to Bill Quinn.

1879
01:46:46.159 --> 01:46:49.079
Billy Quinn was the actor who appeared as David McCoy

1880
01:46:49.239 --> 01:46:52.680
in Star Trek five, Jim's Favorite movie. Quinn is best

1881
01:46:52.720 --> 01:46:55.840
known for his roles on four television series as Sweeney

1882
01:46:55.920 --> 01:46:59.279
the Bartender on The Rifleman, as Doctor Milnitz on The

1883
01:46:59.279 --> 01:47:03.680
Odd Couple, as Doctor Van Rustlinar on All in the

1884
01:47:03.720 --> 01:47:07.079
Family and its spinoff series Archie Bunker's Place, and he

1885
01:47:07.119 --> 01:47:11.039
appeared in nineteen sixty two's Advice and Consent. He was

1886
01:47:11.079 --> 01:47:14.800
also in some Alfred Hitchcock movies along the way. Unfortunately,

1887
01:47:14.800 --> 01:47:18.760
Star Trek five would be his final performance as an actor.

1888
01:47:19.479 --> 01:47:22.000
We lost him back in nineteen ninety four at the

1889
01:47:22.000 --> 01:47:24.840
age of eighty one years old. Happy birthday to Bill Quinn.

1890
01:47:25.720 --> 01:47:28.800
Happy birthday as well to John Lormer, a character actor

1891
01:47:28.800 --> 01:47:31.560
who made three appearances on Star Trek the original series.

1892
01:47:31.600 --> 01:47:35.039
He played Theodor Haskins in The Cage and the Menagerie

1893
01:47:35.079 --> 01:47:38.760
Part one. He played Tamar in Return of the Arkans,

1894
01:47:39.079 --> 01:47:42.079
and he played an old man in for the World

1895
01:47:42.079 --> 01:47:45.079
as Hollow and I Have Touched the Sky. Perhaps one

1896
01:47:45.119 --> 01:47:48.159
of the best titled episodes of all times. You'll note

1897
01:47:48.199 --> 01:47:53.520
that his roles in both of those tos episodes were

1898
01:47:54.600 --> 01:47:59.079
murdered by tyrannical computers that oversaw their societies for trying

1899
01:47:59.119 --> 01:48:03.079
to reveal keel Key information to Captain Kirksbach and doctor McCoy.

1900
01:48:03.239 --> 01:48:05.680
So a little bit of a theme going on there

1901
01:48:05.760 --> 01:48:08.319
with him. But he had over one hundred and fifty

1902
01:48:08.399 --> 01:48:11.640
film and television roles along the way, including a lot

1903
01:48:11.640 --> 01:48:16.800
of stuff in John Wayne films. So John Lormer lost

1904
01:48:16.840 --> 01:48:19.359
all the way back in nineteen eighty six at seventy

1905
01:48:19.439 --> 01:48:23.199
nine years old. We appreciate your contributions and happy birthday

1906
01:48:23.199 --> 01:48:26.279
to you. And last but not least, on our remembrance list,

1907
01:48:26.319 --> 01:48:29.560
we have actor Roger Perry. He's the actor who played

1908
01:48:29.680 --> 01:48:32.920
John Christopher in Star Trek the original series first season

1909
01:48:32.960 --> 01:48:37.000
episode Tomorrow is Yesterday. He began acting in movies all

1910
01:48:37.039 --> 01:48:40.000
the way back in nineteen fifty eight and then soon

1911
01:48:40.279 --> 01:48:44.800
thereafter got into television. No stranger to science fiction and horror.

