Aug. 23, 2025

Episode 650 SNW Doubleplay "Through the Lens of Time"/ "The Sehlat Who Ate Its Own Tail" discussion

Episode 650 SNW Doubleplay "Through the Lens of Time"/ "The Sehlat Who Ate Its Own Tail" discussion
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Join Uncle Jim and his Cohosts we delve into the intricate themes of good and evil as portrayed in the Star Trek universe. Join us as we explore how Star Trek challenges our perceptions of morality, the duality of characters, and the ethical dilemmas faced by the crew. Discover how these timeless narratives continue to resonate with audiences, offering profound insights into the human condition. Tune in for a thought-provoking journey through the cosmos, where the lines between right and wrong are often blurred, Fan reactions and FAN SHOUT-OUTS. HIT IT!
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Continue with the operation. You may have been ready and they.

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Notice Kane and again it's gone insane. Logan six corporal.

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He's to Jim at Doney to fixed Pripley NBC did

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everily cannot see bumblebee Kane. I'm the doctor Rankling Online,

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Old Bob Sam World Stories, Little Twist and turned Bow

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to cemita death of Tashi Yah Flash Gordon Protest, Don't Prison,

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Clone Wars, James Holden Tweaky, John Coney against.

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Yankee talk about the series. You can join us up

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about the series. This show series.

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Well, good evening Trekkies and Trekkers around the globe. But

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it's Thursday, August twenty first, twenty twenty five. Welcome to

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episode six hundred and fifty of Trek Talk and Hard

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to Believe. I'm your most excellent hosts, Uncle Jim, Welcome

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to the show. Before we go too far, I'd like

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to introduce my awesome trek sperts. And let's start out

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in Portland with Paul the toy guy. How you doing, Paul?

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You did?

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Paul's doing really good? Oh no, there he is?

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How technologically ineptive me So I'm terrible terrible to have

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that happen, No, doing well. It's it's been an okay week,

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bracing ourselves for yet another end of summer heat wave

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here which I will be disdaining as much as possible,

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but doing all right.

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Good, good to hear it. And also from Portland we

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have Eric. How you doing?

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Eric?

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Well, let's just say Jim that tonight's podcast will decidedly

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be the best part of my day.

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Well, it is Friday's eve, so yep, that's true. And

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not from Portland but from Virginia, we have V. How

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you doing tonight?

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V doing great? We've got the.

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Coastal flood warnings because of the hurricane, but I think

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we'll be all right.

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Maybe get some rain, a little bit of rain.

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Our miracle all right, a miracle worker himself, David, the

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guy who makes all this possible. He is from Portland

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as well. Welcome to the show. How you doing, David?

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How much?

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Switching over the star wars.

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You trader?

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Nothing wrong with that?

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And not from Portland but from Las Vegas. We have

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Charles with us tonight. How are you doing tonight? Charles?

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And they're hanging in there, busy week at school and

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we are getting the heat wave that Portland might be

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enjoying next week.

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A little heat wave is good. I have a feeling

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that when winter gets here and we got eight feet

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of snow and it's twenty two blow zero, you'll be

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begging for a little bit of heat. No, I guess

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it's all relative.

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No, I'm not gonna be one degrees.

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Yeah.

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I wouldn't bet on that, buddy. I I prefer the

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Arctic conditions like the cold. Listen, I don't want the

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freaking heat.

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Yes, well, I'm with you on that.

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Not my jam No.

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So uh, you guys can head over to patreon dot

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com back slash Truck Talking podcast and become a patron

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over there for only two dollars. We'd appreciate it keeps

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the podcast going. If you can also head over to

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Trek Talking dot com make a one time donation through

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PayPal if you would like to, And we have a

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great show for you guys tonight because I was on

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vacation last week. We're gonna not cover one, but two

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episodes of Strange New Worlds. It's a double play of

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Star Trek tonight, so we have a lot to talk about.

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We also have our fans shout out, so that's where

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we go around the globe and thank people just like

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you right there for supporting our podcast and listening to it.

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We also have a couple of Star Trek polls tonight.

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One of them is Evil Real I wonder what our

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fans thought and ensign Dana Gable. He's not a red Shirt,

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but he was treated like one. We're going to see

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what you guys thought about that in our polls. And

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what Star Trek actor do you share a birthday with.

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We're not actually gonna do birthdays this week because we

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have two episodes, but I think it's important to do

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our remembrances, so we're going to have Eric do some

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remembrances for this week, and that is going to be

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our podcast. You can head over to Trek Talking dot

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com look for the Livelong and Prosper at the top

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of the page and tell us where you are listening from.

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Look for a heart next to your name from yours truly,

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Uncle Jim. And we've lots of emojis. Emojis get my

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attention and you'll probably get picked if you leave some emojis.

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So Eric, you want to get us started off with

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our fans shout outs for tonight.

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Sure, do our first fan shout out this week goes

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over to a place that I think is probably responsible

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for most of our fan shout outs. We have a

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lot of support over there in the UK, and we're

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saying hello this week to Tim ayer Swain, who hails

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from Sheffield. Thanks Tim for listening to our podcast and

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for supporting us on the internet. It makes us feel seen.

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Really appreciate it. Also saying hello this week to Alex Patnick,

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who is from Israel and says, l LAP. I think

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everybody on this podcast news what that means. L LAP

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right back to you, Alex, and can I follow that

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up with a piece and long life. Also saying hello

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this week to Peter Stringer, who hails from Hamilton in

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New Zealand, way way way on that other side of

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the planet. Really appreciate your support, Peter. I always wanted

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to visit New Zealand. I hope to make it there

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one of these days. And speaking of New Zealand in

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that general area of the world, we'd also like to

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say hello to Leoni Radford, who says that they're from Australia.

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Big country, could be anywhere, Leoni, maybe you live everywhere

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and that does it for my shout outs, Charles, who

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would you like to say hello to?

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Oh, let's start off with a warrant greeting to Teresa

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Grigo from Marysville, Washington, north of Seattle. I'll be near

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your area the Woods treesa next week. Welcome to Chris

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Lupeky from southern Oregon checking in with the A. Yeah,

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live long and prosper Joe Joe Torelli from Philly, Pennsylvania.

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Welcome Joe. And Doc Wayson from Rocket City aka Huntsville, Alabama.

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Welcome Doc. The who's on your list?

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Well, I have first off Mike Campbell, who says I

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live on the outer banks of North Carolina in Kildevil Hill.

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So hope you're doing all right there, Mike with the

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hurricane Aaron that you're safe out there. And next Tory

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Parker from Stockton, California. Then Susie Coon says I am

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from California originally, but now I am a resident of

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Virginia the last twenty years. Well, I'm with you here

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in Virginia. I don't know where you are, but yeah,

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we're not that big, but big enough. Then last, but

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certainly not least, Alana white Star from Columbia, Maryland, and

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she says it's between Baltimore and Washington, DC. All right,

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onto you, Paul, Thank Youve.

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First of all, let's head over to Slovakia and say

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hello to our friend Katerina dr Konska, a Star Trek

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fan from Slovakia whose TV hero is John luc Picard.

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Many thumbs up in favor of Jean Luke from Katerina.

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Great to hear from you, Katerina. I hope that the

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summer is treating you well. We have also felicitations from

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Costa Rica, land of Pora Vida, and our friend Maryland Calderon,

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mora phenomenal country. I was fortunate enough to be able

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to visit there myself a couple of years ago, and

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it is spectacular. A lot of expats moving down there

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and leaving the United States behind. I can see why.

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Pretty spectacular part of the world, though, and so good

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for you hanging your hat there, and it sounds like

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you're still able to partake of Star Trek even in

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those southern climes, so that's pretty fantastic. Going back over

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to the continent there, Sasa Stimak from Croatia is whipping

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out the Bulcan greedom to us there Sassia. Great to

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hear from you, and over in Italia.

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Where a lot of us are very fond.

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We have a friend, Francesco Frascati from Prato in Tuscany, saying,

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live long and prosper Prato is a municipality, it's not

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that far from Florence, very famous since medieval times for

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emphasis of textile production, big influence in the world of fashion.

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So as you can see, there are all kinds of

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diverse folks all across the globe who share the wonderful

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commonality of their united enthusiasm for Star Trek. And I

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think even Jim knows a few. Is that true, Uncle Jim,

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do you know some Star Trek fans?

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I absolutely do. We want to say, first and foremost,

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thank you so much to Debbie Elmore Creek, who's listening

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to us in Arkansas right now. Thank you, Debbie. I

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have a top fan, Dan Boyle in North Providence, Rhode Island.

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Thank you so much. To Dan, and another top fan,

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Mary Stefan from Pennsylvania, Thank you so much. And last

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but not least, Mary el Silva, who's listening to us

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in Florida. Once again, if you guys would like to

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be mentioned on a fan shout out. Head over to

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Trek Talking and Beyond on Facebook look for to Live

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Long and Prosper. Tell us where you're from, and maybe

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send us a picture so you can be up there

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like Paul right now with that good looking kling on.

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You can send us your pictures. There's me and my

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daughter Jamie at Trek Conderoga a couple of years ago,

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and your picture will be right up there with all

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of the rest. So please do that, all right, guys

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up our fans shout outs, and now time for our

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Star Trek polls, which can only mean one thing.

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Eric Lin Lin Lin you know me like no Win

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what you thought about the show. Then we try to

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share your opinions with all of our minions out there

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because they listen worldwide. So tell us just what you think.

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Get together we will alter Canara and robilin an.

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Excellent song. I love it every time I hear it

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at any rate. Why you guys are over at Trek

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Talking and Beyond on Facebook telling us where you hail from.

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You can also take place in our polls. Every week

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I put up a couple of different questions and we

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ask you guys what you thought, so, David roll the

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tape for our first one.

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Good gila, All right there for that, David one, good questions, Eric.

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Thanks for my reliving my PTSD there. I appreciate that.

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Were you surprised when we lost Ensign Dana Gamble played

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by Chris Meyer on his first away mission, and of

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course he doesn't die in that scene, but he dies later,

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which is lots of fun.

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Hell.

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Yes, ninety percent of our responders said they were surprised

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when we lost him on his first away mission, and

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only ten percent said they saw it come in. So

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what do we all think? Did y'all see it come

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in or was it a surprise?

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Well, before we go too far, I have spoken with

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Chris Myers, and he's going to come on this podcast

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too long from now, so you guys will have an

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opportunity to ask him about that in person. So keep

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an eye on our Facebook page. I'll get that posted

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as soon as I confirm with his publicist. But you know,

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I was surprised, but I also wasn't because one of

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my problems is it was very trophy when they when

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they follow a character around and they focus on a

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character and he's like, oh, it was my first enterprise,

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I love it here, and then they kill that character

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very trophy, I was. I was surprised that they did,

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especially when I was going to have him on the

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podcast and now he was dead. But at any rate,

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I was surprised by it myself. How about you, Paul, Yeah,

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I didn't really see it coming.

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I thought, you know, it's just you know, because because

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I'm keep laboring under the misapprehension the chapel is going

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to go away for a while and some extended tour

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of duty with the uh this, you know, their core

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big talent, and so I thought, oh, this will be

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like the replacement, right because you know, junior medical officer

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and new character. You know, it's uh and it's it's

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a real uh horror movie.

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Uh.

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We were talking about tropes, Jim. It's a real horror

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movie cliche. I wouldn't even call it a trope. It's

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like a cliche hopefully have grown where you killed the

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black guy in the horror movie. And I'm really surprised

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that they went for that. I was just like, that's

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you know, kind of I thought, you know, we're always

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talking about evolving tost our shortcomings, and that's kind of

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a shortcoming, So I was a little surprised that they

236
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would go down that road. I'd be really curious to

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hear if we are in fact able to get Chris

238
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Meyer on the show. I'd like to love to get

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his tack on that, because you.

240
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See that definitely wants to come on the show. It's just, yeah,

241
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he's going to be here a horror movie. They did

242
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kill the blue guy, though, well there is the blue

243
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The blue guy got disintegrated when he ran at the door.

244
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He killed the blue guy.

245
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But yeah, I was a little surprised to see that

246
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that's the direction they went. But you know, we'll chat

247
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about that more. We'll eat dissect the episode.

248
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Absolutely, we will for sure. How about you, David, were

249
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you surprised to see Ends and Gable bite the dust?

250
00:15:30.919 --> 00:15:31.120
Yeah?

251
00:15:31.320 --> 00:15:34.639
I was actually thought he was going to get healed,

252
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because when he was in the trio getting his eyes regenerated,

253
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I thought they were going to bring him back and everything.

254
00:15:40.440 --> 00:15:41.200
For some other reason.

255
00:15:42.000 --> 00:15:43.679
When they put the glasses on, I was like, wait

256
00:15:43.679 --> 00:15:46.440
a minute, it's just a relative of Judy LaForge. So

257
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I was like maybe, but yeah, I was surprised.

258
00:15:50.759 --> 00:15:55.159
But and what about you, Charles, did you see it coming.

259
00:15:56.519 --> 00:15:59.200
No, did not see it coming. I thought the way

260
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they were kind of building up on that character, he's

261
00:16:01.240 --> 00:16:04.840
going to be a new reoccurring character. Didn't expect them

262
00:16:04.919 --> 00:16:07.919
to kind of send him off.

263
00:16:09.240 --> 00:16:10.559
Though. Is he really gone?

264
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I guess we'll have to talk about that.

265
00:16:14.720 --> 00:16:16.840
Yeah, when he comes back on the podcast, we can

266
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ask him. And it looks like we lost V, so

267
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we'll move on to our second. No, we got V back.

268
00:16:23.279 --> 00:16:23.960
There she is V.

269
00:16:24.279 --> 00:16:30.080
Yes, yeah, I had great I had great Internet, and

270
00:16:30.200 --> 00:16:33.879
then the last couple of days it's been crapping out

271
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on me.

272
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So anyway, Yes, So.

273
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Were you surprised to see Ensign Gable bite the dust

274
00:16:42.120 --> 00:16:43.720
on his very first away team.

275
00:16:44.039 --> 00:16:47.960
Yes, I was, because he was just adorable and so eager.

276
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I guess he was asking for it because he was

277
00:16:50.759 --> 00:16:54.919
so so sweet and earnest, But I was upset for

278
00:16:55.600 --> 00:16:58.639
and Benga, who looked upon him like, you know he

279
00:16:59.519 --> 00:17:04.200
I could tell that he was really sort of enamored

280
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with this young man and looking forward to taking him

281
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under his wing, so to speak.

282
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So yeah, I was. I was.

283
00:17:13.960 --> 00:17:16.000
I was a little bit shocked, especially the way he.

284
00:17:17.480 --> 00:17:21.279
The whole now, the whole storyline that was interesting with

285
00:17:21.440 --> 00:17:25.440
the connection, possibly with the Gorn and and all that.

286
00:17:25.720 --> 00:17:29.319
But yeah, I was definitely, But.

287
00:17:29.400 --> 00:17:33.079
That tracks with you had Bruce Horreck and Hammer died,

288
00:17:33.240 --> 00:17:37.039
so now we've got Gamble, So that seems to be

289
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a theme.

290
00:17:39.440 --> 00:17:42.160
They bite the dust on Pike ships, for sure, don't they.

291
00:17:42.720 --> 00:17:42.920
Yep?

292
00:17:43.240 --> 00:17:46.240
All right, guys. So that's our first poll question, and

293
00:17:46.440 --> 00:17:48.799
we do have another one because these things always travel

294
00:17:48.839 --> 00:17:54.920
in pairs. So, David roll the tape, were they evil? Captain?

295
00:17:57.279 --> 00:17:59.079
I saw the recordings of what Gamble did and the

296
00:17:59.119 --> 00:17:59.640
things he said.

297
00:18:00.160 --> 00:18:01.839
Good and evil or relative terms on.

298
00:18:03.319 --> 00:18:03.839
Nonsense?

299
00:18:04.559 --> 00:18:09.240
There is evil in this universe as sure as there

300
00:18:09.400 --> 00:18:15.039
is good, sure as there is matter, as sure.

301
00:18:14.799 --> 00:18:15.920
As there is light.

302
00:18:17.440 --> 00:18:17.799
I know.

303
00:18:19.799 --> 00:18:26.079
That b was ancient, my leverent.

304
00:18:27.240 --> 00:18:33.559
That desired to my line to pervert and consume giving

305
00:18:33.759 --> 00:18:39.319
core pro form. If any of those things.

306
00:18:40.519 --> 00:18:42.880
Ever escape, that well known mare.

307
00:18:46.119 --> 00:18:54.519
Goods And there you have it. So, Eric, what was

308
00:18:54.599 --> 00:18:55.359
our poll question?

309
00:18:57.039 --> 00:19:00.359
Well, this is a very interesting pole questions. So in

310
00:19:00.519 --> 00:19:02.799
the Strange New World's episode Through the Lens of Time,

311
00:19:02.920 --> 00:19:05.519
Pelly asserts that the Vesda life form is an example

312
00:19:05.559 --> 00:19:09.039
of pure evil. She strongly disagrees with Pike's view that

313
00:19:09.079 --> 00:19:11.799
good and evil are relative stating that the vesda's actions

314
00:19:11.880 --> 00:19:17.200
clearly demonstrate the existence of true evil. Pelly warns that

315
00:19:17.319 --> 00:19:21.400
this entity must be contained and never allowed to escape.

316
00:19:21.480 --> 00:19:26.000
Do you agree with her? So I'm not sure which

317
00:19:26.039 --> 00:19:28.680
one we're asking if they agree if it's the evil

318
00:19:28.720 --> 00:19:31.559
part or the should be contained and never allowed to escape.

319
00:19:31.599 --> 00:19:35.119
But either way, ninety nine percent of our responders said

320
00:19:35.200 --> 00:19:38.599
yes to whichever question we were asking, and one percent

321
00:19:38.799 --> 00:19:44.759
said no. For me, if the question is does evil exist,

322
00:19:44.880 --> 00:19:47.519
I'm with Pike Man. I think it's all relative. But

323
00:19:49.799 --> 00:19:52.119
that's probably an unpopular opinion.

324
00:19:52.440 --> 00:19:56.480
So you're you're the one guy that answered no.

325
00:19:57.279 --> 00:20:01.799
I mean I would definitely answer that because evil is

326
00:20:01.880 --> 00:20:06.839
a definition that we put on certain behaviors that is subjective,

327
00:20:07.039 --> 00:20:10.359
and it's subjective relative to your culture. It's subjective relative

328
00:20:10.400 --> 00:20:14.480
to your religion, your race, your sex, like just about

329
00:20:14.599 --> 00:20:21.640
everything out there plays into definitions of words like good

330
00:20:21.839 --> 00:20:24.559
and evil. What is good? Well, I could ask twenty

331
00:20:24.599 --> 00:20:27.799
five different people what good means and they would all

332
00:20:28.319 --> 00:20:29.240
say something different.

333
00:20:29.319 --> 00:20:29.440
Right.

334
00:20:30.160 --> 00:20:33.240
In fact, I could ask twenty five people is killing

335
00:20:33.400 --> 00:20:38.000
somebody evil? And I guarantee a certain handful of people

336
00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:41.160
would say, Well, it depends on who the person is right,

337
00:20:41.640 --> 00:20:43.880
So I think it's all relative.

338
00:20:45.160 --> 00:20:47.000
How about you, v What do you think?

339
00:20:48.440 --> 00:20:52.200
Well, yeah, that I think I'm with I'm with Pellia

340
00:20:52.319 --> 00:20:55.920
on this one. And I'm finally starting to warm up

341
00:20:55.960 --> 00:20:59.039
to the character because she was I don't know, she

342
00:20:59.240 --> 00:21:04.079
just stopped. She's been around longer than anybody as we're discovering,

343
00:21:04.400 --> 00:21:08.519
and so she knows what I mean. She's seen some stuff, man,

344
00:21:09.119 --> 00:21:13.119
So I agree it should sort of like I was

345
00:21:13.200 --> 00:21:18.400
thinking about on Next Gen the Skin of Evil with Armis,

346
00:21:18.519 --> 00:21:22.880
and it's like how he was the condensation of evil,

347
00:21:22.960 --> 00:21:25.079
but then they wound up having to put you know,

348
00:21:25.160 --> 00:21:28.519
after he did all those horrible things and killed Yar

349
00:21:28.599 --> 00:21:29.119
and whatnot.

350
00:21:29.240 --> 00:21:30.400
He was never too.

351
00:21:31.279 --> 00:21:37.880
They didn't want him to ever escape. So I agree that,

352
00:21:38.039 --> 00:21:41.759
you know, some things need to be contained and never

353
00:21:42.559 --> 00:21:44.759
never let go, never allowed to escape.

354
00:21:46.559 --> 00:21:48.039
How about you, Charles, what do you think?

355
00:21:49.720 --> 00:21:51.799
I'm going to kind of agree with Pellya. I think

356
00:21:51.880 --> 00:21:56.279
in answering the question that this thing needs to be contained. Yes,

357
00:21:56.400 --> 00:21:58.599
I think it does need to be contained because we

358
00:21:58.720 --> 00:22:03.279
don't know what these beings are capable of and how

359
00:22:03.440 --> 00:22:10.680
dangerous they might be. This was just an example of one, and.

