Episode 671- Starfleet Academy "Vox in Excelso" Discussion

0:21 Well, good evening. Trekky's and Trekors are on the globe. It's Thursday, February fifth, twenty twenty six. Welcome to episode six and seventy one of Trek Talking and Beyond. I'm your most excellent host, Uncle Jim. Welcome to the podcast. We have a really fun show planning for you guys tonight, as we always do, but before we get started, I want to go around and introduce my awesome truk experts. We're going to start off with Eric. Eric is out in Portland. How are you doing tonight? Eric? I am doing really well as you can see. I'm live from the debate room at Starfleet Academy, where you know, people are always talking about something. Important cool, and we also have with us to be doing all right.

1:10 I'm floating in the galaxy as I always am, just you know, brought the stars. Glad to be here. Mm Hmmland, How you doing to doing okay? Man? I've been reading the tea leaves for the direction of the Cosmos, and I think we're pointing in a good direction. So I'm liking what I'm seeing. It's been trending upward. So there you have it. So I'm feeling pretty good. That's a good friend to be in. We want to say welcome back to David. He's also. I'm doing pretty good, doing pretty good.

1:53 No molder cheese, No that. Everything back to normal. I hope God good. The last but not least, we have child Las Vegas. I'm going all right, kicked back on the Enterprise Bridge for now. But nobody's sitting in the Nobody sitting the command seats debating issues. No, I'm just I'm just hanging out in the cap wonderful culture right here. Three minutes in. That's three minutes in. Okay, before you mentioned it awesome in your record. Yeah, that's fantastic.

2:41 Oh yeah, So tonight we're going to be talking about last week's episode was started Academy, which was the episode four Box and Excelso we're going to be talking about that white Wow. That's the fact that I want to say. Last week, Abrielle was canceled the podcast, but we talks to reschedule it for a Monday or a Tuesday at eight thirty pm Eastern time. I will let you guys know as soon as we come to a date for that. But don't worry because Adam Nimoy is still scheduled to be with us on the twelfth, so that all hasn't been canceled as of yet, so that will be enough for sure. We also have a usual fans shout out, and that's where we think it's just like you, we're listening to our podcast around the world. We also have our fan reactions and episode score for this week's episode, which Eric is gonna be fine enough to deliver for us.

3:35 And what actor do you share a birthday with? Tonight? Find out on our side by Birthdays, and we're going to wrap up the show with what's going on around the Star Trek universe with an interesting segment called Shots About to Get Real and Starfleet Academy replaces Majel Barrett with who. So that's what's going on for tonight's show, guys, And without any further ado, I think we're gonna dive right in with our fan sholes and for them returned to Eric. All right, Jim. We always like to thank our fans far and wide across the innerwebs, which allows us to interact with people from every single continent out there, except we still haven't heard from Antarctica. Com on Slackers but we would love to start out by saying welcome this week to Austin Nichols, who's saying hello to us from Ukraine.

4:31 Ah Man, Austin, you guys are some of the toughest, most amazing people that I can think of on the planet right now. So thank you so much for understanding and rocking those Star Trek ideals. We appreciate you supporting our podcast and we certainly appreciate all the things that you guys are doing there. Austin Nichols, thank you so much for saying hello to us this week. I'd like to say hello this week to Phil Bones Kingston. Really Phil saying hello to us from the UK, proudly flying that Union Jack and Phil, you know what, even if Bones isn't your real middle name, I think that we claim the names that define us the best. And I already have a picture of who you are in my head just by you taking that Moniker. So Phil Kingston, Phil Bones Kingston from the UK, thanks so much for saying hello to us this week. We really appreciate your support.

5:24 Saying hello this week as well to Mark Adams, who hails from Scotland flying that beautiful blue and white flag Mark Adams. Always appreciate your support and sir, you have so many good things going over there. I cannot wait to visit your part of the world. Never been there, but it's in plans. It's in plans right now. Thanks Mark. Last, but not least, I am staying right in that same area of the world in the British Isles. Kevin William Hewitt hails from bear Regis in Dorset to England. Kevin William Hewitt, thank you for saying hello to us this weekend supporting our podcast V There's so much support in the UK. Do we have any people in the United States, Yes.