1912
01:48:44.800 --> 01:48:47.039
He's got a lot of that under his belt, including

1913
01:48:47.079 --> 01:48:52.720
movies like nineteen sixty seven's The Prophet and playing count

1914
01:48:52.800 --> 01:48:58.279
Yorga in Vampire from nineteen seventy. He actually sidelined not

1915
01:48:58.319 --> 01:49:00.920
only as an actor, but as a composer and songwriter

1916
01:49:01.039 --> 01:49:05.159
for Los Angeles theater productions, including a mid nineteen eighties

1917
01:49:05.239 --> 01:49:08.439
musical version of Jor Bernard Shaw's You Never Can Tell,

1918
01:49:08.840 --> 01:49:14.079
which featured his future wife, Joyce Boulefant. Happy Birthday to

1919
01:49:14.279 --> 01:49:17.000
Roger Perry, lost back in twenty eighteen at the age

1920
01:49:17.039 --> 01:49:20.359
of eighty five years old. And that was the quick

1921
01:49:20.359 --> 01:49:23.000
and dirty on our remembrances this week. Guys, I'm gonna

1922
01:49:23.039 --> 01:49:25.079
pass this birthday candle over to Charles.

1923
01:49:25.479 --> 01:49:28.520
Oh, thank you, Eric got a few short ones from mine.

1924
01:49:29.359 --> 01:49:33.319
Let's start out the Happy Birthday to Jeff Lester, actress

1925
01:49:33.319 --> 01:49:37.479
and filmmaker who portrayed the FBI in Tiger Interrogator in

1926
01:49:37.600 --> 01:49:41.600
Star Trek four The Voyage Home, one of my favorite

1927
01:49:41.600 --> 01:49:49.760
Star Trek movies. Happy Birthday, John rashaka Karma, actress who

1928
01:49:49.840 --> 01:49:54.359
made his film debut as Commander Sonik in Star Trek

1929
01:49:54.399 --> 01:50:02.159
the Motion Picture. Happy Birthday to Melinda Qa, actress and

1930
01:50:02.279 --> 01:50:06.600
former model who portrayed Soren and g and Gee's fifth

1931
01:50:06.600 --> 01:50:12.039
season episode The Outcast. Definitely a good character that we

1932
01:50:12.039 --> 01:50:13.479
ought to talk about sometime.

1933
01:50:17.000 --> 01:50:18.520
And last one of my list.

1934
01:50:18.399 --> 01:50:21.720
But not not to get away with a good one,

1935
01:50:22.880 --> 01:50:31.479
very very happy birthday is Santiago Cabrera and that Venezuelan

1936
01:50:31.680 --> 01:50:36.720
borne Chilean British actress who played Chrystoball Rios in the

1937
01:50:36.760 --> 01:50:39.199
first and second season of Per Card.

1938
01:50:40.359 --> 01:50:44.039
Love Captain Rios. Sorry we didn't get more of him

1939
01:50:44.119 --> 01:50:47.279
later on. I hope we would love to see more

1940
01:50:47.279 --> 01:50:50.359
of him come back as him or as being one

1941
01:50:50.439 --> 01:50:54.920
of his holograms. Paul, who's on your list?

1942
01:50:57.680 --> 01:51:01.279
Thank you? Charles. Well. First of all, we got a

1943
01:51:01.319 --> 01:51:04.359
serious contender here for one of the all time greats

1944
01:51:04.399 --> 01:51:06.600
I think in the Star Trek universe, and that is

1945
01:51:06.600 --> 01:51:11.720
the great Mark Alima. Okay, we must immediately think of

1946
01:51:11.880 --> 01:51:18.399
as legendary Kardassian all in more episodes of Star Trek's

1947
01:51:18.560 --> 01:51:21.319
Deep Space nine and we could possibly ever list. But

1948
01:51:21.600 --> 01:51:25.960
he holds also the unique and distinguishing honor of being

1949
01:51:26.000 --> 01:51:29.720
one of the very first two Romulans we see in

1950
01:51:29.840 --> 01:51:33.640
the Next Generation era and also the very first Cardassian

1951
01:51:33.800 --> 01:51:36.479
ever seen in Star Trek. But this guy is phenomenal.

1952
01:51:36.880 --> 01:51:41.239
I mean, it's just it's it takes a special kind

1953
01:51:41.239 --> 01:51:44.079
of a real magic to be able to convey as

1954
01:51:44.119 --> 01:51:48.119
much emotion as Mark Alima does when you're wearing so

1955
01:51:48.279 --> 01:51:53.359
much prosthesis. It's a ton, it's a lot, and it's

1956
01:51:53.439 --> 01:51:58.479
just and it's mark It's amazing, right, I mean, am

1957
01:51:58.479 --> 01:52:01.439
I crazy? I don't think so. But it's just one

1958
01:52:01.439 --> 01:52:03.159
of the things I love about Golda Cott is he's

1959
01:52:03.199 --> 01:52:07.399
an awfully awful person and he's just terrible. Right. But

1960
01:52:08.640 --> 01:52:11.279
Mark Alimo never played him as black and white, right.