360
00:22:10.799 --> 00:22:15.960
Even the Blue guy admitted it's evil, and Spot did

361
00:22:16.079 --> 00:22:18.000
say that when he looked through the glasses there were

362
00:22:18.079 --> 00:22:22.799
thousands of them in that. Well, yeah, lots and lots

363
00:22:22.839 --> 00:22:23.079
of them.

364
00:22:24.119 --> 00:22:34.720
How about you, David, we're speaking about the pace. Yeah,

365
00:22:35.119 --> 00:22:41.039
I agree with Pelia that evil does exist. Good exist

366
00:22:41.759 --> 00:22:45.880
whether or not could be dependent on culture, religion or whatnot.

367
00:22:46.079 --> 00:22:52.519
But honestly, I have to agree with Pelia that evil

368
00:22:52.559 --> 00:22:55.640
does need to be contained because if it gets loose,

369
00:22:56.039 --> 00:23:01.000
you know what to stop it. So unless you're talking

370
00:23:01.039 --> 00:23:02.599
about if it is a Paula everything you got this

371
00:23:02.640 --> 00:23:08.359
select a temple. But still either way, yeah, I would

372
00:23:08.359 --> 00:23:09.680
have to agree with Kelly on this one.

373
00:23:10.960 --> 00:23:12.000
Well, Paul, what do you think?

374
00:23:13.720 --> 00:23:15.559
Well, it's not as simple as that. I don't think

375
00:23:15.640 --> 00:23:18.240
I think you know. I hear what Eric is saying

376
00:23:18.319 --> 00:23:24.400
about it being subjective, but truth being, we are defined.

377
00:23:24.519 --> 00:23:27.200
Everything we defined is to be defined by the culture

378
00:23:27.519 --> 00:23:30.799
where we find ourselves and where we live. Right, and

379
00:23:30.960 --> 00:23:33.440
I mean nature in itself can be just looking at

380
00:23:33.519 --> 00:23:37.039
anything in nature, right, you see a crocodile goes up

381
00:23:37.079 --> 00:23:40.039
and eats a bird. Is it wilfully killing another life form?

382
00:23:40.160 --> 00:23:43.039
Yes it is, but it's also just surviving, right, So

383
00:23:43.160 --> 00:23:48.039
it's but within the world of crocodiles, its behavior is normal, right,

384
00:23:48.119 --> 00:23:51.720
it's just existing, same with sharks. Right within the world

385
00:23:51.799 --> 00:23:55.079
of the bird who's being eaten, then it becomes a

386
00:23:55.119 --> 00:23:56.880
different thing. So all we can really do is judge

387
00:23:56.960 --> 00:23:59.880
things by the society we live in. In our society,

388
00:24:00.160 --> 00:24:03.920
if you and in the Federation society. You know, if

389
00:24:05.119 --> 00:24:07.039
we see on the show, right, if you were talking

390
00:24:07.039 --> 00:24:11.839
about beings that are wilfully, maliciously harming others, right, doing

391
00:24:11.920 --> 00:24:15.079
so with not just for food or survival, but with

392
00:24:15.400 --> 00:24:19.319
malicious intent on purpose, knowing that it's causing you know,

393
00:24:19.640 --> 00:24:25.240
a horrific evil, then yeah, it's evil, right, I mean,

394
00:24:25.400 --> 00:24:28.200
all we can do is judge by the society. What

395
00:24:28.480 --> 00:24:30.599
are the barriers and definitions we have in our society?

396
00:24:31.039 --> 00:24:34.599
Like for me, for example, right, the Holocaust, you know,

397
00:24:34.880 --> 00:24:38.079
it's evil. It is evil. There's no justification for that,

398
00:24:38.240 --> 00:24:41.000
there's no Oh, well from where they're sitting, they were

399
00:24:41.039 --> 00:24:44.960
perfectly No, you're fucking evil and you should die, you know,

400
00:24:45.079 --> 00:24:47.440
And if you perpetrate that, there's no excuse for that,

401
00:24:48.000 --> 00:24:49.960
because then we're going off the edges of the map

402
00:24:50.079 --> 00:24:54.160
and it's terror incognita and you just simply cannot have

403
00:24:54.359 --> 00:24:56.759
that if you want a society to be cohesive and

404
00:24:56.839 --> 00:24:58.279
hold together, so you have to be able to at

405
00:24:58.359 --> 00:25:02.279
some point draw the line we're gonna lose everything, So

406
00:25:02.519 --> 00:25:05.359
you know, I mean, I think despite her, you know,

407
00:25:05.519 --> 00:25:08.200
history honics, I think that that's what Pella was trying

408
00:25:08.240 --> 00:25:10.640
to get. And we'll we'll dig into this, I think

409
00:25:10.720 --> 00:25:14.119
more when we talk about the episode natural lot such

410
00:25:14.160 --> 00:25:16.640
as it was for the episode, so I think we'll hopefully,

411
00:25:16.839 --> 00:25:19.920
you know, have a little bit more chance to explore.

412
00:25:23.039 --> 00:25:26.000
Well, she she is over five thousand years old, so

413
00:25:26.119 --> 00:25:30.839
she's got Yoda beat, so she's she and she she

414
00:25:31.200 --> 00:25:35.000
was a roadie for the Dead som and she has

415
00:25:35.039 --> 00:25:38.839
an Atari twenty six hundred, so she's been around. She's

416
00:25:38.920 --> 00:25:41.440
been around. But yeah, I agree with her. I think

417
00:25:41.559 --> 00:25:44.799
I think evil does exist, and evil does need to

418
00:25:44.839 --> 00:25:48.559
be contained. It can't be set free to roam the

419
00:25:48.640 --> 00:25:52.640
world and do as it pleases. So I'm with Dominions

420
00:25:52.680 --> 00:25:56.319
on that one. And that, my friends, wraps up our

421
00:25:56.400 --> 00:25:58.359
poll questions for this week. I'll put some more up

422
00:25:58.400 --> 00:26:01.519
for next week and go to Talking and Beyond and

423
00:26:01.640 --> 00:26:04.839
check it out. And now it's time for our condet

424
00:26:05.000 --> 00:26:09.400
training with Charles through the lens of time and take

425
00:26:09.440 --> 00:26:13.720
it away. Charles, Okay, thank you, Jim.

426
00:26:16.119 --> 00:26:19.480
Trying to break down how to do this episode, and

427
00:26:19.599 --> 00:26:24.799
I thought possessions, somebody being possessed, and I grabbed just

428
00:26:24.960 --> 00:26:31.319
a handful of episodes COS returned to Tomorrow where some

429
00:26:31.480 --> 00:26:36.079
of the crew was taken over by other beings. Tng

430
00:26:36.359 --> 00:26:39.799
Mask is a good one where data is taken over

431
00:26:41.079 --> 00:26:51.319
by a being. TNG's power Play and Voyagers Cathotics all

432
00:26:51.400 --> 00:26:56.880
were examples of possessions. Now on Be's comment was rather interesting.

433
00:26:58.799 --> 00:27:02.920
I windos is curious and typed in a search and

434
00:27:03.079 --> 00:27:08.200
did star trek Evil and the first hit I got

435
00:27:08.440 --> 00:27:15.519
was Artemis. Of course, DNG's Skin of Evil is definitely

436
00:27:15.599 --> 00:27:24.240
an example. DNG's will always have Paris, his data stuck

437
00:27:24.359 --> 00:27:29.400
in time and a time continuing where three of them exist.

438
00:27:30.880 --> 00:27:35.519
We talk on the episode where where our whole crew

439
00:27:35.599 --> 00:27:39.640
members on the on the planet, but they're in different places,

440
00:27:41.000 --> 00:27:43.839
but they're still there. Kind of reminded me of that.

441
00:27:45.640 --> 00:27:52.599
Of course, Gambit mentioned Stranger Worlds the Alethian Alethian Kingdom

442
00:27:54.359 --> 00:27:57.440
where Gambit was talking to and Bega about his daughter

443
00:28:01.160 --> 00:28:06.440
and TG's times Arrow That to part was a good

444
00:28:06.519 --> 00:28:11.079
example of phase variants because they were dealing with two

445
00:28:11.119 --> 00:28:18.119
different times. But here are some examples of stuff I

446
00:28:18.240 --> 00:28:26.039
pulled off discussing through the Lens of Time. But I

447
00:28:26.119 --> 00:28:27.640
wonder what the fans thought about this?

448
00:28:30.480 --> 00:28:33.759
Yeah, every week on our Facebook page Truck Talking and Beyond,

449
00:28:33.799 --> 00:28:36.079
I asked that same question to score the episode on

450
00:28:36.119 --> 00:28:39.839
a scale of one to ten and Eric, what did

451
00:28:39.960 --> 00:28:43.119
our Facebook fans think about through the Lens of Time?

452
00:28:44.519 --> 00:28:48.759
Carol Robin Drescher said ten layered with cannon and science

453
00:28:48.880 --> 00:28:52.680
with an extra added creepy Did anyone else feel reminded

454
00:28:52.720 --> 00:28:55.960
of the TOS episode with the formless Jack, the ripper

455
00:28:56.119 --> 00:29:02.119
entity that thrived on fear very interesting? Vance Major Owen

456
00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:04.839
said eight. I think it's my favorite of the season,

457
00:29:04.920 --> 00:29:07.680
but overall, I've not been on a rush to watch

458
00:29:07.759 --> 00:29:11.000
these episodes this season like I have in the past two.

459
00:29:12.559 --> 00:29:16.480
Jerry Lee said a nine recognized pieces of another sci

460
00:29:16.640 --> 00:29:23.279
fi movie, Disappointed the young Man died. Roy Bassave said

461
00:29:23.440 --> 00:29:28.519
ten plus spoiler alert. Indiana Jones the Last Crusade is honored,

462
00:29:28.920 --> 00:29:34.240
just saying. Katie m thornken Kinch said I called it

463
00:29:34.319 --> 00:29:37.400
from the start, told my hubs what was going to

464
00:29:37.480 --> 00:29:40.640
happen and hand out that way. Still loved it though.

465
00:29:41.400 --> 00:29:44.960
Eight Kitty is a top fan on our Facebook page.

466
00:29:45.960 --> 00:29:51.119
James Yakura said, look, Paramount, just because you're doing horror

467
00:29:51.680 --> 00:29:53.079
doesn't mean you have to kill.

468
00:29:52.920 --> 00:29:56.359
The black guy. Five. Thanks you, James.

469
00:29:57.640 --> 00:30:01.000
Susie McGovern so far. I like them all, even the

470
00:30:01.079 --> 00:30:02.559
wedding and the musical.

471
00:30:03.039 --> 00:30:03.319
Nine.

472
00:30:04.640 --> 00:30:11.680
Kathy Cornell said ridiculous two, Richard A. Rivera said one

473
00:30:12.599 --> 00:30:18.400
not impressed, and Shannie David said, I it was a

474
00:30:18.599 --> 00:30:21.799
genuinely creepy and disconcerting episode, but Pelly is a line

475
00:30:21.920 --> 00:30:24.680
at the end killed me, and I love how in

476
00:30:24.759 --> 00:30:27.359
the show it is way too easy to ease tension

477
00:30:27.480 --> 00:30:31.680
and deliver a funny line. But in character it was here.

478
00:30:33.319 --> 00:30:37.240
But in character it was here being genuinely disturbed and

479
00:30:37.359 --> 00:30:40.559
then recovering and playing it off. I think they're saying

480
00:30:40.599 --> 00:30:44.519
that in character, these people took the funny line and

481
00:30:44.640 --> 00:30:47.880
played it off. But you know, from an audience perspective,

482
00:30:48.880 --> 00:30:51.440
pelly Is line at the end of her amazing speech

483
00:30:51.799 --> 00:30:55.319
sort of made the whole thing like comedy. That's my guess.

484
00:30:56.039 --> 00:31:00.440
Thanks Shannie. He gave it a nine, so that gives

485
00:31:00.559 --> 00:31:04.920
us a fan score of seven. Point one. Seven point

486
00:31:04.960 --> 00:31:05.599
one's pretty good.

487
00:31:06.680 --> 00:31:10.039
That's very respectable. Now, before we talk about the episode,

488
00:31:10.079 --> 00:31:13.400
we're going to have Paul give us a quick rundown. Paul,

489
00:31:13.799 --> 00:31:17.279
the mic is yours, Alko Jam. Thanks.

490
00:31:17.319 --> 00:31:19.920
So we're talking about season three, episode five, Through the

491
00:31:20.000 --> 00:31:22.839
Lens of Time, which I don't know is the greatest

492
00:31:23.359 --> 00:31:26.759
episode title for what we see happening in terms of

493
00:31:26.799 --> 00:31:31.559
the plot, but that's irregardless. Chapel and Krby have been

494
00:31:31.599 --> 00:31:34.240
on this quest and they lead the Enterprise to these

495
00:31:34.359 --> 00:31:36.519
ancient ruins on this planet that's hiding at a very

496
00:31:36.559 --> 00:31:37.240
dark secret.

497
00:31:37.440 --> 00:31:37.759
All right.

498
00:31:38.319 --> 00:31:41.400
Ensign Dana Gamble is featured a new character we met

499
00:31:41.400 --> 00:31:43.720
a couple of episodes ago, played by actor Chris Myers.

500
00:31:44.880 --> 00:31:49.200
Chapel and doctor Krby investigate these ancient ruins on Vadia nine,

501
00:31:49.440 --> 00:31:52.400
and they discovered this very powerful non corporeal entity called

502
00:31:52.440 --> 00:31:57.720
the Vezda, not the Vespa, but the Vezda, which possesses

503
00:31:58.559 --> 00:32:04.839
Ensign Gamble. After they're violently blinding him, and the Vesda

504
00:32:05.079 --> 00:32:08.240
tries to escape its containment and poses a whole new

505
00:32:08.440 --> 00:32:13.079
threat to the Enterprise crew and potentially establishing a recurring

506
00:32:13.279 --> 00:32:15.920
enemy in terms of how things are left there. So

507
00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:20.440
we're talking about themes of ancient civilizations, superior sinister technologies,

508
00:32:20.839 --> 00:32:25.240
and these ancient ruins, which at first we're thinking might

509
00:32:25.279 --> 00:32:28.680
be a temple or whatnot, turned out to be the

510
00:32:28.920 --> 00:32:33.799
surmises that there was a prison to come contain the VESDA,

511
00:32:34.039 --> 00:32:39.880
and then we basically end with this scene that's meant

512
00:32:39.880 --> 00:32:42.920
to be quite disturbing, where we see the Enterprise Computer

513
00:32:43.359 --> 00:32:47.960
Interface changing languages to I think intimate that the VESDA

514
00:32:48.039 --> 00:32:51.200
are not defeated but just simply contained and they could

515
00:32:51.559 --> 00:32:55.880
pose a threat to re emerge later. So kind of

516
00:32:55.920 --> 00:33:01.200
a new villain. I think this is Stranger Worlds trying

517
00:33:01.200 --> 00:33:04.799
to get a little deeper into Lovecraftian territory. I would say,

518
00:33:06.720 --> 00:33:08.640
not the kind of thing that we've typically seen that

519
00:33:08.880 --> 00:33:10.839
much of on Star Trek. I mean, have you ever now?

520
00:33:10.880 --> 00:33:13.200
And then I mean that one of our fans referenced

521
00:33:13.240 --> 00:33:16.000
the original series episode The Wolf in the Fold, and

522
00:33:16.680 --> 00:33:20.680
then Charles mentioned the Aliens and Times era, which is

523
00:33:20.839 --> 00:33:24.039
I think another indication though they had their own weird

524
00:33:24.920 --> 00:33:29.319
fools that seemed to be borderline evil, So you can

525
00:33:29.359 --> 00:33:31.200
get into it a little bit of debate on that.

526
00:33:32.440 --> 00:33:35.720
This movie episode reminded me a lot of a picture

527
00:33:35.839 --> 00:33:39.480
from the late nineties. I'm sure Jim's seen it the

528
00:33:39.480 --> 00:33:45.039
Event Horizon. Familiar with that one, Lawrence Fishburne, Sam Neil,

529
00:33:45.720 --> 00:33:51.160
but such a good Yeah, very stylistic, but very much

530
00:33:51.279 --> 00:33:53.759
kind of dipping a toe into the science fiction end

531
00:33:53.880 --> 00:33:58.599
of especially when Pella talks about ancient evil. It's you know,

532
00:33:58.680 --> 00:34:01.359
it starts to call to mind like the old ones

533
00:34:01.599 --> 00:34:04.680
that not from what are Little Girls made of? But

534
00:34:04.759 --> 00:34:07.799
the other old ones, the ones that Lovecraft referred to,

535
00:34:08.000 --> 00:34:13.239
the ancient you know, evil entities from the deep bowels

536
00:34:13.280 --> 00:34:15.440
of space. So that's kind of where we were going.

537
00:34:16.400 --> 00:34:19.280
These looked more like parasites though where they were you know,

538
00:34:19.400 --> 00:34:22.239
kind of in contained in these like little you know,

539
00:34:23.280 --> 00:34:29.760
containment spheres. David mentioned it earlier. Definitely evoked like the

540
00:34:29.840 --> 00:34:31.960
pod raiths for me, the idea of some kind of

541
00:34:32.320 --> 00:34:36.519
you know, you know, objectively evil life form that's out

542
00:34:36.559 --> 00:34:38.639
there that's mostly non corporeal, but as the ability to

543
00:34:39.480 --> 00:34:42.400
possess others. So that's basically just lay in the groundwork,

544
00:34:42.480 --> 00:34:46.360
friends of what we saw here on this episode. Who's

545
00:34:46.360 --> 00:34:49.119
got an enthusiastic take that just won't wait?

546
00:34:53.599 --> 00:34:56.039
Well, I think we should have ladies go first and

547
00:34:58.199 --> 00:35:00.760
how feminist have you should share her opinion?

548
00:35:01.800 --> 00:35:04.559
All right, so we blanked out there for a second.

549
00:35:04.679 --> 00:35:06.920
What what did what was the question.

550
00:35:08.159 --> 00:35:10.320
To share your take on the episode?

551
00:35:10.760 --> 00:35:15.280
Oh yeah, well I like to I've been sort of

552
00:35:15.719 --> 00:35:19.119
scanning the uh the internet, so to speak, on different

553
00:35:19.360 --> 00:35:23.559
pages and forums and whatnot to see what other people

554
00:35:23.760 --> 00:35:30.199
think of the episode, and this was like overwhelmingly people

555
00:35:30.639 --> 00:35:35.000
were really embracing it, saying it was more of the

556
00:35:35.159 --> 00:35:39.079
you know, doing the whole Star Trek mission exploring strange

557
00:35:39.199 --> 00:35:39.840
new worlds.

558
00:35:41.239 --> 00:35:42.599
Though I would there.

559
00:35:42.519 --> 00:35:45.920
Were a lot of people who were There were a

560
00:35:45.960 --> 00:35:51.199
lot of comments about not liking Corby, and one of

561
00:35:51.320 --> 00:35:55.119
them was I had to laugh because it was like ouch,

562
00:35:56.280 --> 00:36:03.639
they likened Korby to a room temperature glass of skim milk. Oh,

563
00:36:03.880 --> 00:36:08.920
they were not impressed with him, but just the sinister

564
00:36:09.199 --> 00:36:15.199
nature of these beings which I keep calling Vespa, you know,

565
00:36:15.320 --> 00:36:21.559
which is you know, the evil Italian motor scooters. But

566
00:36:22.400 --> 00:36:28.039
when what's her what's her name? Marie sees Gamble and

567
00:36:28.519 --> 00:36:31.320
she uh, because she still has you know, has the

568
00:36:31.400 --> 00:36:35.760
gorn whatever you know, hybrid stuff inside her, and she

569
00:36:36.000 --> 00:36:38.880
just recognizes him and says you and then they just

570
00:36:39.639 --> 00:36:42.360
start fighting and beat the crap out of one another.

571
00:36:42.639 --> 00:36:49.360
So there's there's something between these vesda's and the Gorn.

572
00:36:49.559 --> 00:36:52.280
So I thought that was interesting.

573
00:36:53.239 --> 00:36:55.400
And do you have any do you have any headcanon

574
00:36:55.440 --> 00:37:00.880
on that v on what the the relationship between the wow?

575
00:37:01.159 --> 00:37:04.440
I just something that goes back centuries.

576
00:37:04.480 --> 00:37:04.840
I don't know.

577
00:37:05.719 --> 00:37:08.320
I really didn't didn't have a thought about that other

578
00:37:08.480 --> 00:37:11.320
than I just thought it was interesting that she just,

579
00:37:12.079 --> 00:37:15.960
you know, recognized I wasn't expecting, you know, the Gorn

580
00:37:16.079 --> 00:37:19.760
side of her to come out so so soon, and

581
00:37:19.840 --> 00:37:24.280
that when she sees Gamble she recognizes, so the fact

582
00:37:24.360 --> 00:37:26.119
that she wants to kill this.