6:08 Of course we do. Start off with Jonathan James, who is saying hello to us from Baltimore, Maryland, not too far from me. Next, we have a hello from Elohimi Massy from Chicago, so thank you for that. Then Dina m Renti Cruz is saying hello to us from Cawi, Hawaii with several emojis. Looks like a surfer. I'm not quite sure what the second one is, but we've got some tropical island and a little beach umbrella there, so thank you for that. And last, but definitely not least, Shane Waldsmith is saying hello to us from Nashville, Tennessee, sixty eight years old. Have been a trecky since the beginning, so thank you for that, Shane. All right now I am sending this on to Charles.

7:13 Oh, thank you. V Let's start with the Warren. Welcome to Hoyt Aiden from Oregon. Wonder if our Oregon crew knows Hoyt. Welcome Doug Bates from East Texas. Welcome Mike Meehan from Wammee, Ohio. It gives us a United States flag fly in, and welcome Keith Jordan from Georgia. Welcome Keith and Mike, Doug and Hoyt Paul, who's on your international list? Thank you, Charles. Let's leave the old USA for a bit, sall we and head over to Hamilton, New Zealand, where our pal Peter Stringer is saying hello, sending us a how do he do from the Southern Hemisphere. Great to hear from you, Peter.

8:07 Over in the UK in Essex and Harlow. Our pal Janet Cooper is a fan of trek Talking and this amazing franchise where we find ourselves Just up the road from Janet, Eddie McDonough is in Ireland, a flag proudly flying there. A wonderful part of the universe there, Eddie, look forward to visiting there whenever I can. And then we have Damon Sharp, not Damon as in a FOREENGI Damon. Let's speak clear. This is Damon's first name. Okay, Damon Sharp is not going to like come over there and abscond with your latinum. Damon Sharp is a person of a great character, and it confesses that he's lived in Japan for the last twelve years. Does not say where he lived before, so it sounds like we need to keep that on the QT. Damon, your secret is say with us and finding for me. It is a very celestial first name. Estra Astra Dah is saying hello to us from Berlin, Germany. I love that name, Astra. It sounds like something from Forbidden Planet Astra. I think that's a very cool moniker you've got for yourself. There, prove me once again that enthusiasm for an enlightened future and this magical Star Trek.

9:23 Franchise is something we all share across the entire. Spherical globe where we reside. Isn't that true? Uncle Jim absolutely, Paul, Thank you so much. Well, we want saying thank you to Robbie by Daddy who's listening to us in New York, New York. Thank you, Ronnie. We also want to say thank you to Patricia Dasso, who says that she's from Continuum and sends us a Livelong, a prosper a smiley face, a cat, an alien, and two explanation points in red and that says just kidding Portland reading New Jersey at USA and then an alien head a whole bunch of emojis. That's what caught my attention.

10:07 That's up. Thank you so much to Patricia. We also want to say thank you to Michelle Cleo Muggleton, who says she's from Lime Lake's Machias, New York, an hour outside of Buffalo, New York. And the last, but not least on my list, which yeah, Keith Jordan from Georgia. I already already mentioned him. Sorry Key, I guess he's extra special because he got mentioned twice. What can I guys? That finishes up fan shows. If you'd like to be mentioned in please head over to our Talking and Beyond Facebook page. You will see the pin to Livelong and prosperos the page, tell me where you're from, leave lots of amojis, heart next your name Chili, Uncle Jim, and then you will be featured on a fan shout out. Guys, were ready to have some fun. Okay, let's dive right in.