1961
01:52:11.640 --> 01:52:15.199
You weirdly find yourself liking him when you feel you

1962
01:52:15.199 --> 01:52:18.000
shouldn't sometimes because he's just He's not a black and

1963
01:52:18.000 --> 01:52:21.720
white villain. He's super complex and there's all kinds of

1964
01:52:21.760 --> 01:52:25.279
interesting shades to him. So it's an incredible performance, and

1965
01:52:25.279 --> 01:52:28.560
he just kept building on the character from episode to episode.

1966
01:52:28.600 --> 01:52:34.000
So mark Alimo, we salute you, Okay, amazing, amazing work.

1967
01:52:34.319 --> 01:52:36.960
Happy birthday to Richard Cox, a New York actor who

1968
01:52:37.000 --> 01:52:41.119
played the role of Carol Finn in the Next Generation

1969
01:52:41.279 --> 01:52:46.039
third season episode The high Ground. Happy birthday to you,

1970
01:52:47.039 --> 01:52:49.760
and oh it makes my heart seem to be able

1971
01:52:49.800 --> 01:52:53.279
to say Happy birthday to the next individual, the phenomenal

1972
01:52:54.079 --> 01:53:00.000
legendary John Rice Davies. Okay, who's been in Oh I'm

1973
01:53:00.000 --> 01:53:02.439
I mean the lines at his autographic table are go

1974
01:53:02.680 --> 01:53:06.159
out the door. Okay, we are acknowledging him here for

1975
01:53:06.399 --> 01:53:10.479
being the holographic recreation of Leonardo da Vinci in third

1976
01:53:10.600 --> 01:53:16.239
and fourth season episodes of Voyager Scorpion and the Brilliant

1977
01:53:16.319 --> 01:53:22.199
Concerning Flight two of absolutely the best. The whole idea

1978
01:53:22.319 --> 01:53:25.039
of him being a sounding board for Jane Way to

1979
01:53:25.199 --> 01:53:29.319
relate to and to kind of project her her thoughts

1980
01:53:29.319 --> 01:53:31.880
against was just genius, I thought. One of the best

1981
01:53:31.960 --> 01:53:36.880
things ever on all of Voyager, I would say, But

1982
01:53:37.279 --> 01:53:39.359
also just a legendary actor in and on of his

1983
01:53:39.399 --> 01:53:44.239
own right, of course, the infamous Gimli in the Lord

1984
01:53:44.279 --> 01:53:49.239
of the Rings trilogy, and thinking back to several different

1985
01:53:49.840 --> 01:53:54.119
magical appearances in the Indiana Jones franchise, of course, this

1986
01:53:54.279 --> 01:53:58.560
is Sola right in the Indian's Good Friend. I'm so pleased,

1987
01:54:01.640 --> 01:54:06.960
India right, Indy, come here quickly. No, he's fantastic. I

1988
01:54:07.000 --> 01:54:09.520
love John Rice Dave. He's very, very a talented guy,

1989
01:54:09.880 --> 01:54:14.039
incredible personality. So happy birthday to you, sir Oh for

1990
01:54:14.119 --> 01:54:16.640
the opportunity to meet you someday, it would be thrilled.

1991
01:54:17.479 --> 01:54:19.479
Let's hurry up and make use of our time because

1992
01:54:19.479 --> 01:54:21.520
it seems to be running out of the hour glass quickly, right,

1993
01:54:21.560 --> 01:54:22.479
So over to uncle Jim.

1994
01:54:23.359 --> 01:54:25.479
Well, I thank you so much, Paul, and let's not forget.