583
00:37:26.280 --> 00:37:29.239
Being, It's like, so this, are these worse than the Gorn?

584
00:37:29.440 --> 00:37:32.119
Which I don't know what.

585
00:37:32.239 --> 00:37:34.559
I don't know what we will who knows what we

586
00:37:34.639 --> 00:37:38.199
will learn about them if we will see them come back.

587
00:37:39.239 --> 00:37:42.320
I don't know a lot of intrigue.

588
00:37:42.800 --> 00:37:46.199
I don't know why a couple people thought it was

589
00:37:46.320 --> 00:37:50.400
ridiculous or they just rated it so low, because the

590
00:37:50.559 --> 00:37:54.039
vast majority of fans out there really enjoyed it.

591
00:37:54.440 --> 00:37:57.960
So that's my that's my take.

592
00:38:00.079 --> 00:38:02.119
So what would you rate it VI A score?

593
00:38:02.800 --> 00:38:05.519
I would I would think I would rat it a

594
00:38:08.320 --> 00:38:10.519
good solid eight point five.

595
00:38:10.760 --> 00:38:15.519
How about that eight point five. That's respectable, very respectable.

596
00:38:15.920 --> 00:38:20.559
As far as the Gorn go, Eric, so Pellia, we

597
00:38:20.719 --> 00:38:25.400
learn is over five thousand years old, and she knew

598
00:38:25.519 --> 00:38:29.719
this evil, she recognized it, and and the way that

599
00:38:29.800 --> 00:38:33.519
Patel responded to it, it's obvious that the Gorn also

600
00:38:33.599 --> 00:38:38.920
had to run in with these vespass ves you got me,

601
00:38:40.119 --> 00:38:43.079
you got me on my spaceballs kick with Princess Vespa.

602
00:38:43.199 --> 00:38:46.519
Oh yeah, that's right, that's right, okay, with the Veda.

603
00:38:47.360 --> 00:38:49.480
And so that leads me to think that the Gorn

604
00:38:49.559 --> 00:38:53.000
themselves must be equally as old if they have this,

605
00:38:53.400 --> 00:38:58.199
this this ingrained genetic hatred of the Vezda, and that

606
00:38:58.320 --> 00:39:01.639
she's able to recognize the ve this so quickly. So

607
00:39:01.920 --> 00:39:06.920
obviously the Vesda fooled around with or tortured the Gorn

608
00:39:07.039 --> 00:39:08.960
at some point, kind of like Q likes to do

609
00:39:09.079 --> 00:39:12.440
with people, and that might be why she hated him

610
00:39:12.519 --> 00:39:14.559
so much and reacted the way she did. I mean,

611
00:39:15.360 --> 00:39:18.159
I'm just you know, spitballing here because we really have

612
00:39:18.400 --> 00:39:24.039
no information. But she reacted rather negatively, rather quickly, and

613
00:39:24.280 --> 00:39:28.199
he retaliated as well. So there's definitely something there, Eric,

614
00:39:28.280 --> 00:39:31.320
I just don't know what it might be, but it's

615
00:39:31.480 --> 00:39:36.239
it's there for sure. But how about you, David, what

616
00:39:36.320 --> 00:39:37.480
did you think about the episode?

617
00:39:40.079 --> 00:39:46.360
Yeah, so I enjoyed the beginning where they finally were

618
00:39:46.679 --> 00:39:50.559
exploring during your world and this word is rather strange.

619
00:39:50.639 --> 00:39:51.480
It was mysterious.

620
00:39:52.159 --> 00:39:56.280
It was fun all the way up until I got

621
00:39:56.360 --> 00:39:58.320
taken out of that guy. I was like, okay that course.

622
00:39:58.880 --> 00:40:00.519
So to me, I.

623
00:40:05.039 --> 00:40:08.039
It's really interesting that they got some form of backstory

624
00:40:08.079 --> 00:40:13.880
with the going in the vest Vegta. To me, this

625
00:40:14.119 --> 00:40:17.559
is more of a take of the Benjamin Cisco take

626
00:40:17.760 --> 00:40:23.480
on you know, the Celestial Temple and uh, the Pabas,

627
00:40:23.519 --> 00:40:27.599
because if the going go back that far five thousand

628
00:40:27.760 --> 00:40:33.280
or so years or even further, I mean, the going

629
00:40:35.039 --> 00:40:38.320
probably like what you said, Jim, they probably were toistured

630
00:40:38.440 --> 00:40:41.920
or something. So to me, I don't really know too

631
00:40:42.039 --> 00:40:47.760
much about this where the Star Trek is taking the.

632
00:40:47.800 --> 00:40:48.599
Go in history.

633
00:40:48.840 --> 00:40:53.800
But to me, this seems a lot like they're just

634
00:40:53.960 --> 00:40:55.880
copying Deep Base nine.

635
00:40:56.239 --> 00:40:56.760
It really is.

636
00:40:57.239 --> 00:41:01.679
And so to me, it's okay, It's an interesting thing.

637
00:41:01.800 --> 00:41:03.880
I'm curious to see where they go with it, but.

638
00:41:05.360 --> 00:41:05.679
I don't know.

639
00:41:08.119 --> 00:41:15.480
So there's that I did like that the megastructure that

640
00:41:15.599 --> 00:41:17.559
they were in this seems like it went on forever.

641
00:41:17.679 --> 00:41:23.920
It's almost felt like another time portal in a sense

642
00:41:24.000 --> 00:41:27.119
where you know, they brought people through different dimension or something.

643
00:41:27.320 --> 00:41:32.320
So maybe this year is gonna be another episode later

644
00:41:32.400 --> 00:41:34.960
on in another season that they might bring back and say,

645
00:41:35.119 --> 00:41:36.920
you know, oh, we're gonna need to bring to go

646
00:41:37.039 --> 00:41:38.840
and to help us or something. I don't know, but

647
00:41:39.800 --> 00:41:45.199
to me, I feel like that this particular episode was fascinating,

648
00:41:45.480 --> 00:41:48.360
but it got really boring really quick to me, And

649
00:41:48.480 --> 00:41:51.960
so I'm gonna have to give this one a six

650
00:41:52.239 --> 00:41:53.079
point eight.

651
00:41:55.119 --> 00:41:59.039
Give a take six point eight from the Miracle Worker

652
00:41:59.440 --> 00:42:02.000
And did you guys notice that the planet looked an

653
00:42:02.119 --> 00:42:08.840
awful lot like uh yeah, well yeah, yeah. The Yoda

654
00:42:08.960 --> 00:42:10.920
was running around in the background. Did you see him

655
00:42:10.920 --> 00:42:17.960
there with his cane? No, I was gonna say where

656
00:42:18.079 --> 00:42:23.639
the uh pulsing brain people hang out there? And uh

657
00:42:24.840 --> 00:42:30.119
Tallos four from Discovery. Uh, the planet looked an awful

658
00:42:30.199 --> 00:42:33.239
lot like the Talas four that they used on Star

659
00:42:33.320 --> 00:42:35.519
Trek Discovery. Maybe they filmed it in the same location,

660
00:42:36.440 --> 00:42:40.840
but it looked an awful lot like that planet to me. Anyways,

661
00:42:41.559 --> 00:42:44.039
what did you think, Charles? Did you like the episode?

662
00:42:46.199 --> 00:42:50.800
Well? I will jump over to say to Paul his

663
00:42:51.079 --> 00:42:54.480
love Craft reference. Oh, by the way, happy birthday to

664
00:42:54.719 --> 00:43:02.480
HP Lovecraft. His birthday was yesterday, And I thought that

665
00:43:02.599 --> 00:43:06.079
the episode was interesting because I will for to Paul again.

666
00:43:06.960 --> 00:43:08.800
He said, but I want them to go to a

667
00:43:08.880 --> 00:43:13.199
strange new world. Okay, we got a chance to go

668
00:43:13.320 --> 00:43:16.800
to a strange new world. We got to explore.

669
00:43:19.119 --> 00:43:19.320
One.

670
00:43:20.239 --> 00:43:22.239
An issue that I came up, but I was enjoying

671
00:43:23.480 --> 00:43:29.639
was seeing the reactions between Spock and Chapel. S Bock's

672
00:43:29.800 --> 00:43:36.000
kind of being more vulcan, a little more cold in

673
00:43:36.159 --> 00:43:40.400
trying to distance himself from Chapel and saying, oh, I

674
00:43:40.480 --> 00:43:44.159
got safety procedures that I'll be doing. It's like, yes,

675
00:43:44.800 --> 00:43:47.039
he'll be staying on board the ships so we can

676
00:43:47.119 --> 00:43:51.159
keep his distance. Nope, that didn't quite work. He had

677
00:43:51.199 --> 00:43:56.239
to come down. I think there was wondering. It's like, well,

678
00:43:56.280 --> 00:44:00.440
why did we need so many crew members down there? Well,

679
00:44:00.480 --> 00:44:02.559
I think part of it was they needed to break

680
00:44:02.639 --> 00:44:08.440
everybody up in pairs. After we lose two characters, we

681
00:44:08.519 --> 00:44:10.840
need to break people up in pairs. They could help

682
00:44:10.960 --> 00:44:16.320
solve the mystery to bring them back together. I thought

683
00:44:16.360 --> 00:44:22.519
that was a creative way of using the floating camera.

684
00:44:26.079 --> 00:44:28.199
We had the camera still floating. It's like, well, wait

685
00:44:28.199 --> 00:44:32.960
a minute, we're all still here. So the camera sees them,

686
00:44:33.840 --> 00:44:36.920
but they are in different locations at the same time.

687
00:44:39.199 --> 00:44:42.760
So I thought that was an interesting why I'm putting

688
00:44:42.840 --> 00:44:46.760
through people through different phases, just as we've seen Star

689
00:44:46.880 --> 00:44:55.440
Trek do before. I thought it interesting the background the

690
00:44:55.559 --> 00:45:00.400
screen's changing on the end and kind of giving me

691
00:45:00.519 --> 00:45:08.440
the idea I'm not sure Gambit's gone. Gambit as his

692
00:45:08.840 --> 00:45:12.920
character might be going, but I gamble, but I'm wondering

693
00:45:13.079 --> 00:45:19.519
if he might still be partially out there somewhere that

694
00:45:19.639 --> 00:45:22.400
we don't know how far what happened to these creatures.

695
00:45:26.199 --> 00:45:29.440
But definitely an episode that was good. I thought moved

696
00:45:29.480 --> 00:45:33.840
the story along and I will give it a good solid.

697
00:45:37.079 --> 00:45:37.239
Now.

698
00:45:37.679 --> 00:45:42.440
Did anybody think that the Vesda were the alien from

699
00:45:42.440 --> 00:45:45.159
Star Trek five, the best movie ever made? Did anyone

700
00:45:45.239 --> 00:45:46.239
else think that? Or just me?

701
00:45:47.280 --> 00:45:54.920
Be honest, I think I think your patient's eer of that.

702
00:45:55.639 --> 00:45:58.840
Brother, okay, because I was thinking the god creature from

703
00:45:58.880 --> 00:46:01.880
Star Trek five was trapped there, and I.

704
00:46:02.679 --> 00:46:04.760
Mean, we understand at this point that you see everything

705
00:46:04.800 --> 00:46:07.079
through the lens of Star Trek five, so we get it.

706
00:46:07.079 --> 00:46:08.400
Off, I had to bring that up.

707
00:46:08.440 --> 00:46:12.400
I was just wondering, certainly, did was it just me?

708
00:46:13.239 --> 00:46:13.400
Or what?

709
00:46:16.199 --> 00:46:22.199
Okay? So all right, start trek five aside. I thought

710
00:46:22.239 --> 00:46:26.440
it was pretty stupid of Chapel the stick her finger

711
00:46:26.559 --> 00:46:32.159
in the in the blood, letting the device there. But

712
00:46:32.280 --> 00:46:34.079
I did think it was pretty smart of Gamble to

713
00:46:34.119 --> 00:46:35.800
come over and immediately check her to make sure that

714
00:46:35.840 --> 00:46:38.360
her blood hadn't been infected or her body hadn't been

715
00:46:38.440 --> 00:46:43.119
invaded by any foreign entities, because you would think as

716
00:46:43.159 --> 00:46:47.000
a medical professor professional, she would know that being jabbed

717
00:46:47.079 --> 00:46:50.679
with sharp's can be a bad thing. But she did

718
00:46:50.760 --> 00:46:52.960
it anyways. It was to move the plot along. So

719
00:46:53.559 --> 00:46:57.199
there was that. What did you guys think of the McCrone,

720
00:46:58.079 --> 00:47:01.440
the blue dude who died like first couple of minutes,

721
00:47:01.599 --> 00:47:10.440
pretty neat alien? Huh? I mean, you know, interesting, interesting species.

722
00:47:11.800 --> 00:47:14.639
I thought it interesting. I thought it interesting. I thought

723
00:47:14.639 --> 00:47:21.719
it interesting that the uh, I can't think of the

724
00:47:21.800 --> 00:47:28.159
device translator that translates languages did not was not able

725
00:47:28.199 --> 00:47:29.679
to translate his language.

726
00:47:32.920 --> 00:47:37.719
We're so used to. It was when they were outside,

727
00:47:37.880 --> 00:47:40.920
but when they went inside, Ohora had to translate. And

728
00:47:41.000 --> 00:47:43.239
I think that was because of the interference that they

729
00:47:43.280 --> 00:47:47.599
were getting from the temporal transgressions or whatever.

730
00:47:49.480 --> 00:47:50.119
It could have been.

731
00:47:53.599 --> 00:47:56.280
I thought interesting that Gamble tried to go shake the

732
00:47:56.360 --> 00:48:02.639
guy's hand and Corbin's like, no, we don't shake hands.

733
00:48:04.559 --> 00:48:09.239
And they never explained why. You guys remember the episode

734
00:48:09.280 --> 00:48:12.239
Conspiracy when Ryker and Picard blow up the guy and

735
00:48:12.639 --> 00:48:14.920
the little alien squiggles out of his chest and they

736
00:48:15.039 --> 00:48:17.920
kill it, and how how upset people were that how

737
00:48:18.079 --> 00:48:21.000
violent Star Trek was. Did you guys not think that

738
00:48:21.199 --> 00:48:23.800
Gamble's death was like probably one of the most violent

739
00:48:23.920 --> 00:48:25.599
deaths we've seen on Star Trek.

740
00:48:27.320 --> 00:48:28.039
It was, it was.

741
00:48:28.920 --> 00:48:31.119
It was pretty intent, Yeah, it was.

742
00:48:32.400 --> 00:48:33.719
I mean I didn't deserve it.

743
00:48:34.639 --> 00:48:35.639
Yeah, I thought it really.

744
00:48:36.480 --> 00:48:39.320
I mean, that was a really horrific scream. I was like,

745
00:48:39.440 --> 00:48:41.239
oh my goodness, I could feel a pain.

746
00:48:42.280 --> 00:48:44.559
I can feel your pain, like side Box said and

747
00:48:44.599 --> 00:48:46.239
Star Trek five, I can feel your pain.

748
00:48:46.800 --> 00:48:46.960
Oh.

749
00:48:48.519 --> 00:48:52.840
I you know, in that regard, I had to throw

750
00:48:52.920 --> 00:48:56.719
that in there because David left himself open for it.

751
00:48:56.800 --> 00:48:57.960
I'm sorry I went there.

752
00:49:02.079 --> 00:49:04.000
I was just going to say in that regard, I

753
00:49:04.079 --> 00:49:07.440
feel like Star Trek Discovery started that ball rolling with

754
00:49:07.559 --> 00:49:13.119
that very early season one episode with the Ripper, which

755
00:49:13.320 --> 00:49:17.599
was the first, you know, kind of horror based episode

756
00:49:17.760 --> 00:49:21.000
in the new Star Trek era. And I think what

757
00:49:21.119 --> 00:49:23.800
this is is, like, in my opinion, it's a function

758
00:49:24.239 --> 00:49:30.880
of the acceptance of violence in media in the United States. Like,

759
00:49:30.960 --> 00:49:37.119
generally speaking, we still think sex is pretty taboo. Where

760
00:49:37.679 --> 00:49:39.719
we were working our way out of thinking that things

761
00:49:39.800 --> 00:49:44.199
like homosexuality were taboo, but that's probably regressing at this point.

762
00:49:44.719 --> 00:49:48.280
But violence has never really been taboo at all. And

763
00:49:48.760 --> 00:49:52.480
where the country that produces the most violent video games,

764
00:49:52.559 --> 00:49:56.639
where the country that produces the most violent television. So,

765
00:49:57.639 --> 00:50:01.559
you know, am I surprised by the violence that we

766
00:50:01.760 --> 00:50:03.599
see in Star Trek these days?

767
00:50:03.880 --> 00:50:05.000
No, not at all.

768
00:50:05.280 --> 00:50:07.559
It doesn't even hold a candle to most of the

769
00:50:07.599 --> 00:50:11.000
stuff that we see on television on a regular basis

770
00:50:12.239 --> 00:50:15.639
these days. Does it mean that I like to see

771
00:50:15.679 --> 00:50:19.039
somebody get their eyes blown out by a blowing up

772
00:50:19.840 --> 00:50:27.199
entity slash glass ball of whatever, noncoltoreal stuff. No, Like,

773
00:50:27.400 --> 00:50:32.239
I personally would rather not see that, but it's the

774
00:50:32.519 --> 00:50:36.280
country in which we live, and so it's kind of

775
00:50:36.280 --> 00:50:37.440
par for the course, you know.

776
00:50:40.000 --> 00:50:42.840
And I also think that it shows it shows that

777
00:50:43.760 --> 00:50:47.159
what Bone said in Star Trek two thousand and nine.

778
00:50:47.280 --> 00:50:50.480
He said something to Kirk about space is death, wrapped

779
00:50:50.559 --> 00:50:53.840
in danger, wrapped in whatever whatever, And I think that

780
00:50:53.960 --> 00:50:56.119
it just shows an example that going out in the

781
00:50:56.199 --> 00:50:58.960
space and exploring is not happy, go lucky fun, that

782
00:50:59.079 --> 00:51:02.360
there are there are threats out there and some of

783
00:51:02.440 --> 00:51:06.039
them are pretty nasty, like we get to see. So yeah,

784
00:51:06.119 --> 00:51:08.440
you know, I didn't want to see Gamble go because

785
00:51:08.480 --> 00:51:11.679
I liked them, But you know, we'll ask him about

786
00:51:11.679 --> 00:51:14.079
it on the podcast. So how about you, Paul, what

787
00:51:14.320 --> 00:51:15.599
would you score this episode?

788
00:51:16.440 --> 00:51:16.679
It was?

789
00:51:16.920 --> 00:51:17.800
It was all right.

790
00:51:18.480 --> 00:51:20.639
I think it started off in a pretty good tone

791
00:51:20.679 --> 00:51:24.639
for me, and then when kind of fell into the

792
00:51:24.679 --> 00:51:29.239
hole we're trapped inside of a you know, colossal escape

793
00:51:29.320 --> 00:51:31.920
room kind of vibe, it started to lose me there

794
00:51:32.679 --> 00:51:36.800
and I just found that, you know, it wasn't really claustrophobic.

795
00:51:36.960 --> 00:51:42.639
Is more tedious to me. Again, losing Gamble was surprising

796
00:51:42.760 --> 00:51:45.880
to me. You know, I thought that was you know,

797
00:51:47.119 --> 00:51:49.519
I kind of like prefer the nicer like you know,

798
00:51:49.639 --> 00:51:52.119
Charles picked up on this, right. I like the character

799
00:51:52.280 --> 00:51:54.559
moments that are more interesting to me, and following the

800
00:51:54.679 --> 00:51:57.960
characters from episode episode I liked the whole vibe, the

801
00:51:58.920 --> 00:52:03.719
you know, the kind of odd, uncomfortable dance between Spock

802
00:52:04.159 --> 00:52:10.000
and Uh and Chapel and you know, uh Noonian singing, right.

803
00:52:10.079 --> 00:52:11.960
I mean, it's just it's kind of a little awkward

804
00:52:12.280 --> 00:52:15.679
workplace romance, kind of no one's saying anything. But there

805
00:52:16.320 --> 00:52:18.559
I found that with stuff way more interesting. It's very

806
00:52:18.559 --> 00:52:20.639
interesting with the whole Captain Btel thing, with the Gorn.