11:03 So we usually start off with some cadet training from Charles, and that's what Child goes through and pulls out. It fits facts involved of the episode that we're about to discuss, and I will turn the microphone over to Child. Oh thank you, Jim. Good good episodes in this one right off the bat, and I think a favorite at least one trucky in here. Tng Drumhead season four, episode twenty one, when the doctor refers to judge Aaron Sati, this is the This is the point that where where Bercard actually references the judge. Also, so this goes all the way back to the TNG Era Voyagers Projections Season two, episode three. The doctor believes the ship is in a simulation and he is a real person in question the nature of its existence. So one of several times with the doctorate's question his actual existence Voyager another one I know, especially one person really enjoys Season two episode twenty three, two of Vix and definitely I think we can understand the debate on that one. Dis nine in the Hands

12:36 of the Prophets Season one, episode twenty good explanation for this science versus faith. Should we should we be. Teaching the Bajoran wormhole and teaching about the prophets to all of the kids on the on the ship, on the station, or should be focusing more on science and what needs what's required to be taught. Star Trek six Undiscovered Country slash Discovery season three. The structure of the Klingon moon practice released the shockwave that critically damages atmosphere of their homework Konos, given it only fifty years of life in necessitating peace and negotiation with the Federation much later in the thirty second century. The burn causes dilethium reactors on Kronos to explode, leading to widespread devastation.

13:36 As to why our Klingons do not have a homeworld. Of course, dng Rightful Air Season six, episode twenty three, he mentioned, we mentioned Kalus, So that's. The history, little bit of the history of KALs. And I was digging through all kinds of debate, a court cases, all kinds were they debate different things in star Trek, and I came with what people and what many of the hosts here know is one of my favorite debates, and I put this episode up against that one TNG measure. But Man, season two, episode nine, whether we decide if data isn't a sentient being or just property of Starfleet, definitely, I think pushers that's showing this is an interesting episode. I think Paul might have a recap of letting us know what's going on with this episode.

14:42 So I appreciate it. So before we get into our big discussion about this particular episode of Starfleet Academy, we always like to provide a little bit of a recap for folks who either watched it a week ago, have fuzzy recollections. They're just kind of put us on the same page. That's the purpose of this brief intro here. This particular episode is called vox in excelso that is Latin for a voice on high and it actually is a famous expression from the fourteenth century from Pope Clement that he used when he was officially dissolving the Knights Templar for their accusations of heresy and tortured confessions. I don't mention that for any timely reason whatso all, but just a little trivia for those who like to get a little education and want to know what the hell these Latin titles mean.

15:32 From Star Trek. So this is a spectacularly interesting episode. There is a lot to unpack here. The main plot, as Charles referenced here, is the existential threat that we are dealing with, the fallout after the burn. If we saw on Discovery right. Of the Klingon homeworld of Konos, it basically has been destroyed. The Klingons are essentially refugees now right, very timely thing. They are nomadic people, they're an endangered right, and we find out near the very beginning of this episode that a Klingon freighter carrying the last of the eight Great Houses, including the family of Cadet Jaden Cragg, has crashed and their survival is very much in doubt. So what a setup, right, So there's been an olive branch that's been extended from the Federation. Right, they've identified a potential new home world.

16:26 But the Klingons are very proud people and they review that as charity, right, and the surrendering of their honor, so they're not quite on. Board with that. There is a lot of really. Good stuff going on in this episode that we begin after a brief intro from the Chancellor right where she's marveling at a nebula, we immediately go to the doctor where he is talking about one of the most important things that you can ever learn to do in terms of communication is the great debate and the fact that he needs to help the cadet to understand the importance of rhetoric and being able to argue your points. And as somebody who has been involved in like public speaking for longer than I care to admit, and done huge amounts of debates and huge amounts of stuff with coastmasters, I'm here to tell you this episode gets it right and is very spot on. I love to see the fact that the importance of the debate and of public speaking is edified so well in this episode. However, if you're in that sphere, one of the things you always know is that fear of speaking in public is universally one of the top phobia's people ever have. Okay, it is listed above fear of shark. As far as things people are terrified of. And what's great is one of our cadets who you would be least likely to expect being afraid of something. Jaden Cragg the Klingon, has got an intense sense of fear of expressing himself in public.