1995
01:54:25.520 --> 01:54:28.760
He was also in Sliders, another one of those shows

1996
01:54:28.760 --> 01:54:34.319
that people often forget and overlook with Captain Jack Ransom himself,

1997
01:54:34.359 --> 01:54:36.960
who was the lead in that show. All right, I

1998
01:54:37.000 --> 01:54:39.520
want to say happy birthday this next guy. He's not

1999
01:54:39.560 --> 01:54:42.880
a Klingon, but if you grew up in the eighties,

2000
01:54:43.119 --> 01:54:45.399
you definitely know who he is. He's an icon of

2001
01:54:45.399 --> 01:54:47.840
the eighties. He was in all all the movies I

2002
01:54:47.880 --> 01:54:51.000
went to see with my girlfriend, my fiance, my wife

2003
01:54:51.239 --> 01:54:54.199
I'm currently married to. We want to say happy birthday

2004
01:54:54.680 --> 01:54:57.199
to Brian Tachi. And you're saying, who is he, Uncle Jim?

2005
01:54:57.199 --> 01:54:58.920
He doesn't ring a bell. Well, look at him on

2006
01:54:58.960 --> 01:55:02.279
the screen there, sure you recognize him now. He's the

2007
01:55:02.319 --> 01:55:05.279
actor who played the role of Ray Tao in ts

2008
01:55:05.359 --> 01:55:09.079
his third season episode and the Children Shall Lead. He

2009
01:55:09.159 --> 01:55:12.880
also played Lynn in the TNG fourth season episode Night Terrors.

2010
01:55:13.079 --> 01:55:25.000
But he's best known for his characters Toshierro Taka, Toshiro

2011
01:55:25.479 --> 01:55:28.399
Taka Kashi from the Revenge of the Nerds. You guys

2012
01:55:28.439 --> 01:55:31.119
remember that movie, of course, and he was also the

2013
01:55:31.239 --> 01:55:34.359
voice of Leonardo in the first three live action Teenage

2014
01:55:34.399 --> 01:55:36.880
and Mutant Ninja Turtles movies, and there he is on

2015
01:55:36.920 --> 01:55:40.159
the screen. I love those movies and I thought he

2016
01:55:40.239 --> 01:55:43.760
was great. So Happy birthday to Brian Tos And last

2017
01:55:43.800 --> 01:55:46.319
on my list, he was a klingon We want to

2018
01:55:46.359 --> 01:55:49.800
say Happy birthday to Ron Canada. He appeared as Martin

2019
01:55:49.840 --> 01:55:53.880
Benneck in the TNG fifth season episode Masterpiece Society. He

2020
01:55:53.920 --> 01:55:57.960
also appeared as Vesek in Voyager's fifth season episode The Juggernaut,

2021
01:55:58.439 --> 01:56:00.960
and as you can see on the screen, he appeared

2022
01:56:00.960 --> 01:56:04.199
as the klingon Chapac and Deep Space nine's fourth season

2023
01:56:04.239 --> 01:56:08.800
episode Rules of Engagement. And we're just about out of time,

2024
01:56:08.840 --> 01:56:11.239
but we have one news story that we have to

2025
01:56:11.279 --> 01:56:15.399
get to because next week will be too late. So Eric,

2026
01:56:15.880 --> 01:56:17.920
what is our one and only news story that we're

2027
01:56:17.920 --> 01:56:19.600
going to have time for this week?

2028
01:56:20.000 --> 01:56:23.000
Our one and only news story falls into the category

2029
01:56:23.039 --> 01:56:27.279
of Shatner says what. William Shantner posted his annual Star

2030
01:56:27.359 --> 01:56:30.279
Wars Day message, and of course he had to reference

2031
01:56:30.359 --> 01:56:33.880
Star Trek. Star Wars Day isn't considered a national holiday,

2032
01:56:33.920 --> 01:56:35.960
though it often feels like it should be, given how

2033
01:56:35.960 --> 01:56:39.640
many notable Hollywood icons acknowledge and celebrate it. One of

2034
01:56:39.680 --> 01:56:42.560
the biggest sci fi actors of all time, William Shatner

2035
01:56:42.640 --> 01:56:46.680
doesn't seem capable of letting the pop culture observance pass