807
00:52:20.719 --> 00:52:22.920
I hope we get some answers to that sooner as

808
00:52:22.960 --> 00:52:25.000
opposed later. But yet I'm on the other hand, I'm

809
00:52:25.039 --> 00:52:28.239
really not looking forward to spending yet another episode with

810
00:52:28.599 --> 00:52:33.159
these you know, Venza, Vesna whatever aliens. Right, It's just

811
00:52:33.280 --> 00:52:35.920
it's just not very inventive for me and not a

812
00:52:36.039 --> 00:52:39.199
very interesting plot. So to me, I was just I

813
00:52:39.639 --> 00:52:43.719
found a little tedious. It wasn't so great. Wasn't really

814
00:52:43.840 --> 00:52:49.440
super engaged by it. I just don't know the whole

815
00:52:49.480 --> 00:52:52.679
Lovecraftian thing is where we're going, uh for Star Trek

816
00:52:52.760 --> 00:52:55.320
if that's you know, yes, space is dangerous, But I

817
00:52:55.599 --> 00:52:58.639
just whether we're depicting, you know, again with the kind

818
00:52:58.679 --> 00:53:03.760
of alien inspired you know, geiger asque, big teeth, you know, parasites.

819
00:53:03.800 --> 00:53:07.559
I mean, can we get something different, design guys, maybe

820
00:53:07.679 --> 00:53:10.159
something a little bit more inventive or I don't know.

821
00:53:10.239 --> 00:53:15.599
It just felt really kind of rehashed, not nothing too great,

822
00:53:15.639 --> 00:53:19.920
And I'm just I really need to get beyond Roger Corby.

823
00:53:20.719 --> 00:53:25.760
He's bringing nothing to the to the proceedings as a

824
00:53:25.840 --> 00:53:28.559
performer for me. I'm sure there's some people that really

825
00:53:28.679 --> 00:53:31.360
enjoy his work. I just I just don't get anything

826
00:53:31.400 --> 00:53:32.800
out of it. I think it's not a really well

827
00:53:33.880 --> 00:53:36.480
written character, and he and Chappell have like, I mean,

828
00:53:36.840 --> 00:53:41.599
zero charisma together. There is just nothing going on there.

829
00:53:41.639 --> 00:53:44.800
It's just like, what are you? Why did you dump

830
00:53:44.880 --> 00:53:47.079
Spock for this guy? I mean, maybe that's what they

831
00:53:47.119 --> 00:53:49.559
want us to be thinking, to kind of have that perspective,

832
00:53:49.639 --> 00:53:54.400
but it's just it's it's not really interesting. So for me,

833
00:53:54.559 --> 00:53:57.039
this one left me kind of a little numb. I

834
00:53:57.199 --> 00:54:00.960
wasn't thrilled about it. I think the best I can really,

835
00:54:01.000 --> 00:54:04.320
in good conscience give it is a seven, and that's

836
00:54:04.519 --> 00:54:07.440
being super generous. I mean, I'm really more. I don't

837
00:54:07.440 --> 00:54:10.480
do decimals, sorry, because I know what I think. But

838
00:54:12.119 --> 00:54:15.599
I if I was in a worser mood, worser, can

839
00:54:15.679 --> 00:54:18.119
I say that? Is that? All right? If I was

840
00:54:18.199 --> 00:54:20.760
in a less magnanimous mood, I would probably give it

841
00:54:20.800 --> 00:54:23.320
a six, and then even that feels generous. But I

842
00:54:23.679 --> 00:54:25.880
want to support the show. I want to support them

843
00:54:25.920 --> 00:54:28.199
trying different flavors of ice cream. So let's give it

844
00:54:28.239 --> 00:54:30.559
a seven. I think feels feels about right for me.

845
00:54:30.679 --> 00:54:34.760
But let's move on from all this stuff, and you know,

846
00:54:34.920 --> 00:54:36.639
especially let's move on from Roger Gorby.

847
00:54:38.880 --> 00:54:43.199
So has Chapel. I don't remember, did Chapel go off

848
00:54:43.320 --> 00:54:46.320
on her internship with him yet or is that about

849
00:54:46.360 --> 00:54:46.840
to happen?

850
00:54:51.039 --> 00:54:51.159
Now?

851
00:54:51.199 --> 00:54:55.159
They're doing extended research, right, they're doing extended research, Like

852
00:54:55.239 --> 00:54:57.639
this is part of it where he's like somehow managed

853
00:54:57.679 --> 00:54:59.440
to get himself assigned to the enterprise and they're just

854
00:54:59.679 --> 00:55:02.599
jocking around doing things and you know, and he's getting

855
00:55:02.679 --> 00:55:06.599
to use the ship's resources. I guess like you would see, uh,

856
00:55:07.159 --> 00:55:10.159
you know happen. And so that he's gotten a big

857
00:55:10.199 --> 00:55:15.159
Grand Federation grant going to spooky escape room places and

858
00:55:15.480 --> 00:55:18.719
reenact the scene from Temple of Doom, like the guy

859
00:55:18.760 --> 00:55:20.599
pointed out, which is like, you know, I'm like, you know,

860
00:55:21.679 --> 00:55:24.079
we've seen this so many times before. I mean, I

861
00:55:24.280 --> 00:55:28.320
just it's like, come on, come on, show me something

862
00:55:28.320 --> 00:55:31.320
I've seen before, you know, light me up. So I'm ready.

863
00:55:31.400 --> 00:55:32.400
I'm I'm ready to move on.

864
00:55:32.480 --> 00:55:32.880
From this one.

865
00:55:32.960 --> 00:55:36.000
Man. I'm happy to happy to move on. So I

866
00:55:36.119 --> 00:55:38.719
think I think that something Paul brought up. I think

867
00:55:38.760 --> 00:55:41.239
it was it last week or maybe the week before. Anyway,

868
00:55:41.320 --> 00:55:44.239
Paul brought this point up at some point, And I

869
00:55:44.360 --> 00:55:47.639
think that Star Treks Strange New World needs to find

870
00:55:47.840 --> 00:55:51.239
an identity because right now they seem to be doing

871
00:55:51.440 --> 00:55:55.920
you know, style of the week type of stuff, you know,

872
00:55:56.760 --> 00:55:59.440
and so one week it's a murder mystery, and the

873
00:55:59.519 --> 00:56:02.320
next week it's it's a musical, the next week it's

874
00:56:02.400 --> 00:56:05.000
them up. It's always seems to be some some new

875
00:56:05.119 --> 00:56:09.079
stylistic take on Star Trek, and I think that they're

876
00:56:09.360 --> 00:56:12.719
they're giving lost in trying to be too much for

877
00:56:12.840 --> 00:56:16.079
too many people. I think they need to dial it

878
00:56:16.239 --> 00:56:19.159
back and let Star Trek be Star Trek. And if

879
00:56:19.199 --> 00:56:22.519
a if a great episode comes along, you know, like

880
00:56:22.599 --> 00:56:26.760
Bohemian Rhapsody or or these Old Scientists or something like that,

881
00:56:27.320 --> 00:56:30.719
then great, do it. But to intentionally go out of

882
00:56:30.800 --> 00:56:34.239
their way to do all these different styles and takes

883
00:56:34.320 --> 00:56:38.119
on Star Trek, I think they're losing. I think they're

884
00:56:38.119 --> 00:56:40.920
missing the boat and they need to let Star Trek

885
00:56:41.039 --> 00:56:44.760
be Star Trek in my opinion, So.

886
00:56:46.320 --> 00:56:48.000
What did you end up giving this episode?

887
00:56:48.079 --> 00:56:48.239
Jim?

888
00:56:48.639 --> 00:56:49.199
Did you score it?

889
00:56:49.400 --> 00:56:51.960
I haven't. I haven't scored it yet at all. I've

890
00:56:52.000 --> 00:56:57.519
just kind of been interjecting as we go along. But yeah, so,

891
00:56:57.639 --> 00:57:00.360
I you know Eric, why why don't we hear from

892
00:57:00.440 --> 00:57:00.960
Eric next?

893
00:57:01.639 --> 00:57:06.119
Cool? Yeah? So, I think upon initial viewing, I liked

894
00:57:06.199 --> 00:57:11.360
the exploration vibe of this episode, the idea that the

895
00:57:11.559 --> 00:57:13.719
entire thing was kind of a mystery that we had

896
00:57:13.760 --> 00:57:16.360
to sort of unfold and figure out what was going on.

897
00:57:16.599 --> 00:57:19.199
I actually found that to be pretty compelling and a

898
00:57:19.280 --> 00:57:23.440
nice counterpoint to some of the previous episodes that we've

899
00:57:23.480 --> 00:57:28.239
seen in this season. You know, some of our people

900
00:57:28.280 --> 00:57:31.320
who commented on our Facebook page said, you know, thank

901
00:57:31.360 --> 00:57:32.880
you for kind of going back to the planet of

902
00:57:32.920 --> 00:57:36.159
the Week thing. It's it's cool to have a new

903
00:57:37.119 --> 00:57:40.159
thing to explore to figure out what's going on. So

904
00:57:40.320 --> 00:57:44.039
I really liked that part of this episode, this exact scenario.

905
00:57:44.079 --> 00:57:47.960
It's interesting that that so many people are saying things

906
00:57:48.079 --> 00:57:50.360
like trope and I've seen this before and stuff. I

907
00:57:50.400 --> 00:57:53.199
don't know, it felt it felt fresh and new to me.

908
00:57:53.800 --> 00:57:56.639
Maybe I just wasn't thinking hard enough about it or something.

909
00:57:56.719 --> 00:57:59.679
I don't know, but I actually thought the story was

910
00:57:59.760 --> 00:58:01.840
kind of kind of cool, and at the end we

911
00:58:01.960 --> 00:58:04.199
still don't really have resolution of it. And to me,

912
00:58:04.320 --> 00:58:06.360
the best episodes of Star Trek are the ones that

913
00:58:06.480 --> 00:58:09.400
don't give you the answer by the time you're done

914
00:58:09.679 --> 00:58:12.599
watching the episode, So I like that. There was also

915
00:58:12.679 --> 00:58:15.719
a ton of stuff going on in this episode. I mean,

916
00:58:15.760 --> 00:58:19.280
you had the landing party, you had the death of Gamble,

917
00:58:20.440 --> 00:58:23.679
you had the Vesda and Gorn connection, you had the

918
00:58:23.800 --> 00:58:28.280
Spakla on Chapel Triangle. You had the Corbi being a

919
00:58:28.400 --> 00:58:31.000
jerk and kind of a selfish asshole sort of situation.

920
00:58:31.760 --> 00:58:35.400
You had the Ortegas's brother filming the documentary, which I

921
00:58:35.480 --> 00:58:37.960
actually thought added a nice little air of kind of

922
00:58:38.079 --> 00:58:41.280
innocence and fun to what was going on, and it

923
00:58:41.400 --> 00:58:44.039
was nice. It's nice to see his kind of budding

924
00:58:44.119 --> 00:58:47.440
relationship with Uhua going on, and I like that part

925
00:58:47.480 --> 00:58:50.400
of it. And then there's the Pelia thing, hamming it

926
00:58:50.519 --> 00:58:53.719
up for the camera and kind of, you know, being

927
00:58:53.719 --> 00:58:56.960
a little a little more Pellia. Somehow she became more

928
00:58:57.039 --> 00:58:59.719
Pelia and yet she was less annoying. I'm not really

929
00:59:00.320 --> 00:59:04.480
out that that worked. Out, but I didn't really mind

930
00:59:04.559 --> 00:59:08.039
what she was doing in this episode. I wonder if

931
00:59:08.079 --> 00:59:11.440
we're ever gonna I was really hoping eventually for a

932
00:59:11.559 --> 00:59:16.400
Battel Gorn hybrid situation. It seems like maybe I'm not

933
00:59:16.480 --> 00:59:19.360
gonna get that, which disappoints me because I was really

934
00:59:19.400 --> 00:59:22.480
hoping for like a character that literally sort of looks

935
00:59:22.519 --> 00:59:26.000
like a Gorn but is still Battel. I don't know,

936
00:59:26.239 --> 00:59:30.719
I just I just wanted that, And then you know,

937
00:59:30.880 --> 00:59:35.280
people hinted in their comments, but you guys and Paul

938
00:59:35.320 --> 00:59:39.760
said something about it. So first of all, if we

939
00:59:39.880 --> 00:59:44.280
didn't have the Internet, we still wouldn't know Ensign Gamble's

940
00:59:44.320 --> 00:59:48.280
first name. They never said it on the show. They

941
00:59:48.639 --> 00:59:53.880
actually never formally introduced his name in the first episode

942
00:59:53.960 --> 00:59:56.679
that he was in, which was Wedding Bell Blues. So

943
00:59:56.800 --> 01:00:00.280
here they introduced this character, they kind of make fall

944
01:00:00.320 --> 01:00:02.280
in love with him, they don't give him a name.

945
01:00:03.320 --> 01:00:06.719
He is a black man, and then he just gets

946
01:00:06.760 --> 01:00:09.639
brutally murdered, and by the time he's dead, I still

947
01:00:09.679 --> 01:00:12.840
didn't know who he was until I went to the

948
01:00:12.920 --> 01:00:15.440
Internet and figured out that his first name was was.

949
01:00:15.840 --> 01:00:18.320
I mean, they had the perfect opportunity right this episode

950
01:00:18.360 --> 01:00:21.039
starts with him doing his personal log. He could have

951
01:00:21.079 --> 01:00:24.519
said this is instant Dana Gamble, you know, but they didn't.

952
01:00:24.760 --> 01:00:26.480
They didn't do that. They didn't even give him the

953
01:00:26.559 --> 01:00:29.039
respect of like being able to introduce himself on his

954
01:00:29.159 --> 01:00:33.800
own log. So that whole situation really really bugged me

955
01:00:34.159 --> 01:00:36.719
about this episode, and it kind of like knocked it

956
01:00:36.840 --> 01:00:38.719
down a couple of notches for me, because as much

957
01:00:38.760 --> 01:00:41.239
as I love the exploration vibe and that sort of stuff,

958
01:00:41.679 --> 01:00:45.800
I really hate that trope of introducing the new guy,

959
01:00:46.000 --> 01:00:48.920
make you fall in love, and then kill him off.

960
01:00:50.280 --> 01:00:55.000
Just took it down many notches. So I also will

961
01:00:55.000 --> 01:00:56.960
say that, you know, I'm not sure Strange New Worlds

962
01:00:57.000 --> 01:00:59.719
is really offering in this season so far what it

963
01:00:59.760 --> 01:01:03.719
did in the first season, especially, which is the morality

964
01:01:03.840 --> 01:01:06.840
play aspect of Star Trek. You know, all the best

965
01:01:06.840 --> 01:01:10.119
Star Trek episodes kind of give you something to think about.

966
01:01:10.239 --> 01:01:15.119
They give you a question that you can't answer, makes

967
01:01:15.199 --> 01:01:17.079
you expand your brain just a little bit in terms

968
01:01:17.119 --> 01:01:20.400
of how you're thinking about things. So far, it's just,

969
01:01:21.400 --> 01:01:26.480
you know, whatever's going on that week. There's character development.

970
01:01:26.519 --> 01:01:28.039
I will say that's the thing that they're doing a

971
01:01:28.199 --> 01:01:31.119
good job on so far as they're developing these individual

972
01:01:31.280 --> 01:01:34.760
characters overall. And I think it was v who mentioned

973
01:01:34.960 --> 01:01:38.400
in Benga's kind of affinity for and some Gamble and

974
01:01:38.519 --> 01:01:41.960
how that was a really sweet kind of mentor mentee

975
01:01:42.480 --> 01:01:48.519
father sons sort of relationship, especially since we know that

976
01:01:48.599 --> 01:01:51.519
I'm Benga lost his daughter, right, so it was really

977
01:01:51.599 --> 01:01:54.119
sweet to kind of see his affinity for this other

978
01:01:54.280 --> 01:01:56.760
character and kind of, you know, want to see him

979
01:01:56.800 --> 01:01:58.840
succeed and stuff, and then they just kill him off.

980
01:01:59.840 --> 01:02:06.239
So I originally, like, when I started watching this episode,

981
01:02:06.280 --> 01:02:07.880
I was like, oh, dang, this is like an eight

982
01:02:07.960 --> 01:02:10.599
or nine. This is great. And as the episode went on,

983
01:02:11.599 --> 01:02:15.599
my my thing just plummeted like an exponential curve. So

984
01:02:15.760 --> 01:02:17.719
I ended up with a six. I gave this one

985
01:02:17.800 --> 01:02:21.400
a six. If I was in a better mood today,

986
01:02:21.519 --> 01:02:23.159
I might have given it a seven, much in the

987
01:02:23.199 --> 01:02:24.920
same way that if Paul was in a worse mood,

988
01:02:24.920 --> 01:02:27.039
he might have given it a six. So I'm going

989
01:02:27.119 --> 01:02:31.159
to balance Paul's seven with my own six. Despite the

990
01:02:31.239 --> 01:02:34.280
fact that there were huge aspects of this episode that

991
01:02:34.360 --> 01:02:35.559
I actually really liked.

992
01:02:37.519 --> 01:02:41.199
That's that's a fair assessment. So you know, I really

993
01:02:41.360 --> 01:02:44.880
liked I thought Scotty was awesome in this episode. I mean,

994
01:02:44.960 --> 01:02:48.960
when Gamble slash Vezna was going to kill Pellia and

995
01:02:49.039 --> 01:02:52.920
Sam Kirk and Bengo walks in with the phaser and

996
01:02:53.599 --> 01:02:58.559
can't do the deed, Pellia kills him. Well, he was

997
01:02:58.599 --> 01:03:02.440
already dead, but Pellia calls the body, and what does

998
01:03:02.440 --> 01:03:06.119
Scotty do. Scotty grabs the orby thing that happens to

999
01:03:06.199 --> 01:03:08.960
be laying there on the counter, traps the thing in it,

1000
01:03:09.039 --> 01:03:13.199
and quickly beams it into the transporter buffer. Brilliant, brilliant

1001
01:03:13.239 --> 01:03:17.199
Scotty move. You know. I also like the way they're

1002
01:03:17.239 --> 01:03:20.559
developing Scottie as well. I like to see them get

1003
01:03:20.599 --> 01:03:24.239
away from Pellya and more into Scotty. So I did

1004
01:03:24.400 --> 01:03:26.960
like that. But a lot of the characters had plot

1005
01:03:27.119 --> 01:03:31.280
armor in this episode. I mean, who was gonna die?

1006
01:03:33.719 --> 01:03:36.360
Gamble's the only one really well, and the blue dude

1007
01:03:36.760 --> 01:03:40.519
who died in the beginning. They all the rest of

1008
01:03:40.559 --> 01:03:44.920
them have plot armor, so you know, but I'm with you, Eric,

1009
01:03:45.000 --> 01:03:49.039
I didn't like the fact that they killed Gamble the

1010
01:03:49.079 --> 01:03:52.039
way he did, because that's what That's exactly what The

1011
01:03:52.119 --> 01:03:56.480
Walking Dead did in every single season. They bring in

1012
01:03:56.519 --> 01:03:58.639
a new character that introduce them and then a zombie

1013
01:03:58.639 --> 01:04:00.880
would jump out and eat them. And it's like they

1014
01:04:00.960 --> 01:04:03.679
did that time and time and time and time again.

1015
01:04:04.079 --> 01:04:05.880
And when I was watching this episode and they did

1016
01:04:05.920 --> 01:04:07.199
it Gamble, I was like, nah.

1017
01:04:07.880 --> 01:04:10.760
I mean when they when they first brought him into

1018
01:04:10.920 --> 01:04:14.960
the on that Wedding Bell Blues episode, I was like, oh, man,

1019
01:04:15.320 --> 01:04:18.760
Like I literally was elated with his character. He seemed

1020
01:04:19.239 --> 01:04:22.639
so fresh, so new, this person who's like you know,

1021
01:04:22.880 --> 01:04:27.800
infinitely excited about his job, just wants to succeed. He

1022
01:04:28.039 --> 01:04:31.360
just was like it. He literally brought me joy, and

1023
01:04:31.480 --> 01:04:35.480
I think that that made it so much worse when

1024
01:04:35.519 --> 01:04:37.480
they decided to kill him a offf because it's kind

1025
01:04:37.519 --> 01:04:43.880
of like the message is, you know, have all the joy,

1026
01:04:44.239 --> 01:04:47.400
have all of the of the positive stuff that you

1027
01:04:47.519 --> 01:04:50.679
bring to the story, and you will die. The only

1028
01:04:50.800 --> 01:04:53.639
people who are going to survive are the ones who

1029
01:04:53.760 --> 01:04:57.360
kind of understand that their reality sucks and sort of

1030
01:04:57.440 --> 01:04:59.880
deal with it on a regular basis. It just was

1031
01:05:01.000 --> 01:05:03.079
it was devastating to me when he died, to tell

1032
01:05:03.079 --> 01:05:03.840
you the truth.

1033
01:05:04.559 --> 01:05:07.039
He had that he had that kind of that Harry

1034
01:05:07.199 --> 01:05:11.599
Kim kind of vibe, the eager, fresh, young, excited, happy

1035
01:05:11.679 --> 01:05:13.119
to be here vibe and they kill him.