2036
01:56:46.760 --> 01:56:51.000
without reminding his millions of geeky followers that Star Treks

2037
01:56:51.000 --> 01:56:55.760
still reigns supreme. While plenty of trekkies enjoy Star Wars,

2038
01:56:55.760 --> 01:56:59.000
and it's safe to say debates about franchise superiority aren't

2039
01:56:59.079 --> 01:57:01.960
quite as fervent these days as they once were, It's

2040
01:57:02.000 --> 01:57:05.279
always fun to see playful razzing taking place between the

2041
01:57:05.319 --> 01:57:09.439
two fandoms. Shatner is a master at tongue in cheek controlling,

2042
01:57:09.960 --> 01:57:12.920
and put his skills to work informing Star Wars fans

2043
01:57:12.960 --> 01:57:18.319
who their real father is. He said, quote, remember Star

2044
01:57:18.359 --> 01:57:21.880
Wars fans, without the Federation, you wouldn't be here. We

2045
01:57:22.119 --> 01:57:26.439
are your father. May the Fourth be with you, Love Starfleet.

2046
01:57:27.039 --> 01:57:29.760
I just want to make things clear. Who's your daddy?

2047
01:57:30.279 --> 01:57:36.640
Me Daddy Bill the sad Daddy. Didn't go into specifics

2048
01:57:36.680 --> 01:57:39.159
on what that meant exactly, which is fine, since the

2049
01:57:39.279 --> 01:57:42.079
term shat daddy has a way of making other subjects

2050
01:57:42.079 --> 01:57:45.520
seem pointless. Perhaps he's referring to the influence that Gene

2051
01:57:45.560 --> 01:57:48.520
Roddenberry's original Star Trek series had on George Lucas during

2052
01:57:48.520 --> 01:57:52.000
the creation of Star Wars. Lucas shared in an interview

2053
01:57:52.039 --> 01:57:55.399
for the documentary Trek Nation that his space opera franchise

2054
01:57:56.000 --> 01:57:59.239
quote stood on the shoulders of Trek, and that his

2055
01:57:59.359 --> 01:58:02.439
love for them sci fi series factored into his creation

2056
01:58:02.479 --> 01:58:06.159
of Han Solo, Princess Leah and the rest. All jokes aside,

2057
01:58:06.479 --> 01:58:09.359
there's nothing wrong with loving Star Wars more than Star Trek,

2058
01:58:09.520 --> 01:58:12.760
or the other way around, or loving them both equally.

2059
01:58:13.119 --> 01:58:16.199
The important thing is that both franchises are arguably the

2060
01:58:16.239 --> 01:58:19.880
strongest they've ever been in their runs, and both played

2061
01:58:19.880 --> 01:58:24.920
a role in making being geeky a mainstream personality trait

2062
01:58:25.199 --> 01:58:28.359
these days. And I will say that I continue to

2063
01:58:28.439 --> 01:58:32.560
be enamored with the fact that nerd culture has become

2064
01:58:32.720 --> 01:58:35.960
pop culture. I don't know how it happened, but it

2065
01:58:36.000 --> 01:58:36.680
turns out we.

2066
01:58:36.560 --> 01:58:41.319
Were all cool all the work along. Thanks Chattner for

2067
01:58:41.359 --> 01:58:42.239
reminding us of that.

2068
01:58:43.000 --> 01:58:45.800
Yeah, we had to get that story in tonight. The

2069
01:58:45.840 --> 01:58:48.039
rest of our stories will move up to next week, guys.

2070
01:58:48.359 --> 01:58:50.119
So I want to take an opportunity to say thank

2071
01:58:50.159 --> 01:58:53.439
you so much to Paul for hanging out and and

2072
01:58:53.760 --> 01:58:55.279
Wars talking with us tonight.

2073
01:58:55.359 --> 01:58:59.079
Thank you, Paul, super fun, super fun to do.

2074
01:58:59.439 --> 01:59:01.600
I'm bringing bringing your friend along with us as well.

2075
01:59:01.680 --> 01:59:05.880
Does she want to say goodbye or did she already leave?