1036
01:05:14.039 --> 01:05:17.000
He's hopeful. He seemed to represent a lot of hopefulness

1037
01:05:17.039 --> 01:05:20.840
coming onto the show, right, And and I think, you know, uh,

1038
01:05:21.239 --> 01:05:24.679
I'm sure redact my score and make it more like Erics,

1039
01:05:24.719 --> 01:05:28.440
but but then there's balance, so there you go. But yeah,

1040
01:05:28.519 --> 01:05:31.800
I found it really kind of is very cynical, kind

1041
01:05:31.840 --> 01:05:34.280
of you know, bleak, and.

1042
01:05:34.559 --> 01:05:35.119
That's what it was.

1043
01:05:35.320 --> 01:05:35.519
It was.

1044
01:05:36.239 --> 01:05:39.559
That's a great word for it. Yeah, yeah, And Star

1045
01:05:39.639 --> 01:05:42.599
Trek shouldn't be cynical, right, the best episodes of Star

1046
01:05:42.719 --> 01:05:44.880
Trek aren't cynical, And this one was.

1047
01:05:45.079 --> 01:05:50.119
In the end, you know, before we transition to the

1048
01:05:50.199 --> 01:05:53.840
next episode, which I'm so looking forward to doing and

1049
01:05:54.039 --> 01:05:56.719
put this one behind us. I think also kind of

1050
01:05:56.800 --> 01:05:58.559
like you know, uncle Jim was saying, right in terms

1051
01:05:58.599 --> 01:06:01.519
of the tone of the season. I mean, I'm not naive.

1052
01:06:01.559 --> 01:06:03.719
I know that every TV show is written by a

1053
01:06:03.880 --> 01:06:08.039
group in a collaborative waters room, right, and that is

1054
01:06:08.119 --> 01:06:10.960
how television has produced these days. But I think it

1055
01:06:11.079 --> 01:06:14.199
is often produced that way to the detriment of the show.

1056
01:06:15.039 --> 01:06:17.320
Because I don't really feel like any of these episodes

1057
01:06:17.320 --> 01:06:21.039
I've seen, with one exception maybe that we might be

1058
01:06:21.159 --> 01:06:23.480
talking about soon really feel like it was written by

1059
01:06:23.519 --> 01:06:27.800
a individuals all right. There's just no perspective to it.

1060
01:06:27.840 --> 01:06:30.639
It feels like everyone's kind of collaborating and like this,

1061
01:06:30.800 --> 01:06:33.119
let's make sure this is getting in there, right, And

1062
01:06:33.280 --> 01:06:35.559
there's a lot of that, and you know, it's just

1063
01:06:35.880 --> 01:06:37.679
I really feel like, you know, in terms of like

1064
01:06:38.199 --> 01:06:43.440
what I consider storytelling and narrative focus and character development plot,

1065
01:06:43.679 --> 01:06:47.239
which is what I watched television for, I feel like

1066
01:06:47.360 --> 01:06:49.119
there's a little, maybe a little too much, too many

1067
01:06:49.199 --> 01:06:53.679
cooks going on in these episodes, right, And I'd be

1068
01:06:53.760 --> 01:06:55.639
really curious to be a fly on the wall and

1069
01:06:55.719 --> 01:06:57.880
watch how they developed, you know, an arc of the season.

1070
01:06:57.880 --> 01:07:00.119
They only got ten episodes or whatever it is. It's

1071
01:07:00.119 --> 01:07:03.880
a pretty short art. But just the writing this doesn't

1072
01:07:03.880 --> 01:07:06.480
feel very thoughtful or measured to me. And it doesn't

1073
01:07:06.480 --> 01:07:11.079
feel like there's one vivid perspective cranking out the words.

1074
01:07:11.400 --> 01:07:14.280
So be mindful, writer's room.

1075
01:07:15.400 --> 01:07:19.480
So with that being said, I want to this is

1076
01:07:19.519 --> 01:07:21.760
a good segue to bring up something that I wanted

1077
01:07:21.800 --> 01:07:27.679
to mention before. But so with the sky Dance Paramount merger,

1078
01:07:28.920 --> 01:07:30.800
I've been reading all kinds of stuff on the internet,

1079
01:07:30.920 --> 01:07:35.360
none of it which I've been able to adequately say

1080
01:07:35.480 --> 01:07:38.800
yes that's true or no it's not. It's all kind

1081
01:07:38.840 --> 01:07:44.800
of in great areas. But you know, did Paramount sell

1082
01:07:44.960 --> 01:07:50.599
out to merge with sky Dance? Did they pay off

1083
01:07:52.239 --> 01:07:56.840
Trump to approve the sale of so they could make

1084
01:07:56.920 --> 01:07:59.039
all their money? And then and the other side of

1085
01:07:59.079 --> 01:08:02.159
that was that part of it was that, you know,

1086
01:08:02.679 --> 01:08:05.840
they had to rewrite some of these episodes and kind

1087
01:08:05.880 --> 01:08:08.159
of dumb them down because Star Trek was being too

1088
01:08:08.280 --> 01:08:10.960
woke and that was part of the deal in order

1089
01:08:11.039 --> 01:08:15.440
to have sky Dance, you know, complete the merger. So

1090
01:08:16.159 --> 01:08:19.680
is that why maybe we're seeing a season that's weaker

1091
01:08:19.800 --> 01:08:22.760
than the first two or not quite what we expect

1092
01:08:22.840 --> 01:08:26.199
it to be. And again, I've I've been looking up

1093
01:08:26.239 --> 01:08:28.960
on the internet trying to find a source that can

1094
01:08:29.119 --> 01:08:33.119
verify that or delegitimize it, and it's just just kind

1095
01:08:33.119 --> 01:08:36.279
of floating out there. So I just wanted to throw

1096
01:08:36.319 --> 01:08:36.800
that out of My.

1097
01:08:36.880 --> 01:08:39.000
Sense, Jim, is that we may see that more in

1098
01:08:39.159 --> 01:08:41.479
season four, just because of the timing of when things

1099
01:08:41.520 --> 01:08:46.119
were written and when things were filmed. This feels to

1100
01:08:46.279 --> 01:08:49.920
me like, even though it's season three, it feels like

1101
01:08:50.000 --> 01:08:52.920
that sophomore slump, like we did all of the really

1102
01:08:53.000 --> 01:08:55.760
cool things that we were thinking about, and now we

1103
01:08:55.920 --> 01:08:57.880
just kind of have to keep it going before all

1104
01:08:57.880 --> 01:09:00.520
of a sudden in seasons four and five, shit goes

1105
01:09:00.640 --> 01:09:03.520
crazy because it's the end. Let's do everything that we

1106
01:09:03.600 --> 01:09:09.840
haven't already done. Already so many television shows have done that.

1107
01:09:09.880 --> 01:09:10.279
Go ahead, V.

1108
01:09:10.399 --> 01:09:11.960
Sorry, Yeah, I was just going to say.

1109
01:09:13.000 --> 01:09:15.720
Being in the History world, I hear that word like, oh,

1110
01:09:15.800 --> 01:09:22.079
they're so woke, and that word has been totally you know,

1111
01:09:22.199 --> 01:09:27.560
misconstrued from what it was. What it was meant first off,

1112
01:09:27.720 --> 01:09:32.279
and it's basically that you care about people, and to

1113
01:09:32.399 --> 01:09:36.199
be woke, you're awake, you're aware of the fact that

1114
01:09:37.439 --> 01:09:43.039
everybody should be equal. Everybody is equal, and we just

1115
01:09:43.199 --> 01:09:46.800
need to have some kindness and compassion for one another.

1116
01:09:47.760 --> 01:09:50.960
And if you're too woke, that's that's not a bad thing.

1117
01:09:51.079 --> 01:09:53.159
That means that you you know, and then the whole

1118
01:09:53.319 --> 01:09:57.960
Star Trek is the whole infinite diversity in infinite combination.

1119
01:09:58.359 --> 01:10:02.680
So anybody that thinks Star Trek as woke doesn't get

1120
01:10:02.800 --> 01:10:03.359
Star Trek.

1121
01:10:03.960 --> 01:10:08.239
You know, they're themselves, that's right.

1122
01:10:08.760 --> 01:10:12.279
But yeah, that word, that word has been unfortunately bastardized

1123
01:10:12.359 --> 01:10:17.439
and turned into something bad. And you know, the whole

1124
01:10:17.479 --> 01:10:20.319
thing with Paramount plus selling out to I can't even

1125
01:10:20.359 --> 01:10:22.960
say his name just sickens me.

1126
01:10:23.119 --> 01:10:24.000
For somebody who.

1127
01:10:25.680 --> 01:10:31.000
You know does not care about the average person is

1128
01:10:31.039 --> 01:10:33.840
as far from the true meaning of woke as you

1129
01:10:33.960 --> 01:10:40.279
can get. I'm just I'm hoping that you know, it's

1130
01:10:40.359 --> 01:10:43.319
not going to ruin the rest of Star Trek.

1131
01:10:43.720 --> 01:10:44.239
I really do.

1132
01:10:45.359 --> 01:10:55.720
Let's hope that that's Nope. I think that I think

1133
01:10:55.800 --> 01:10:58.039
that Paul and Eric, I think everybody pretty touched on

1134
01:10:59.000 --> 01:11:01.560
most of the things that that I wanted to say that.

1135
01:11:02.359 --> 01:11:04.680
I was upset that they killed Gamble because I've been

1136
01:11:04.760 --> 01:11:07.960
talking to him on Facebook and was excited to get

1137
01:11:08.039 --> 01:11:09.880
him on the podcast, and when they killed him, I

1138
01:11:10.000 --> 01:11:16.159
was like, no, So that upset me. But overall, I

1139
01:11:16.239 --> 01:11:19.960
think I'll go with a seven, a seven on this one,

1140
01:11:20.800 --> 01:11:23.680
maybe a six point eight. Okay, six point eight, because

1141
01:11:23.720 --> 01:11:29.039
I know Paul likes decimals six point eight and I

1142
01:11:29.119 --> 01:11:32.000
think that's where I'll put this episode. So did we

1143
01:11:32.079 --> 01:11:40.039
lose Charles, We lost Charles, Okay, Charles to come back,

1144
01:11:41.359 --> 01:11:44.960
that could be so while we're waiting for Charles, so

1145
01:11:45.039 --> 01:11:47.960
we don't want to hold up the show. We will

1146
01:11:48.079 --> 01:11:50.319
have As I said, we go to our Facebook page

1147
01:11:50.319 --> 01:11:54.159
and you can score the episodes yourself. So up there's Charles.

1148
01:11:54.279 --> 01:11:56.600
He's back, Charles, can you hear us?

1149
01:11:58.840 --> 01:11:59.239
All right?

1150
01:11:59.800 --> 01:12:03.319
So what's the overall UH score for for us versus

1151
01:12:03.479 --> 01:12:07.960
the minions? Six point eight?

1152
01:12:09.479 --> 01:12:09.880
Mm hm.

1153
01:12:12.119 --> 01:12:13.199
Do do do do do?

1154
01:12:20.119 --> 01:12:20.399
Mm hm?

1155
01:12:22.520 --> 01:12:22.760
Wow?

1156
01:12:23.439 --> 01:12:23.720
Cool?

1157
01:12:23.800 --> 01:12:24.039
Cool?

1158
01:12:24.439 --> 01:12:26.840
All right, So we're gonna do some cadet training for

1159
01:12:26.960 --> 01:12:29.279
this episode. So we're gonna turn it over to Charles

1160
01:12:29.359 --> 01:12:36.279
and UH to get us started. Take it away, Charles,

1161
01:12:40.880 --> 01:12:41.319
all right.

1162
01:12:44.760 --> 01:12:48.359
Somebody's pulling the cord out the lawnmower trying to get

1163
01:12:48.359 --> 01:12:50.319
it started here. I think this is what's what I

1164
01:12:50.439 --> 01:12:54.760
feel is I don't really get the pressure to go

1165
01:12:54.880 --> 01:12:55.960
into smart plug dog.

1166
01:12:56.399 --> 01:12:57.399
I don't know what's going on.

1167
01:12:59.359 --> 01:13:02.800
Anie, Okay, I will.

1168
01:13:03.800 --> 01:13:06.479
I will do the cadet trainings for Charles and until

1169
01:13:06.479 --> 01:13:09.600
he gets back. So for cadet training, Charles has the

1170
01:13:09.640 --> 01:13:14.520
ts episode Obsession, season two, episode thirteen, the recollection of

1171
01:13:14.600 --> 01:13:17.520
Kirk's time on the USS Farragut and dealing with the

1172
01:13:17.800 --> 01:13:22.920
Strange Cloud. He also has the TNG episode data Lore,

1173
01:13:23.039 --> 01:13:27.359
which is season one, episode thirteen, and that's the crystalline

1174
01:13:27.560 --> 01:13:31.039
entity the Planet Killer, which we see a planet killer

1175
01:13:31.479 --> 01:13:32.840
in this episode as well.

1176
01:13:32.960 --> 01:13:35.680
Somehow he doesn't mention doomsday.

1177
01:13:36.479 --> 01:13:37.039
Well, I don't know.

1178
01:13:37.199 --> 01:13:39.079
That's the very first thing I thought when I heard this,

1179
01:13:40.640 --> 01:13:43.840
What's like, TF man, you miss that one.

1180
01:13:49.520 --> 01:13:53.880
We also have the TNG episode Samaritan Snare season two,

1181
01:13:53.920 --> 01:13:59.159
episode seventeen with the pack lids seeking technology. He also

1182
01:13:59.279 --> 01:14:05.880
mentions the episode for the Kirkspock relationship, okay, and a

1183
01:14:05.960 --> 01:14:09.359
TNG episode Galaxy Child season four, episode sixteen with the

1184
01:14:09.479 --> 01:14:13.039
souring of the melt to remove the barrier cord from

1185
01:14:13.079 --> 01:14:16.800
the enterprise. That's an interesting analogy. And then we have

1186
01:14:16.960 --> 01:14:20.239
the Twilight Zone the Invaders seed in two, episode fifteen,

1187
01:14:20.479 --> 01:14:27.680
small invaders who were astronauts from Earth. I missed that episode. Okay,

1188
01:14:27.840 --> 01:14:32.319
So that's our cadet training with Charles and v. What

1189
01:14:32.640 --> 01:14:36.159
did our Facebook fans have to say about this episode?

1190
01:14:37.039 --> 01:14:39.840
Well, let's see first, Oh, yeah, the Invaders.

1191
01:14:40.000 --> 01:14:42.159
I brought that up because even though I had seen

1192
01:14:42.239 --> 01:14:47.359
that episode a long time ago, seeing this strange New

1193
01:14:47.399 --> 01:14:51.600
World's episode, it's I immediately for because that's how my

1194
01:14:51.680 --> 01:14:53.720
brain works went back to that episode.

1195
01:14:53.920 --> 01:14:55.399
And so.

1196
01:14:57.199 --> 01:14:59.199
That's that's my little contribution. Anyway.

1197
01:14:59.560 --> 01:15:05.640
Sorry from our rising fan Tiffany Steele, I might not

1198
01:15:05.840 --> 01:15:08.199
see him as Kirk yet, but he is a good

1199
01:15:08.279 --> 01:15:12.319
starfleet officer. I liked that he didn't back down from

1200
01:15:12.399 --> 01:15:16.800
his Vulcan captain, showing her the need for human curiosity

1201
01:15:16.920 --> 01:15:20.119
instead of a rule book all the time. Tiffany gave

1202
01:15:20.159 --> 01:15:24.319
it a seven out of ten. Then Scott D. Smith said,

1203
01:15:24.439 --> 01:15:28.399
I'm not objective. I felt like a little kid watching

1204
01:15:28.479 --> 01:15:33.319
a prequel to TOS in nineteen sixty eight. There were

1205
01:15:33.439 --> 01:15:37.520
tears in my eyes. It was magic. They established his

1206
01:15:37.720 --> 01:15:44.720
relationship with Stock and his creative can do spirit, his compassion, creativity,

1207
01:15:45.199 --> 01:15:51.159
never say die. It was brilliant. Ten So I'm pretty

1208
01:15:51.199 --> 01:15:55.119
much with you on that, Scott. Then Brett Abbott said,

1209
01:15:55.479 --> 01:15:59.039
loved it ten for me. I also had visions of

1210
01:15:59.399 --> 01:16:05.359
the Doomsday Machine. Then Mary Ruland says ten definitely.

1211
01:16:06.760 --> 01:16:10.640
Now we have Snowic Sebastian.

1212
01:16:11.439 --> 01:16:15.119
Not bad, but the original episode Doomsday Machine, who is

1213
01:16:15.199 --> 01:16:16.600
the inspiration of it?

1214
01:16:16.880 --> 01:16:18.199
Was far better written.

1215
01:16:19.039 --> 01:16:23.199
I was frankly waiting with optimism for this new season,

1216
01:16:23.720 --> 01:16:27.079
and I am a bit disappointed for what they delivered

1217
01:16:27.399 --> 01:16:30.800
after all this waiting for a moment. Except the first

1218
01:16:30.920 --> 01:16:36.199
episode and a little this one, the rest are just fillers,

1219
01:16:36.319 --> 01:16:42.760
especially the episode based on the Squire of Gothos, insinuating.

1220
01:16:41.840 --> 01:16:47.359
That the Squire is a que well he is very bad.

1221
01:16:47.439 --> 01:16:51.199
Episode made me feel like I was watching the recent

1222
01:16:51.319 --> 01:16:55.279
Doctor Who episodes, but yet still gave it a seven

1223
01:16:55.319 --> 01:17:01.239
out of ten. Let's see Andy Hillston solid episode. Eight

1224
01:17:01.279 --> 01:17:06.800
out of ten, Carol Anne Bennett ten fantastic and then

1225
01:17:07.159 --> 01:17:12.159
Dennis Gustavson a couple of wonky parts, I e. How

1226
01:17:12.199 --> 01:17:17.920
they eventually solve the communication issue and the propulsion however,

1227
01:17:18.079 --> 01:17:20.439
easily the best episode of the season.

1228
01:17:21.199 --> 01:17:24.000
Loved the crew that ended up on the Farragut.

1229
01:17:23.640 --> 01:17:26.920
As an Easter egg for tos, as well as all

1230
01:17:27.079 --> 01:17:28.000
their actions.

1231
01:17:28.479 --> 01:17:29.279
Nine out of ten.

1232
01:17:30.880 --> 01:17:35.399
Phil Square finally an episode that feels like Star Trek ten.

1233
01:17:36.840 --> 01:17:40.880
Wanda Slaughter good episode. We're seeing these characters develop into

1234
01:17:40.960 --> 01:17:44.920
the people we know and love, I would agree, and

1235
01:17:45.119 --> 01:17:50.479
then Rahem Samad love. It showed a humbled Kirk, like,

1236
01:17:50.800 --> 01:17:55.840
dude isn't perfect, but that greatness is there. Even Ahah

1237
01:17:55.960 --> 01:18:00.920
said it just need to show him. The fans score

1238
01:18:01.479 --> 01:18:02.560
eight point nine.

1239
01:18:04.039 --> 01:18:08.199
Now that's very respectable, very respectable. So Paul, you want

1240
01:18:08.239 --> 01:18:10.319
to give us a quick rundown before we dive into

1241
01:18:10.359 --> 01:18:10.920
the episode.

1242
01:18:11.880 --> 01:18:15.199
It would be my pleasure too. So we're doing two

1243
01:18:15.279 --> 01:18:18.039
episodes this week. As we mentioned it this show so

1244
01:18:22.760 --> 01:18:26.920
Yeah again, Episode six The Sealot who Ate Its Tail.

1245
01:18:27.159 --> 01:18:29.399
So we seem to be off our script. Seems to

1246
01:18:29.439 --> 01:18:35.000
be a little confused tonight's apologies. Essentially, it's Kirk's first

1247
01:18:35.119 --> 01:18:38.960
day as acting captain and things turn disastrous when this

1248
01:18:39.880 --> 01:18:45.880
type of unidentified scavengership seizes the Enterprise. It's James Kirk's

1249
01:18:45.960 --> 01:18:49.600
first command of the USS Farragut, which we've seen in

1250
01:18:49.600 --> 01:18:54.239
the original series referenced in Early Days. The episode Obsession

1251
01:18:54.600 --> 01:18:56.600
is the one that we've been talking about there, and

1252
01:18:56.760 --> 01:19:00.640
it's interrupted by this massive, ancient scavengership that captures the

1253
01:19:00.760 --> 01:19:04.920
Enterprise and consumes anything. And we have a lot of

1254
01:19:04.960 --> 01:19:07.439
scenes with kerk having to overcome his self doubt by

1255
01:19:07.600 --> 01:19:13.159
using human intuition and equal measure of ingenuity. With help

1256
01:19:13.199 --> 01:19:15.880
from his future crewmates on the team, they come up

1257
01:19:15.920 --> 01:19:18.279
with a plan to help lure the ship into a track,

1258
01:19:19.239 --> 01:19:23.880
very risky maneuver, but inspired by his conversation with Spock

1259
01:19:24.039 --> 01:19:27.079
and a vulcan expression that helps him embrace the burdens

1260
01:19:27.159 --> 01:19:32.000
and responsibilities of command. So this is a very interesting

1261
01:19:32.479 --> 01:19:35.199
nostalgic episode, and I think based on some of the

1262
01:19:35.399 --> 01:19:39.239
comments we saw, this is really giving a lot of

1263
01:19:39.279 --> 01:19:42.359
the audience what they have been wanting, okay, And it's

1264
01:19:42.479 --> 01:19:47.239
definitely a big bolstering bit of enthusiasm for some of

1265
01:19:47.600 --> 01:19:50.399
the chatter that's let out there that when Strange New

1266
01:19:50.479 --> 01:19:52.840
World sails off into the sunset, that we will be

1267
01:19:52.920 --> 01:19:57.319
bringing together all of the new iterations of the Early

1268
01:19:57.439 --> 01:20:01.560
Days Enterprise crew into doing a basically original series prequel,

1269
01:20:01.720 --> 01:20:04.720
if you will, early Days of Kirk and Command on

1270
01:20:04.760 --> 01:20:06.479
the Starship. And this is going to be a sense

1271
01:20:06.479 --> 01:20:09.000
of what that could be like. And based on this episode,

1272
01:20:09.039 --> 01:20:11.600
I think it's caused for optimism. I thought this was

1273
01:20:11.720 --> 01:20:14.039
you know, I think the Judge episodes on their writing

1274
01:20:14.920 --> 01:20:19.319
and their direction. I'll focus those two inspects because that's

1275
01:20:19.399 --> 01:20:21.720
ninety percent of what the actors have to work with,

1276
01:20:21.880 --> 01:20:24.239
right And I thought this was a very tightly done

1277
01:20:24.279 --> 01:20:30.000
episode for me, probably best episode of the season, you know,

1278
01:20:30.119 --> 01:20:32.079
right up next to head them any Part two, I

1279
01:20:32.119 --> 01:20:34.720
would say in terms of it just feeling fresh and

1280
01:20:34.760 --> 01:20:38.560
where I felt like the writing was concise and the

1281
01:20:38.720 --> 01:20:42.439
dialogue was very character focused. I think there's going to

1282
01:20:42.439 --> 01:20:44.880
be some perspectives that say, yeah, this is basically just

1283
01:20:45.000 --> 01:20:49.199
you know tos recycled, right, But this is I think

1284
01:20:49.239 --> 01:20:52.600
what a lot of folks have been hungering for, right,

1285
01:20:52.720 --> 01:20:55.800
in terms of that fresh type of storytelling where things

1286
01:20:55.840 --> 01:20:59.279
get a little hyperbolic, they get a little bit more

1287
01:21:00.359 --> 01:21:04.119
melodramatic at times, which isn't always necessarily a bad thing.

1288
01:21:04.279 --> 01:21:07.199
And I think that Kirk sells it here, right, And

1289
01:21:07.520 --> 01:21:09.159
I think he did a great job. I like the

1290
01:21:09.239 --> 01:21:13.439
fact that he is not confident at first, right. I

1291
01:21:13.520 --> 01:21:15.359
think that that is something that we should talk about.

1292
01:21:15.880 --> 01:21:19.520
He comes out very cocky initially and he has to

1293
01:21:19.600 --> 01:21:21.479
learn a few lessons to get where he needs to go.

1294
01:21:21.640 --> 01:21:24.600
And I thought that was a great character focused thing,

1295
01:21:24.640 --> 01:21:27.319
giving some aspects of Kirk that we've never really seen before.

1296
01:21:27.479 --> 01:21:32.359
So for me, type pacing, very compelling story, and a

1297
01:21:32.399 --> 01:21:34.840
really interesting twist at the end. So I think we

1298
01:21:34.920 --> 01:21:37.039
have a lot to talk about here. And I think

1299
01:21:37.239 --> 01:21:40.439
clearly of the two episodes were discussing, it seems to

1300
01:21:40.520 --> 01:21:42.520
me the fans embraced this one a little bit more.

1301
01:21:43.880 --> 01:21:45.680
Should we shake up the order a little bit this time?

1302
01:21:45.720 --> 01:21:45.960
Gang?

1303
01:21:46.279 --> 01:21:47.960
I think Eric kind of the last last time, I

1304
01:21:48.000 --> 01:21:49.720
would love to hear what you think about this, Eric.

1305
01:21:53.359 --> 01:21:59.760
Sure, yeah, So here's what I'll say. So, I've been

1306
01:22:00.239 --> 01:22:03.920
kind of sour so far on the idea of a

1307
01:22:04.079 --> 01:22:08.039
TOS what I'm calling a TOS reboot with this new

1308
01:22:08.119 --> 01:22:10.560
crew and kind of like getting the gang back together

1309
01:22:10.680 --> 01:22:14.039
to have more adventures on the Enterprise. If there was

1310
01:22:14.640 --> 01:22:18.199
an episode that was gonna bring me around to loving

1311
01:22:18.600 --> 01:22:22.119
the original the new version of the original crew, it

1312
01:22:22.279 --> 01:22:25.960
was absolutely this one. I thought this episode was fantastic.

1313
01:22:26.960 --> 01:22:30.920
The way that Kirk was written was fantastic. The fact

1314
01:22:30.960 --> 01:22:36.359
that they separated the TOS crew kind of into one

1315
01:22:36.479 --> 01:22:40.039
ship to be able to work together from the strange

1316
01:22:40.079 --> 01:22:44.439
New World's crew really really worked for me. It was

1317
01:22:44.600 --> 01:22:47.000
really nice to see all these fresh faces kind of

1318
01:22:47.079 --> 01:22:50.159
working together. And I agree with what Jim said last

1319
01:22:50.520 --> 01:22:54.880
episode that the development of Scotty so far this season

1320
01:22:55.319 --> 01:23:00.560
is the most interesting new character for me of watching

1321
01:23:01.000 --> 01:23:05.000
him kind of grow into his scottiness, and in fact,

1322
01:23:05.119 --> 01:23:09.119
in this episode we get we see Kirk ask him

1323
01:23:09.159 --> 01:23:12.640
to do the impossible for the first time, so that's

1324
01:23:12.720 --> 01:23:16.840
kind of a kind of a cool thing, you know.

1325
01:23:16.960 --> 01:23:19.640
We get to see some some other neat stuff. I mean,

1326
01:23:19.840 --> 01:23:23.640
of course, the Kirk and Spock relationship. But we also

1327
01:23:23.720 --> 01:23:27.800
get to see, aside from the tos crew stuff, we

1328
01:23:27.920 --> 01:23:32.159
get to see Pike in law on working together kind

1329
01:23:32.239 --> 01:23:35.319
of I think for the first time, which I thought

1330
01:23:35.439 --> 01:23:37.319
was pretty cool to kind of see them sort of

1331
01:23:37.439 --> 01:23:40.159
team up and have to figure out this thing. You know,

1332
01:23:40.239 --> 01:23:42.600
there's this big, nasty umbilical that's in the ship and

1333
01:23:42.640 --> 01:23:44.000
we got to figure out how to get rid of it,

1334
01:23:44.159 --> 01:23:48.840
and we got to kill off these things. That totally

1335
01:23:48.960 --> 01:23:51.239
reminded I wish Charles was here because he'd remind me

1336
01:23:51.319 --> 01:23:55.479
of the race. But there's this race of like rhinoceros

1337
01:23:55.640 --> 01:23:59.079
people in Doctor Who that their suits totally reminded me

1338
01:23:59.520 --> 01:24:03.079
of the Is it the the Jadoon or something like that?

1339
01:24:03.319 --> 01:24:08.800
Anyway the Spies, Oh yeah, okay, Charles is here. Yes,

1340
01:24:08.920 --> 01:24:12.760
I think it's the Jadoon if I remember right. So anyway,

1341
01:24:12.840 --> 01:24:19.000
their suits kind of reminded me of that. The idea

1342
01:24:20.439 --> 01:24:27.520
that the ultimate spoiler alert that the ultimate enemy was ourselves,

1343
01:24:29.800 --> 01:24:33.119
that is pure Star Trek man, Like, you can't get

1344
01:24:33.239 --> 01:24:35.239
more Star Trek than that. Like when they zoom in

1345
01:24:36.039 --> 01:24:39.680
and they see the American flag and they're like, oh,

1346
01:24:39.760 --> 01:24:44.119
it's the XCV three hundred, which of course, if you're

1347
01:24:44.159 --> 01:24:47.720
a nerd about ships, right, Like I've gotten my background here.

1348
01:24:47.800 --> 01:24:52.039
The XCV one hundred was the ringship Enterprise thing. That's

1349
01:24:52.119 --> 01:24:55.600
one of the the things between World War three and

1350
01:24:55.760 --> 01:24:57.760
kind of when we develop technology.

1351
01:24:59.319 --> 01:25:01.119
I was like, oh, oh my god, I can't believe it.

1352
01:25:01.239 --> 01:25:02.239
So I was very.

1353
01:25:02.159 --> 01:25:09.479
Excited about that. But to me, the real like the

1354
01:25:09.640 --> 01:25:14.479
pinnacle of the episode is the fact that Kirk has

1355
01:25:14.560 --> 01:25:20.000
to make this decision wherein he kills off every single

1356
01:25:20.119 --> 01:25:24.199
person on this on this like pirate ship, right, and

1357
01:25:24.279 --> 01:25:29.880
there are seven thousand human beings that he kills off,

1358
01:25:30.680 --> 01:25:33.039
and you can see it. At the end of this episode,

1359
01:25:33.079 --> 01:25:36.800
there's this moment when he has this kind of like

1360
01:25:39.279 --> 01:25:43.199
moral debate with himself like was that the right thing

1361
01:25:43.319 --> 01:25:48.239
to do? And that I mean, there were so many

1362
01:25:48.279 --> 01:25:50.640
great things about this episode, but to me, that's the

1363
01:25:50.800 --> 01:25:54.279
moment when you're kind of like, Okay, I'm watching Star

1364
01:25:54.439 --> 01:25:58.279
Trek here. I'm not watching Star Wars or Aliens or

1365
01:25:58.359 --> 01:26:03.119
The Expanse or anything like that. I'm watching a show

1366
01:26:04.000 --> 01:26:07.640
where people make decisions that they have to make and

1367
01:26:07.800 --> 01:26:11.039
they're not sure if they did the right thing or not,

1368
01:26:12.640 --> 01:26:15.000
but they still made it because they had to do

1369
01:26:15.159 --> 01:26:18.159
something in the moment, and you know, hopefully we're left

1370
01:26:18.239 --> 01:26:20.279
with a little bit of h was it the right thing?

1371
01:26:20.359 --> 01:26:22.359
I mean, I think it would be easy for a

1372
01:26:22.399 --> 01:26:24.079
lot of people to watch the episode and be like, yeah,

1373
01:26:24.079 --> 01:26:25.359
of course it was the right thing to kill off

1374
01:26:25.399 --> 01:26:27.600
the pirates, right they otherwise they would have killed us.

1375
01:26:28.439 --> 01:26:32.119
But the scale of killing off seven thousand people is

1376
01:26:32.159 --> 01:26:35.840
getting to kirk here a little bit. And I really

1377
01:26:35.960 --> 01:26:42.479
really just thought that was that was excellent. So yeah, anyway,

1378
01:26:43.680 --> 01:26:46.239
I don't want to take too much time. This was

1379
01:26:46.359 --> 01:26:49.880
absolutely my favorite episode of the season by a long shot.

1380
01:26:50.840 --> 01:26:52.680
It's hard for me not to rate it as a

1381
01:26:52.760 --> 01:26:54.840
ten because I just can't imagine how they could have

1382
01:26:54.920 --> 01:26:58.560
done a better job with this episode. And it bugs

1383
01:26:58.600 --> 01:27:01.439
me a little bit because I don't want a TOS reboot,

1384
01:27:01.479 --> 01:27:07.000
and yet they totally nailed this episode. So I reluctantly

1385
01:27:07.119 --> 01:27:10.079
give it a ten. What I can't say anything negative

1386
01:27:10.079 --> 01:27:10.920
about the episode?

1387
01:27:13.319 --> 01:27:17.880
Fair enough, fair enough? How about you? Charles, welcome back.

1388
01:27:17.960 --> 01:27:20.760
By the way, Okay, thank you a little bit of

1389
01:27:20.800 --> 01:27:24.439
computer issues for Eric's question, it was the you done.

1390
01:27:26.399 --> 01:27:29.680
That's the species. I pasted a picture even in the

1391
01:27:29.800 --> 01:27:35.359
chat to see what they look like okay, and so

1392
01:27:35.399 --> 01:27:41.439
we've already had one reference to that series thanks to

1393
01:27:44.079 --> 01:27:49.479
I think it's truck Yards. They did some photographing of

1394
01:27:49.640 --> 01:27:55.239
scenes and did some zoom shots and found a Tartis

1395
01:27:56.199 --> 01:28:03.359
inside this ship. It's like, okay, he's in this universe somehow.

1396
01:28:04.680 --> 01:28:07.680
Not sure which doctor it is, but doctor who's in

1397
01:28:07.760 --> 01:28:16.079
here somewhere. I'm trying to get my thoughts going as

1398
01:28:16.119 --> 01:28:20.560
somebody now has past me. Eric was bringing up a

1399
01:28:20.640 --> 01:28:24.640
point and I was gonna spend with it, and I

1400
01:28:24.760 --> 01:28:26.279
forgot which point I was going with.

1401
01:28:28.079 --> 01:28:30.760
But Will Charles, every single one of my points was amazing,

1402
01:28:30.920 --> 01:28:33.159
so you can just pick one and go with it.

1403
01:28:35.960 --> 01:28:42.680
Well, I was thinking of let's talk about characters and

1404
01:28:42.760 --> 01:28:43.720
less about devices.

1405
01:28:45.319 --> 01:28:51.960
Okay, Ellie, I love the line, well I was a

1406
01:28:52.119 --> 01:28:56.000
roadie for the Dead. It's like, of course you were

1407
01:28:56.000 --> 01:28:59.880
a roadie for the Dead. I've got my own cann

1408
01:29:00.520 --> 01:29:06.239
with that itself. But Uncle Jim made the comments like

1409
01:29:06.760 --> 01:29:09.840
did she just pull out in a tarry twenty six hundred?

1410
01:29:09.880 --> 01:29:12.920
It's like, yes, she did, Jim, Even though I'm not

1411
01:29:13.039 --> 01:29:16.520
sure how we got the joystick with a antenna on

1412
01:29:16.680 --> 01:29:22.199
it that was a twenty six hundred, and the clock

1413
01:29:22.359 --> 01:29:25.279
she pulled out the cat with the tail. It's like, yeah,

1414
01:29:25.399 --> 01:29:31.760
you had its usefulness once. But I love the fact that.

1415
01:29:36.520 --> 01:29:40.039
I love the fact that she can bring her pass back.

1416
01:29:40.760 --> 01:29:43.439
It's like, okay, well we can't sit there and send

1417
01:29:43.479 --> 01:29:52.159
a disruption through copper cape copper wiring. It's like, no,

1418
01:29:52.359 --> 01:29:58.840
you can't. That is a creative way of doing communication

1419
01:30:00.439 --> 01:30:06.000
wiring phone cable throughout and sending it through. I love

1420
01:30:06.079 --> 01:30:09.359
that as an idea. Okay, if you can't do current tech,

1421
01:30:10.560 --> 01:30:14.840
use some past tech. I'm surprised she still had ownership

1422
01:30:14.920 --> 01:30:20.039
of all those phones, but I was impressed that she

1423
01:30:20.520 --> 01:30:25.600
did and she could use him. I wish i'd see

1424
01:30:25.600 --> 01:30:27.800
a little more pelly of bringing back some of this

1425
01:30:28.119 --> 01:30:34.359
old stuff and showing kind of showing her age. I

1426
01:30:34.640 --> 01:30:42.800
liked that part of her. I love the ab format

1427
01:30:42.920 --> 01:30:48.439
of this story. But as I mentioned in one thing

1428
01:30:48.520 --> 01:30:53.119
about souring the milk, is the fact that Jordie I

1429
01:30:53.199 --> 01:30:55.920
think it was Jordi and Data who they are trying

1430
01:30:56.000 --> 01:31:01.079
to get the creature unattached to the ship, and they realized, oh,

1431
01:31:01.159 --> 01:31:04.279
if we just spoil the milk a little bit, it'll disconnect.

1432
01:31:05.000 --> 01:31:08.239
Well that's exactly what they did. The umbiligo cord. They spoiled,

1433
01:31:08.359 --> 01:31:12.359
the spoiled what the creature was getting, and the creature

1434
01:31:12.439 --> 01:31:18.840
then the ship let it go. So I like, I

1435
01:31:19.039 --> 01:31:21.119
like what they did with this one. I'm not sure

1436
01:31:21.119 --> 01:31:25.479
I can go quite with it ten, but I can

1437
01:31:25.600 --> 01:31:30.079
go definitely a nine point five on this one. They

1438
01:31:30.119 --> 01:31:31.479
did an excellent job.

1439
01:31:31.399 --> 01:31:31.920
On this one.

1440
01:31:33.840 --> 01:31:36.279
Well that's that's still a very very good score.

1441
01:31:36.439 --> 01:31:36.479
Es.

1442
01:31:37.279 --> 01:31:39.000
How about how about you, V What do you think?

1443
01:31:39.119 --> 01:31:40.399
What do you think about this episode?

1444
01:31:40.680 --> 01:31:45.239
Well, again looking to see what you know across the board.

1445
01:31:46.439 --> 01:31:49.600
If the the through the Lens of Time was more

1446
01:31:49.720 --> 01:31:54.520
Star trek ish, this one definitely was. According to the

1447
01:31:54.680 --> 01:31:59.920
folks out there, there were, but there were some fun moments.

1448
01:32:00.680 --> 01:32:04.399
I think it was a Ortega that's holding the the

1449
01:32:04.520 --> 01:32:11.119
phonus is is this a personal massage device? But Pellia

1450
01:32:11.239 --> 01:32:13.720
and then who was it? She goes into the quarters

1451
01:32:13.800 --> 01:32:16.840
to go get because she's like it. She's basically a hoarder.

1452
01:32:16.960 --> 01:32:19.399
She's collected, you know, she's had five thousand years to

1453
01:32:20.159 --> 01:32:23.800
collect stuff and proving the point that you know, you

1454
01:32:23.960 --> 01:32:26.520
keep the stuff one of these days you'll need it.

1455
01:32:27.960 --> 01:32:31.239
And I can't remember now who was in there with her?

1456
01:32:31.840 --> 01:32:35.760
Who basically said, this is how I expect your quarters

1457
01:32:35.840 --> 01:32:39.000
to look, and that just that just kind of cracked

1458
01:32:39.039 --> 01:32:39.359
me up.

1459
01:32:39.560 --> 01:32:43.720
But that was doctor Benga, Okay, yeah, that's all right.

1460
01:32:43.800 --> 01:32:49.159
I couldn't remember, but just the the whole thing with

1461
01:32:50.479 --> 01:32:53.039
So when Eric was talking, I was I was thinking about,

1462
01:32:53.600 --> 01:32:57.000
you know, how Kirk has to you know, he had

1463
01:32:57.039 --> 01:33:02.399
to eradicate these seven thousand people who had somehow lost

1464
01:33:02.800 --> 01:33:06.279
I guess, lost their humanity. They once were the best

1465
01:33:06.520 --> 01:33:10.239
and then for whatever reason, they just lost sight of

1466
01:33:10.600 --> 01:33:13.479
of who they were supposed to be and he wound

1467
01:33:13.560 --> 01:33:17.680
up having to eradicate them. And I just was thinking

1468
01:33:17.760 --> 01:33:24.800
of Start three, The Search of Stock where you know,

1469
01:33:24.880 --> 01:33:29.039
when he blows up the enterprise and he says, my god, Bones,

1470
01:33:29.079 --> 01:33:32.560
what have I done? And then Bones says, what you've

1471
01:33:32.800 --> 01:33:37.159
always done, you know, taken whatever the I can't remember

1472
01:33:37.199 --> 01:33:40.119
the exact line, but getting you know, basically, he did

1473
01:33:40.199 --> 01:33:43.560
what he had to do, and this is where he starts,

1474
01:33:43.640 --> 01:33:48.119
you know, his first his first time doing what he

1475
01:33:48.239 --> 01:33:51.640
had to do and giving everybody else a fighting chance.

1476
01:33:52.760 --> 01:33:56.159
So I just thought it was it was just a

1477
01:33:56.279 --> 01:33:59.319
brilliant episode. And then at the very end, when they're

1478
01:33:59.359 --> 01:34:03.159
going back and forth between you know, on the on

1479
01:34:03.319 --> 01:34:06.920
the the ship, you know, discovering who these beings were.

1480
01:34:07.840 --> 01:34:10.680
And you know, Stock is looking and he's got this

1481
01:34:11.560 --> 01:34:12.239
looking through the.