2076
01:59:08.760 --> 01:59:13.039
Oh? There she is, goodbye, Uncle Jim permanently.

2077
01:59:14.960 --> 01:59:17.680
Live long and prosper And thank you so much to

2078
01:59:17.760 --> 01:59:21.199
Charles for hanging out and War's listening with us tonight.

2079
01:59:21.279 --> 01:59:23.199
Thank you, Charles, Oh, thank you.

2080
01:59:23.319 --> 01:59:24.439
Always a fun time.

2081
01:59:26.279 --> 01:59:28.119
And of course thank you to David for all the

2082
01:59:28.199 --> 01:59:30.359
awesome work he does. Is our miracle worker on our

2083
01:59:30.399 --> 01:59:38.600
awesome slide shows. Thank you, David, You're welcome. He's a gnome,

2084
01:59:38.840 --> 01:59:42.439
he know hims everything. And of course thank you to

2085
01:59:42.600 --> 01:59:45.039
Eric for hanging out and Wars talking with us tonight.

2086
01:59:45.079 --> 01:59:47.760
Thank you so much, Eric, absolutely, And I just want

2087
01:59:47.800 --> 01:59:52.520
to say how much I appreciate Paul's most excellent summaries

2088
01:59:52.600 --> 01:59:57.560
of these blocks of episodes. Man, you are totally killing it, dude.

2089
01:59:57.560 --> 02:00:00.760
I feel like I've rewatched them every single time for us.

2090
02:00:00.920 --> 02:00:01.640
Thank you so much.

2091
02:00:01.800 --> 02:00:01.840
That.

2092
02:00:02.640 --> 02:00:05.239
Yeah, it's fun to to condense it, right, I think

2093
02:00:05.239 --> 02:00:07.840
it's just it helps me with what I do to

2094
02:00:07.880 --> 02:00:10.840
be able to sort of, you know, wrangle multiple plots

2095
02:00:10.880 --> 02:00:12.640
and figure out a good way to summarize them in

2096
02:00:12.680 --> 02:00:16.479
a little nugget, right, I mean where it takes longer

2097
02:00:16.560 --> 02:00:18.640
than it should, but it's I don't want to leave

2098
02:00:18.640 --> 02:00:19.199
anything out.

2099
02:00:19.640 --> 02:00:21.640
Well, he's going to have a lot of a lot

2100
02:00:21.840 --> 02:00:24.279
to condense in the next block of episodes.

2101
02:00:24.279 --> 02:00:29.880
That's all I'm excited for it. It's you know, the

2102
02:00:29.880 --> 02:00:32.760
the way this show works is just the tempo just

2103
02:00:32.840 --> 02:00:36.039
keeps building, you know, every single week. So it's just

2104
02:00:36.079 --> 02:00:36.720
going to be great.

2105
02:00:37.199 --> 02:00:40.000
It's building up to Rogue one, and we're getting closer

2106
02:00:40.039 --> 02:00:42.880
and closer by the episode. And I'm your most excellent host,

2107
02:00:43.079 --> 02:00:45.000
Uncle Jim saying each and every one of you guys

2108
02:00:45.000 --> 02:00:47.640
out there, please stay safe and be good to each other.

2109
02:00:47.680 --> 02:00:51.399
Remember Star Trek slash Star Wars fans are the best fans.

2110
02:00:51.800 --> 02:00:56.439
Thank you very much. Hailing frequencies are closed. Good night, everybody,

2111
02:00:57.439 --> 02:00:58.880
live long and prosper.

2112
02:01:01.319 --> 02:01:03.680
All stations. I'm ready for departure, sir.

2113
02:01:07.279 --> 02:01:08.119
Some problem righter.

2114
02:01:08.640 --> 02:01:10.840
I'm just hoping this isn't the usual way our missions

2115
02:01:10.840 --> 02:01:14.760
will go, so oh, no, number one, I'm sure most

2116
02:01:14.800 --> 02:01:16.039
will be much more interesting.

2117
02:01:20.079 --> 02:01:21.319
Let's see what's up there.

2118
02:01:23.680 --> 02:01:37.079
Engage, Okay,