1482
01:34:13.840 --> 01:34:19.239
Whatever that device is and realizing what these people on

1483
01:34:19.319 --> 01:34:22.000
the Scavender or these creatures on the Scavenger ship are,

1484
01:34:22.760 --> 01:34:25.600
and then they take off the mask and see it's

1485
01:34:25.640 --> 01:34:26.079
a human.

1486
01:34:26.680 --> 01:34:27.680
That was just brilliant.

1487
01:34:27.760 --> 01:34:29.680
How they went back and forth, back and forth, and

1488
01:34:29.760 --> 01:34:34.399
it just was just that that moment of discovery and

1489
01:34:34.479 --> 01:34:39.239
then I'm discussing, you'll finding out the history of them

1490
01:34:40.039 --> 01:34:44.119
and just wondering, you know, what happened, you know, what

1491
01:34:44.279 --> 01:34:47.159
happened to them along the way. So I would give

1492
01:34:47.239 --> 01:34:50.960
it just to throw a little wrench. Nine point seventy five.

1493
01:34:51.079 --> 01:34:51.520
How about that?

1494
01:34:53.600 --> 01:34:57.600
Nine point all right? How about you, David?

1495
01:34:59.640 --> 01:35:02.720
Yeah, So this episode was really good. I enjoyed it

1496
01:35:02.800 --> 01:35:05.560
a lot. I really enjoyed the way that they got

1497
01:35:05.800 --> 01:35:09.560
all the original crew together, of course except for Shulu

1498
01:35:09.840 --> 01:35:17.319
and tuck Off. However, I'll get back to the whole

1499
01:35:17.359 --> 01:35:20.039
Sulu thing later. The theory that I had that I

1500
01:35:20.119 --> 01:35:23.640
wanted to talk about, but going back when Eric talked

1501
01:35:23.640 --> 01:35:26.159
about about people who loved ships and everything, and I

1502
01:35:26.279 --> 01:35:31.359
was like, the pirate shipping horrible looking. Who came up

1503
01:35:31.399 --> 01:35:33.439
with that design? I was just like, why did they

1504
01:35:33.439 --> 01:35:36.640
put the mouth in there? I mean, which is supposed

1505
01:35:36.640 --> 01:35:40.399
to be like a giant whale swallowing a fish or something.

1506
01:35:40.479 --> 01:35:43.319
But it's just I didn't like that design at all.

1507
01:35:44.039 --> 01:35:48.239
So that might take on the pirate ship. But other

1508
01:35:48.319 --> 01:35:51.199
than that, yeah, the episode was really good. And going

1509
01:35:51.239 --> 01:35:56.279
back on the theory of Shulu man I remembered a

1510
01:35:56.359 --> 01:35:59.239
couple of weeks last week about the character's name who's

1511
01:35:59.279 --> 01:36:03.119
been flying the ship this entire time, not ol Benga Tega.

1512
01:36:03.199 --> 01:36:05.560
I mean, what was the other check that's next to her?

1513
01:36:07.920 --> 01:36:08.760
Did anybody know who?

1514
01:36:09.199 --> 01:36:09.720
I can't remember?

1515
01:36:09.760 --> 01:36:11.800
It's Mitchell. Mitchell.

1516
01:36:12.439 --> 01:36:15.159
I was thinking, is she like related to Shulu somehow?

1517
01:36:16.279 --> 01:36:17.840
I mean, it's the same type of.

1518
01:36:18.279 --> 01:36:19.319
Because she's Asian.

1519
01:36:20.479 --> 01:36:21.760
We're not going to.

1520
01:36:21.800 --> 01:36:24.239
Go there, are We're not going to do that to

1521
01:36:24.319 --> 01:36:26.640
do this, like, that's clearly where he was going. So

1522
01:36:28.279 --> 01:36:31.399
the idea you want to do this it is just

1523
01:36:31.920 --> 01:36:34.680
the love of the twenty first century Enlightenment. You may

1524
01:36:35.439 --> 01:36:37.840
don't go there, okay.

1525
01:36:38.279 --> 01:36:40.439
Either way, I'm just saying that was my theory just

1526
01:36:40.520 --> 01:36:43.840
because of the fact that you know, Shulu comes onto

1527
01:36:43.880 --> 01:36:48.840
the ship eventually, and so I thought maybe since Cook

1528
01:36:49.119 --> 01:36:51.680
is going to take over the Enterprise eventually, that you know,

1529
01:36:51.920 --> 01:36:57.439
somehow Shulu would end up coming on as a recommendation

1530
01:36:58.000 --> 01:37:04.119
from somebody, so you uh yeah. Other than that, the

1531
01:37:04.199 --> 01:37:09.560
episode was really good. I enjoyed the all the jokes

1532
01:37:09.560 --> 01:37:14.359
that they made and all the little you know, uh

1533
01:37:15.479 --> 01:37:21.600
which the word remember Billia. But anyway, yeah, I would

1534
01:37:21.600 --> 01:37:23.039
actually give this episode of nine.

1535
01:37:23.600 --> 01:37:28.399
It would that good for me and nine. All right. Well,

1536
01:37:28.680 --> 01:37:32.399
so I enjoyed this episode immensely. But there were a

1537
01:37:32.479 --> 01:37:35.359
couple of things that I have to point out because

1538
01:37:35.359 --> 01:37:39.119
I feel I would be remiss if I didn't. First,

1539
01:37:40.039 --> 01:37:44.520
Portagis touching wires together to jump start the bridge kind

1540
01:37:44.560 --> 01:37:47.640
of got me like, wait a minute, Wait a minute, what.

1541
01:37:47.680 --> 01:37:49.680
Are you talking about that, Jim. That was literally one

1542
01:37:49.680 --> 01:37:51.720
of the coolest moments where it's like this big fat

1543
01:37:51.960 --> 01:37:54.960
can't possibly be in the twenty third century opera wire.

1544
01:37:56.399 --> 01:37:59.760
That's a lot that I'm like, oh my god, what

1545
01:38:00.079 --> 01:38:03.800
they have fiber optics? By then Pelio is running phone

1546
01:38:03.880 --> 01:38:05.439
lines and did it take you?

1547
01:38:05.800 --> 01:38:07.720
Did it take you out of the story? Though, No,

1548
01:38:07.880 --> 01:38:08.159
I'm just.

1549
01:38:08.239 --> 01:38:11.199
Pointing out the fact that I'm like really, come on, people,

1550
01:38:11.359 --> 01:38:16.479
I'm like, all right, I had to mention that. And tropes.

1551
01:38:17.600 --> 01:38:19.159
We had the trope in the first one, and we

1552
01:38:19.239 --> 01:38:21.760
got a trope in this one with the giant super ship.

1553
01:38:21.880 --> 01:38:25.279
That's indestructible type of deal. They did it in Nemesis

1554
01:38:25.359 --> 01:38:28.119
with the scimitar. They do it all the time. They

1555
01:38:28.199 --> 01:38:30.399
did it in this episode. So you know the two

1556
01:38:30.479 --> 01:38:34.520
things right there. But that aside, I enjoyed it. I

1557
01:38:34.840 --> 01:38:38.840
thought it was awesome. And Scotty Scotti is the man.

1558
01:38:39.760 --> 01:38:42.960
This Scotti, I think this version of Scotty, I think

1559
01:38:43.079 --> 01:38:46.399
is a better version of Scotty than James Douhan's version

1560
01:38:46.439 --> 01:38:49.640
of Scotty because this because this version of Scott.

1561
01:38:53.720 --> 01:38:54.319
Oh is that.

1562
01:39:00.680 --> 01:39:01.319
Sloops.

1563
01:39:10.680 --> 01:39:16.960
Sorry, wow, we're we're figuring it out.

1564
01:39:20.960 --> 01:39:23.039
I think this program is brought to you by the

1565
01:39:23.159 --> 01:39:26.359
United Nations. They slowly dissolving organizations will no longer be

1566
01:39:26.399 --> 01:39:26.920
here very soon.

1567
01:39:28.359 --> 01:39:33.640
Well, while Jim's paused, I realized my one extra comment

1568
01:39:33.680 --> 01:39:37.359
I was throwing in, and this was a bit of

1569
01:39:37.520 --> 01:39:42.720
a Kobyashi maru for Kirk. But they always made the

1570
01:39:42.800 --> 01:39:46.439
comment too. Who is the only person to ever pass

1571
01:39:46.920 --> 01:39:52.760
the kobashi maru because he cheated Kirk. So I think

1572
01:39:52.840 --> 01:39:57.239
this might be just a positive direction of what we

1573
01:39:57.359 --> 01:39:58.159
see of Kirk.

1574
01:40:00.079 --> 01:40:05.760
So I'm back speaking of Scottie and the mad Bastard.

1575
01:40:07.079 --> 01:40:10.079
I Uh, I think this Scottie is brilliant. I think

1576
01:40:10.159 --> 01:40:12.840
he's I think I think he's better than James doing

1577
01:40:12.880 --> 01:40:15.000
Scotty because he tells Kirk the way it is. He

1578
01:40:15.119 --> 01:40:20.399
reminds me of a cross between the Kelvin Scotty, you know.

1579
01:40:20.600 --> 01:40:23.800
He tells Kirk the way it is and doesn't hold back.

1580
01:40:23.880 --> 01:40:26.560
And I really really like the direction that they're taking

1581
01:40:27.159 --> 01:40:30.079
Scotty in in this episode. I thought it was brilliant

1582
01:40:30.359 --> 01:40:33.039
and I really enjoyed seeing the crew work together and

1583
01:40:33.840 --> 01:40:36.880
you know, present their their options to the captain or

1584
01:40:37.000 --> 01:40:41.199
to Kirk, and then choosing, you know, Spock to go in.

1585
01:40:41.319 --> 01:40:45.119
And we see that first Kirk Spock moment really that

1586
01:40:45.239 --> 01:40:48.079
we'll see many many many more times to come, and

1587
01:40:48.199 --> 01:40:51.359
he's he's looking at the three D chess with his captain,

1588
01:40:51.399 --> 01:40:54.039
which is something that Kirk has spot did a lot

1589
01:40:54.760 --> 01:40:57.600
on TOS So I really liked that as well. And

1590
01:40:57.720 --> 01:40:59.560
I liked the design of the farragt. I thought that

1591
01:40:59.680 --> 01:41:04.159
was cool, you know, and how I thought it was

1592
01:41:04.279 --> 01:41:06.800
really really neat how Spot came up with the idea

1593
01:41:07.479 --> 01:41:12.239
to detonate the Klingon warp cores that was inside of

1594
01:41:12.359 --> 01:41:17.399
the ship because their weapons we couldn't penetrate the hull,

1595
01:41:17.880 --> 01:41:20.439
but when it opened up its mouth, they had the

1596
01:41:20.600 --> 01:41:23.000
Klingon D seven in there that had been ripped apart,

1597
01:41:23.119 --> 01:41:28.199
and he targeted the warp core part of the ship

1598
01:41:28.279 --> 01:41:30.520
that they showed in the graphic and destroyed it from

1599
01:41:30.560 --> 01:41:33.439
the inside. I thought that was really, really awesome. And

1600
01:41:33.680 --> 01:41:36.199
is anybody else glad that they lived through the nineteen eighties?

1601
01:41:36.319 --> 01:41:39.520
Like Pellia, I mean that line. I was like, I

1602
01:41:39.720 --> 01:41:44.720
was cracking up when she said that. And her quarters,

1603
01:41:44.800 --> 01:41:47.319
did they let you down? I mean, they were exactly

1604
01:41:47.359 --> 01:41:50.880
the way I had all visioned. Yeah, yeah, So.

1605
01:41:51.720 --> 01:41:54.439
I'm pretty sure I had one of those phones that

1606
01:41:54.640 --> 01:41:56.319
she was pulling out.

1607
01:41:56.680 --> 01:41:57.680
Sure I had one of those.

1608
01:41:58.119 --> 01:42:00.600
I know that I had an Atari twenty six that

1609
01:42:00.880 --> 01:42:03.399
I can guarantee you. I mean, any kid growing up

1610
01:42:03.600 --> 01:42:06.640
in the eighties had one of those. So yeah, I

1611
01:42:07.159 --> 01:42:09.800
really really enjoyed the episode, and I really like the

1612
01:42:10.439 --> 01:42:13.720
speech that Kirk has or not Kirk, that Pike has

1613
01:42:13.800 --> 01:42:15.720
with Pike has with Kirk at the end of the

1614
01:42:15.760 --> 01:42:18.479
episode where he's talking about sitting in a chair and

1615
01:42:18.520 --> 01:42:22.279
the decisions that you make and kind of putting giving

1616
01:42:22.439 --> 01:42:24.760
Kirk that gentle nudge that's going to put him on

1617
01:42:24.840 --> 01:42:27.840
the path that he eventually will end up on. So, yes,

1618
01:42:28.000 --> 01:42:31.039
this if this is the type of show, like Eric said,

1619
01:42:31.279 --> 01:42:33.000
if this is the type of show that they're going

1620
01:42:33.079 --> 01:42:36.439
to give us with this tos Soft reboot whatever you

1621
01:42:36.560 --> 01:42:39.279
want to call it, Star Trek Year one is what

1622
01:42:39.399 --> 01:42:42.800
I've been hearing it called on the internet, then and

1623
01:42:42.920 --> 01:42:44.479
this is the quality they're going to give us and

1624
01:42:44.520 --> 01:42:45.840
the type of show they're going to give us, then

1625
01:42:45.880 --> 01:42:48.800
I'm off for it. So yeah, I'm I'm going to

1626
01:42:48.840 --> 01:42:53.199
go with the nine point two for this episode. Thoroughly,

1627
01:42:53.319 --> 01:42:58.000
thoroughly enjoyed it. So that's my take. So Charles, how

1628
01:42:58.039 --> 01:43:00.119
do we compare to our minions? Oh?

1629
01:43:00.159 --> 01:43:01.600
Oh, well, I haven't gotten the score yet.

1630
01:43:02.960 --> 01:43:04.840
Oh didn't you give your score to start with when

1631
01:43:04.840 --> 01:43:09.439
you did the Nope? Intro? Nope did I? Eric?

1632
01:43:09.520 --> 01:43:13.159
You know you're paying attention, No score given.

1633
01:43:13.239 --> 01:43:16.199
You gave some basic comments, but you didn't really fill

1634
01:43:16.279 --> 01:43:17.319
it out and give a score.

1635
01:43:18.000 --> 01:43:20.279
Yeah, I'm happy to say a little more if we.

1636
01:43:20.359 --> 01:43:23.079
Have time Okay, yeah, absolutely, yeah, say it.

1637
01:43:23.159 --> 01:43:25.479
Then we got we got sixteen minutes, plenty of time.

1638
01:43:26.119 --> 01:43:29.439
Jesus, it's just more over the map here. I got

1639
01:43:29.560 --> 01:43:31.439
to agree with Eric, I think best episode of the season.

1640
01:43:32.960 --> 01:43:36.479
I think clearly it was focused, it was clear, it

1641
01:43:36.640 --> 01:43:40.279
was clean, The pacing was really tight, the writing was

1642
01:43:40.319 --> 01:43:43.279
really sharp. It was right thought provoking ending that I

1643
01:43:43.319 --> 01:43:45.520
think is what we're looking to get from Star Trek.

1644
01:43:46.279 --> 01:43:49.720
It felt like a classic bit of writing from the episode.

1645
01:43:49.760 --> 01:43:51.359
But what I like the most is just, you know,

1646
01:43:52.199 --> 01:43:55.920
the focus on Kirk as a character who has an

1647
01:43:56.079 --> 01:44:01.159
arc through the episode, right, he grows from the very curious,

1648
01:44:01.439 --> 01:44:07.439
borderline reckless leader at the beginning to a man who

1649
01:44:07.520 --> 01:44:10.880
was able to embrace the personal cost of what command

1650
01:44:11.720 --> 01:44:16.319
will take from you and have to make difficult choices,

1651
01:44:16.399 --> 01:44:18.520
which is what a leader is all about. Somebody who

1652
01:44:18.600 --> 01:44:26.119
puts the group head of himself. That's important, right, and

1653
01:44:26.279 --> 01:44:29.880
that then you make hard decisions. Those decisions often have

1654
01:44:30.079 --> 01:44:32.399
consequences the change who you are. And I thought that

1655
01:44:32.560 --> 01:44:35.239
was great. That focus on him as an emerging leader,

1656
01:44:35.319 --> 01:44:40.920
I thought was outstanding and being able to become humble

1657
01:44:41.079 --> 01:44:43.479
enough and have humility enough to realize that he still

1658
01:44:43.520 --> 01:44:46.199
has to learn much before he's able to be a commander.

1659
01:44:46.239 --> 01:44:49.800
So I thought that was outstanding, really really well done,

1660
01:44:50.000 --> 01:44:53.079
and I just love the mood. The mood started out great, right,

1661
01:44:53.159 --> 01:44:55.399
I mean you know, yeah, maybe a trope of the

1662
01:44:55.439 --> 01:44:59.119
giant ship, but the way that they set the stage

1663
01:44:59.119 --> 01:45:01.000
it was very foreboth and I thought it really did

1664
01:45:01.079 --> 01:45:02.680
begin with it real sense, before we knew what we

1665
01:45:02.760 --> 01:45:04.119
were facing. It was really menacing.

1666
01:45:04.199 --> 01:45:04.840
We didn't know what we.

1667
01:45:04.880 --> 01:45:08.079
Were and everybody's sort of mentioning their own myth or

1668
01:45:08.159 --> 01:45:11.479
folklore from their culture about what it is that they've seen, right,

1669
01:45:11.560 --> 01:45:14.680
I mean very much evoked to me like a doomsday

1670
01:45:14.760 --> 01:45:19.640
machine vibe from the great Norman Spinrad episode, right, really,

1671
01:45:20.760 --> 01:45:22.640
you know, it's like we're getting in deep water here,

1672
01:45:22.680 --> 01:45:23.439
what's going to happen?

1673
01:45:23.560 --> 01:45:23.680
Right?

1674
01:45:23.760 --> 01:45:25.439
And it was just really and then all of a sudden,

1675
01:45:25.439 --> 01:45:27.880
they're coming on the heels of a planet that's being

1676
01:45:27.960 --> 01:45:30.119
blown apart, which is just shocking, right, and then we

1677
01:45:30.279 --> 01:45:34.720
ultimately find out who's responsible for that. It's a great

1678
01:45:34.760 --> 01:45:36.840
piece of writing. So for me, it was really great.

1679
01:45:37.399 --> 01:45:39.520
This is the kind of direction I would always keep

1680
01:45:39.560 --> 01:45:41.880
hoping the Star Trek writing would return to, not that

1681
01:45:41.920 --> 01:45:44.880
I necessarily need to see the original series. But this

1682
01:45:45.039 --> 01:45:48.239
kind of writing is really what people turn to Star

1683
01:45:48.359 --> 01:45:53.439
Trek for character development and a really full resolution of

1684
01:45:54.439 --> 01:45:56.359
the end of the story. So I thought it was

1685
01:45:56.399 --> 01:46:02.439
extremely well done, real tempting to take a point off

1686
01:46:02.680 --> 01:46:05.319
for the whole telephone nonsense, because then I felt like,

1687
01:46:05.399 --> 01:46:08.520
that's like, you know, the writer's room chaos, you know,

1688
01:46:08.640 --> 01:46:10.600
and when too many people have been to the you know,

1689
01:46:11.239 --> 01:46:15.279
the weed store that afternoon, and let's do like telephones man,

1690
01:46:15.600 --> 01:46:18.039
and like you know, I'm like, oh, yeah, is that

1691
01:46:18.119 --> 01:46:18.640
a good idea?

1692
01:46:18.800 --> 01:46:19.199
Doesn't that?

1693
01:46:20.039 --> 01:46:23.720
But but doesn't that like knock down the like serious

1694
01:46:23.840 --> 01:46:24.479
net level?

1695
01:46:24.760 --> 01:46:25.000
Does it?

1696
01:46:25.119 --> 01:46:28.119
Doesn't it? Does it make it more fun? And should

1697
01:46:28.159 --> 01:46:30.640
a Star Trek episode have the funness aspect?

1698
01:46:30.880 --> 01:46:33.720
I don't know it, should you know, into it? But

1699
01:46:33.840 --> 01:46:36.880
it's also it's like not every episode is appropriated the

1700
01:46:37.039 --> 01:46:41.359
Doomsday Machine. Eric was there like a running joke about farting.

1701
01:46:41.479 --> 01:46:44.439
No like but that one, No, but that one. No,

1702
01:46:44.680 --> 01:46:47.640
but that one had a real focus on Matt Decker

1703
01:46:47.720 --> 01:46:50.039
two as a character, which I think was a different

1704
01:46:50.199 --> 01:46:53.840
kind of like vibe no, you're you're totally right, You're

1705
01:46:53.880 --> 01:46:54.439
totally yeah.

1706
01:46:54.439 --> 01:46:55.960
I think they just I think it was just like, oh,

1707
01:46:56.159 --> 01:46:58.319
we need to give the people something to do to

1708
01:46:58.479 --> 01:47:00.359
kind of make it fun and cutesy. And I think

1709
01:47:00.399 --> 01:47:03.960
that they are like run, They're throwing kitchen sink ideas

1710
01:47:04.079 --> 01:47:06.680
to get something going on with Bellier here, and I'm

1711
01:47:06.720 --> 01:47:08.800
really ready to be done with her, you know, I

1712
01:47:09.000 --> 01:47:11.800
really really am. I mean, Carolcane's great. I like her,

1713
01:47:11.880 --> 01:47:14.079
but it's just she does not feel like a Star

1714
01:47:14.159 --> 01:47:16.199
Trek character to me, and she's slowing down the story,

1715
01:47:16.680 --> 01:47:18.319
so I'd be ready to move on from that. So

1716
01:47:18.439 --> 01:47:20.520
I mean, while it's really tempting to just give it

1717
01:47:20.560 --> 01:47:23.279
a nine because I want to support the direction of

1718
01:47:23.319 --> 01:47:26.000
this kind of show, this kind of episode, I gotta

1719
01:47:26.039 --> 01:47:28.239
go with Reic and I got away a ten because

1720
01:47:28.319 --> 01:47:29.880
this is what I'm looking for. And we've had a

1721
01:47:29.920 --> 01:47:34.640
lot of you know, le I mean take it from

1722
01:47:34.680 --> 01:47:37.560
the you know, the mouths of the folks leaving our

1723
01:47:37.600 --> 01:47:39.840
top fan comments right people in the middle. I mean,

1724
01:47:40.119 --> 01:47:42.800
are you that sense of theme emerging this week? People

1725
01:47:42.840 --> 01:47:45.039
are not really thrilled with this season as a whole.

1726
01:47:45.119 --> 01:47:47.760
They're you know, last a halfway point, and they're they're

1727
01:47:47.840 --> 01:47:51.640
kind of you know, their skarts aren't getting blown up, right,

1728
01:47:51.840 --> 01:47:54.399
they're just not they're there. They seem a little lackluster

1729
01:47:54.439 --> 01:47:54.920
about things.

1730
01:47:54.960 --> 01:47:56.239
Does it seem like the vipe you all?

1731
01:47:57.199 --> 01:47:59.199
But but yeah, for me, I would give it a ten.

1732
01:47:59.359 --> 01:48:03.079
And I was like, more of this believed And Paul Wesley.

1733
01:48:02.840 --> 01:48:03.319
Great job.

1734
01:48:04.520 --> 01:48:08.680
I'm excited to, you know, to keep seeing that character

1735
01:48:08.800 --> 01:48:12.800
grow and and see more of his genesis of a

1736
01:48:12.800 --> 01:48:14.720
ob So great episode. Loved it.

1737
01:48:17.119 --> 01:48:18.920
You know what I wish we had, Paul, I wish

1738
01:48:19.000 --> 01:48:24.760
we had kind of the style of reviews of all

1739
01:48:24.840 --> 01:48:26.880
of the other series, right, I wish we had had

1740
01:48:26.960 --> 01:48:31.359
the Internet and we could have people comment on Next

1741
01:48:31.439 --> 01:48:35.399
Generation on a weekly basis and kind of tell us

1742
01:48:35.560 --> 01:48:39.960
like what they thought, because I would, I would. I

1743
01:48:40.000 --> 01:48:43.680
don't really know, but I would sense that, like, you know,

1744
01:48:43.760 --> 01:48:45.800
first of all, we got the ten episodes versus the

1745
01:48:46.119 --> 01:48:50.960
twenty six episodes, and then you got the budget thing, right, Like,

1746
01:48:51.039 --> 01:48:53.159
the budgets are much higher now, so there's a whole

1747
01:48:53.279 --> 01:48:56.000
like technological thing that sort of makes things more interesting.

1748
01:48:56.600 --> 01:49:04.880
But would the in our collective memory, the Next Generation

1749
01:49:05.279 --> 01:49:09.680
is overall an amazing show. But if you were to

1750
01:49:10.359 --> 01:49:13.920
but if yeah, but if you were to add, well, okay,

1751
01:49:14.000 --> 01:49:15.680
fair enough, fair enough, But if you were to add

1752
01:49:15.800 --> 01:49:19.520
up like how many stinkers there are? What would the

1753
01:49:20.000 --> 01:49:23.680
what would the percentage be? And is it any lower

1754
01:49:24.039 --> 01:49:27.279
or any higher than the sort of stinkers that were

1755
01:49:27.319 --> 01:49:30.039
getting now? I don't know. This is a question I

1756
01:49:30.079 --> 01:49:31.560
don't know the answer to, but I just think it's

1757
01:49:31.560 --> 01:49:32.920
an interesting thing to think about.

1758
01:49:33.640 --> 01:49:37.039
It is that's a great question, you know, for I

1759
01:49:37.079 --> 01:49:38.359
think a lot of us are like this with next

1760
01:49:38.399 --> 01:49:40.399
Gen right, Like it's just like if you're watching and

1761
01:49:40.560 --> 01:49:42.880
like if you still have like you know, regular TV

1762
01:49:43.119 --> 01:49:45.000
running right, Like I don't know, what are those old

1763
01:49:45.039 --> 01:49:47.680
channels like TNT or whatever, right, and you happen to

1764
01:49:47.800 --> 01:49:50.600
just be, oh, look a structor episode, Right, you pretty

1765
01:49:50.680 --> 01:49:54.079
much know what next Gen within like fifteen seconds or

1766
01:49:54.119 --> 01:49:56.000
so if it's an episode that you're going to stick

1767
01:49:56.039 --> 01:49:58.760
with it, but what or not? Or you're like, what

1768
01:49:58.960 --> 01:50:03.520
the hell is this prot I know Dallas Paint and

1769
01:50:03.800 --> 01:50:09.399
a lot of right, but you can tell really quickly, right,

1770
01:50:09.560 --> 01:50:11.560
and uh, it's and so it's it's funny. I mean,

1771
01:50:11.880 --> 01:50:14.680
it's a keeper and it's a really great episode right here.

1772
01:50:14.760 --> 01:50:16.760
Then you're does, man, how many times have seen it?

1773
01:50:16.800 --> 01:50:19.439
You're gonna keep watching it? And you're gonna just drink deep.

1774
01:50:20.079 --> 01:50:23.920
So it's better true, I really, and so it's more

1775
01:50:24.000 --> 01:50:26.760
seasons to come. I think their average will, like you say, improve,

1776
01:50:26.840 --> 01:50:29.680
I hope, especially as they get You cannot avoid the

1777
01:50:29.760 --> 01:50:32.319
fact that when they see the reaction this episode does,

1778
01:50:32.800 --> 01:50:35.000
that's going to translate back to them and go okay,

1779
01:50:35.279 --> 01:50:38.159
more like this, because you know, I mean, they look

1780
01:50:38.159 --> 01:50:41.840
at their reactions. I'm sure sorry for getting full ahead

1781
01:50:41.880 --> 01:50:42.159
of steam.

1782
01:50:44.319 --> 01:50:46.840
I don't know is yeah, you deserve it as much

1783
01:50:46.840 --> 01:50:48.640
as any of us do. And I like when I

1784
01:50:48.880 --> 01:50:50.920
look back at kind of like the modern not to

1785
01:50:51.119 --> 01:50:52.840
we've We've still got nine minutes, so I'm gonna take

1786
01:50:52.880 --> 01:50:55.159
one more minute. But like h when I look at

1787
01:50:55.199 --> 01:50:57.359
the modern era of Star Trek, it started with Star

1788
01:50:57.439 --> 01:51:01.239
Trek Discovery, right, And I think that unfortunate. We're at

1789
01:51:01.279 --> 01:51:04.199
a point now where Star Trek Discovery is enough in

1790
01:51:04.359 --> 01:51:07.079
the past that people have pretty much formed their opinions

1791
01:51:07.399 --> 01:51:13.640
about it, and their opinions won't change until the next generation,

1792
01:51:13.960 --> 01:51:17.319
so to speak, of Star Trek fans comes out. And

1793
01:51:17.880 --> 01:51:21.800
I think that that opinion seems to be Oh, it

1794
01:51:21.960 --> 01:51:25.359
was too and god, I hate to say this term

1795
01:51:25.720 --> 01:51:30.720
v but like it was too woke. Right, I disagree,

1796
01:51:30.960 --> 01:51:33.840
but like that seems to be the overall. What Star

1797
01:51:34.079 --> 01:51:36.800
Trek Strange New Worlds has done is they've given us

1798
01:51:36.960 --> 01:51:40.640
the White Captain, They've given us characters we are familiar with,

1799
01:51:41.079 --> 01:51:44.399
you know, so it automatically is kind of more palatable

1800
01:51:44.520 --> 01:51:50.279
than Star Trek Discovery was. And so now we're judging

1801
01:51:50.359 --> 01:51:53.800
it on an apples to Apple's basis, to previous shows

1802
01:51:53.960 --> 01:51:57.199
like Next Generation and like Tos, whereas Star Trek Discovery

1803
01:51:57.720 --> 01:52:01.680
wasn't able to be judged in those same terms because

1804
01:52:01.720 --> 01:52:04.279
it was just so that was such a crazy sound

1805
01:52:06.119 --> 01:52:09.039
because it was just such a different thing. Anyway, I

1806
01:52:09.119 --> 01:52:13.399
just wanted to mention the Yeah, I just wanted to

1807
01:52:13.479 --> 01:52:16.159
mention how I feel like Star Trek is such an

1808
01:52:16.199 --> 01:52:20.720
interesting thing in the modern era because Discovery was like

1809
01:52:20.880 --> 01:52:26.600
two woke, you know, Prodigy was for kids. Lower Decks

1810
01:52:26.720 --> 01:52:29.520
makes fun of Star Trek Strange New Worlds is really

1811
01:52:29.600 --> 01:52:32.479
the only apples to apples comparison that we have against

1812
01:52:32.600 --> 01:52:36.199
previous Star Trek And I don't know what that means,

1813
01:52:36.239 --> 01:52:37.880
but I just I think it's a different I think

1814
01:52:37.920 --> 01:52:39.720
we're judging it in a different way than we have

1815
01:52:39.880 --> 01:52:42.199
judged any other Star Trek in the last ten years.

1816
01:52:43.760 --> 01:52:48.039
Absolutely so Charles Minions versus Truxperts.

1817
01:52:49.640 --> 01:52:56.439
Well, it's interesting the numbers because the Minions giving an

1818
01:52:56.520 --> 01:53:00.800
eight point nine was their highest to the sea so far.

1819
01:53:02.439 --> 01:53:06.279
The truck Spirts gave it nine point six, which is

1820
01:53:06.439 --> 01:53:08.520
our highest score of the season.

1821
01:53:11.039 --> 01:53:13.720
All right, So we're all agreed with the Minions that

1822
01:53:13.800 --> 01:53:17.880
this was this is the direction they should go for sure.

1823
01:53:19.199 --> 01:53:21.279
So I told you guys at the top of the

1824
01:53:21.319 --> 01:53:23.159
show we weren't going to be doing any birthdays, but

1825
01:53:23.239 --> 01:53:25.640
we are going to be doing remembrances because I think

1826
01:53:25.840 --> 01:53:28.680
that's important and we have some really good ones here

1827
01:53:29.279 --> 01:53:49.760
and so for that, that was not a Clinton song,

1828
01:53:50.079 --> 01:53:51.720
Okay to Mike, is yours Eric?

1829
01:53:52.359 --> 01:53:52.680
All right?

1830
01:53:52.760 --> 01:53:57.840
This week we remember five members of our Star Trek

1831
01:53:57.880 --> 01:54:01.520
community who have gone before us. The first is Laurel Goodwin,

1832
01:54:01.840 --> 01:54:05.560
the actress who played the original j M. Coult in

1833
01:54:05.680 --> 01:54:10.560
the first Star Trek the original series pilot, The Cage.

1834
01:54:10.680 --> 01:54:14.439
Happy birthday to Laurel Goodwin, Happy birthday, as well to

1835
01:54:14.680 --> 01:54:19.000
Jane Wyatt, the Emmy Award winning American actress who played

1836
01:54:19.399 --> 01:54:22.960
our original Amanda Grayson in the TOS second season episode

1837
01:54:23.039 --> 01:54:27.640
Journey to Babel and in Star Trek for the Voyage Home.

1838
01:54:28.159 --> 01:54:30.199
Of course, if you don't know who Amanda Grayson is,

1839
01:54:30.840 --> 01:54:36.119
that's box Mom Yo. Happy birthday, Jane Wyatt Another Jane.

1840
01:54:36.239 --> 01:54:40.039
Happy birthday to Jane Webb, the actress who voiced Lara,

1841
01:54:40.920 --> 01:54:44.560
the Vedala female in the Star Trek the animated series

1842
01:54:44.640 --> 01:54:48.760
first season episode The Jihad, another very excellent episode of

1843
01:54:48.880 --> 01:54:51.880
the animated series. She lived to be eighty four years old.

1844
01:54:52.640 --> 01:54:56.760
Happy Birthday, Jane. Happy birthday as well to Charles Cooper,

1845
01:54:56.960 --> 01:55:00.680
the actor who portrayed Cord the Klingon in Star Trek

1846
01:55:00.920 --> 01:55:06.119
five The Final Frontier, and also played Kempec in the

1847
01:55:06.319 --> 01:55:10.319
TNG third and fourth season episodes Sins of the Father

1848
01:55:10.720 --> 01:55:15.880
and Reunion. Happy Birthday, Charles Cooper, and our last birthday

1849
01:55:15.920 --> 01:55:19.039
this week is the Great Bird of the Galaxy himself.

1850
01:55:19.119 --> 01:55:24.800
Happy birthday to Gene Roddenberry, the filmmaker TV producer best

1851
01:55:24.840 --> 01:55:27.760
known as the creator of the science fiction television series

1852
01:55:28.359 --> 01:55:32.439
Star Trek. Gene Rodberry, people like to evoke you as

1853
01:55:32.600 --> 01:55:36.239
time goes by, but you are the one who came

1854
01:55:36.359 --> 01:55:39.279
up with the concept, who did the pitch, who built

1855
01:55:39.399 --> 01:55:42.960
the franchise that we all love. So we really, really,

1856
01:55:43.079 --> 01:55:47.359
really more than anybody else, probably appreciate your contributions to

1857
01:55:47.479 --> 01:55:50.920
this amazing franchise. You did die too early at the

1858
01:55:51.000 --> 01:55:54.680
age of seventy years old, way back in nineteen ninety one.

1859
01:55:55.520 --> 01:55:58.960
But as people would say, hopefully you are not rolling

1860
01:55:59.039 --> 01:56:03.039
over and you are enjoying some of the ways in

1861
01:56:03.159 --> 01:56:07.920
which your franchise have been carried forward into the future

1862
01:56:08.000 --> 01:56:09.680
and all the way into the twenty first century. Here,

1863
01:56:09.760 --> 01:56:16.399
So happy birthday. Jean Roddenberry born August nineteenth. Somewhere between

1864
01:56:16.479 --> 01:56:18.159
nineteen twenty one and nineteen twenty four?

1865
01:56:18.359 --> 01:56:18.479
Is that?

1866
01:56:18.560 --> 01:56:18.720
What that?

1867
01:56:19.079 --> 01:56:21.039
Do we not know what year he was actually born?

1868
01:56:23.800 --> 01:56:26.279
My notes seem to have some confusion on that.

1869
01:56:27.039 --> 01:56:29.720
I think it's I think he was he was born

1870
01:56:29.800 --> 01:56:32.560
on nineteenth of August of twenty one, but he died

1871
01:56:32.760 --> 01:56:34.399
on October twenty fourth.

1872
01:56:34.760 --> 01:56:38.279
Oh, I see, I'm getting the debt. I understand what's happening. Okay,

1873
01:56:38.399 --> 01:56:42.279
So he was born August nineteenth, nineteen twenty one, died

1874
01:56:42.840 --> 01:56:48.039
October twenty fourth, nineteen ninety one. Happy birthday to Jean Roddenberry.

1875
01:56:48.079 --> 01:56:49.399
Thanks V for straightening me up.

1876
01:56:51.319 --> 01:56:51.800
Well, I love it.

1877
01:56:52.039 --> 01:56:55.680
Yeah, his son is carrying on his legacy. Can you

1878
01:56:55.720 --> 01:56:58.119
see him in the credit says Eugene Roddenberry.

1879
01:56:58.319 --> 01:57:03.880
So and we have one very important birthday left, an

1880
01:57:03.920 --> 01:57:06.600
actual living birthday, a birthday of someone who's here with

1881
01:57:06.760 --> 01:57:11.560
us right now, our very own miracle worker from Portland himself, David.

1882
01:57:12.279 --> 01:57:17.800
Happy birthday, David. The podcast which is not survive without

1883
01:57:17.880 --> 01:57:23.359
our miracle worker, and happy happy birthday to David. All

1884
01:57:23.399 --> 01:57:27.119
these awesome graphics and things you see are all courtesy

1885
01:57:27.199 --> 01:57:30.520
of David, our miracle worker. So thank you so much, David,

1886
01:57:30.600 --> 01:57:31.479
and happy birthday.

1887
01:57:32.279 --> 01:57:32.880
Thank you, guys.

1888
01:57:34.720 --> 01:57:42.439
And I think see when did David join us? Uh? Yeah,

1889
01:57:42.479 --> 01:57:45.680
when did you come aboard? David? What's your anniversary date

1890
01:57:45.760 --> 01:57:46.439
with trek talking?

1891
01:57:47.239 --> 01:57:50.520
I keep thinking it was somewhere in the middle of COVID.

1892
01:57:50.880 --> 01:57:54.279
I keep thinking when it took place, So it much

1893
01:57:54.359 --> 01:57:57.119
have been like twenty twenty, was it?

1894
01:57:58.680 --> 01:58:02.960
Okay, that's cool, we'll take that all right, So happy

1895
01:58:03.039 --> 01:58:06.960
birthday to David. That wraps up our show, guys. Next

1896
01:58:07.000 --> 01:58:10.159
week we're going to be talking about what is Starfleet

1897
01:58:10.199 --> 01:58:13.960
the episode which is on right now, so walk, don't walk,

1898
01:58:14.039 --> 01:58:15.840
run to your TV and watch it so we can

1899
01:58:15.880 --> 01:58:18.319
talk about it next week. It's going to be a blast.

1900
01:58:19.279 --> 01:58:21.319
Hopefully it's a good episode. Hopefully it follows in the

1901
01:58:21.359 --> 01:58:24.840
footsteps of the one we just discussed. So I want

1902
01:58:24.880 --> 01:58:27.279
to say thank you so much to Paul for hanging

1903
01:58:27.319 --> 01:58:28.960
out and Trek talking with us tonight.

1904
01:58:29.039 --> 01:58:32.039
Thank you, Paul, It's been an interesting evening.

1905
01:58:32.319 --> 01:58:37.399
Thank you, And thank you so much to Charles as

1906
01:58:37.439 --> 01:58:40.000
well for hanging out and Trek talking with us. Thank you, Charles.

1907
01:58:40.880 --> 01:58:43.560
Thank you with the computer problems, it was a fun show.

1908
01:58:46.119 --> 01:58:48.000
And of course thank you to v for hanging out

1909
01:58:48.039 --> 01:58:50.720
and Trek talking with us as well. Thank you.

1910
01:58:50.840 --> 01:58:53.720
It's always a blast live want and prosper.

1911
01:58:55.239 --> 01:58:57.439
And thank you to Eric for hanging out with us.

1912
01:58:57.520 --> 01:58:58.119
Thank you, Eric.

1913
01:58:58.800 --> 01:59:02.439
Absolutely, we all make it interesting every single week and I.

1914
01:59:02.600 --> 01:59:07.520
Love that it's always fun. And our birthday boy himself, David,

1915
01:59:07.760 --> 01:59:10.800
thank you for having me out talking with us. David. Yeah,

1916
01:59:10.800 --> 01:59:13.319
it's been a lot of fun, and of course I'm

1917
01:59:13.359 --> 01:59:16.239
your most excellent host, Uncle Jim saying to everybody, please

1918
01:59:16.319 --> 01:59:19.119
stay safe and be good to each other. Star Trek

1919
01:59:19.239 --> 01:59:25.079
fans are the best fans. Tailing frequencies are closed. Good night, everybody,

1920
01:59:25.680 --> 01:59:31.800
good night, love more, I prosper all all stags.

1921
01:59:32.159 --> 01:59:33.439
I'm ready for departure, sir.

1922
01:59:37.079 --> 01:59:40.159
Some problem RCA just hoping this isn't the usual way

1923
01:59:40.199 --> 01:59:44.039
of missions will build said, Oh no, nomber what. I'm

1924
01:59:44.079 --> 01:59:45.800
sure most move be much more interesting.

1925
01:59:49.880 --> 02:00:03.359
Let's see what's up there. Th game, So

1926
02:00:05.800 --> 02:00:05.840
You