17:57 What a great way to begin the melieu of this episode, right, making sure I'm still connected here? Can you hear me? I'm getting a weird spinning thing. Hopefully you can. Yeah, we can, yeah, Oca, but we can generally still have. Something going on there with the connectivity. I'm getting that weird spin I'll try to go quick. So anyhow, Jaden has got this glossophobia, this fear of public speaking. Right. He is a pacifist, right, and it led to a rift with his traditionalistic warrior family and his father, right except for his brother. And there's a lot of great flashbacks that we see of his coming to terms with his identity and the belief and support that he gets from his brother before he makes the decision to go off and pursue his destiny in the stars with Starfleet Academy.

18:43 Really really great Caleb Mehir is there as well, who just surprisingly to the doctor, really excels at debate, right, because it's a form of battle. He found that you had to educate your thing itself on things, and he eventually bonds with Jaden, overcling on history and there enjoyment of warrior stew. Jaden goes on a great arc in this episode. He finds his voice on the debate stage and argues that Klingons have to retain their own agency. It's not up for the. Federation to tell them who they are. I mean, if there is anything more resonant to contemporary situations in our civilization today, I can't imagine. But he later learns that his parents survived the crash and that his father actually intentionally allowed him to leave for Style Fleet in order to free him from those minds. There so some great stuff, some wonderful stuff from Laura Thock, the cadet master providing guidance out there, a good moment from Darren teaching him battle breathing to be able to overcome his anxiety, and just some excellent moments that it will be really fun to unpack and discuss. I thought this was an outstanding episode full of great trick. Laur It's exactly the kind of thing I would like to see this show doing.

19:54 So who wants to jump in first friends. Well, before we go through Pune, we have Eric is going to do our fan reactions and you guys can go to our Facebook paviors, I said, Truck Talking and beyond and every Friday, which will be tomorrow, I will put up a post asking you guys to score the episode on a scale on one to ten, with ten being the best, and you know, leave us an explanation as to why you liked it or I didn't like it, and again look for heart next to your name and then tuning into the podcast and you'll hear your comments read by Eric. So, Eric, what did our Facebook fans have to say about this episode?

20:38 Well, Laurie Johnson said, I loved this episode. Finally got to know Jaden. Loved his understanding that he could be cling on and Starfleet, very similar to the struggle warf went through in Next Generation. His realization he could keep his biological brother in his heart and keep Caleb close as a brother was wonderful and he taught Caleb lesson. I think definitely a ten with one, two, three, four, five, six exclamation points. Thanks Lori. John mang Mangan said, I cranked it up to an eleven and John, I will allow that, but we do have to average it to a ten. But we get you, We get you, brother, best episode of track I've seen in years. This was proper full on adult trek wrestling with thorny problems of identity, politics, entitlement, self doubt, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. That would have made Gene and Ts proud. Thanks John. Carla Saravia uher Nick said ten out of ten, highly recommended. It gives so much a tos vibe. I find a humorous, warm, and familiar I really love this show. So now I suppose I've opened myself up to the slings and arrows of the day sayers. Anything that's thrown at me will make a bit of difference though me either, Carla, thanks for that.

21:55 Fred Carpentershety gave it a nine. I rate episodes of all my shows on IMDb, and nine would be very special for me. This episode is where the concept and potential of this show was fully realized, and I hope they can maintain it. Aspects of the first few episodes for me were touching go, but here everything worked and delivered a classic addition to the trek canon Fred Carpenter, sheety, thank you so much. Ranal Baldwin said, the soul of a Klingon warrior is not limited to what he achieves on the battlefield, but is measured by the honor he brought to his house, the loyalty he showed to his brother and sisters in arms, the wisdom he passed to the next generation, and the courage he displayed in facing life's trials, both in combat and in peace. Who well Wow.

22:47 A true warrior's legacy lives in the memories of those who knew his strength of character, in the songs sung of his deeds, and in the example he sets for how one should live with integrity and die with dignity. His spirit journeys on to Stovecore, not merely because he fell in battle, but because he lived and died with honor in all things. Blah with a nine from Ronel Amira Hudson gave it a ten without a doubt. It was beautifully written and beautifully played. It's nice to see them flashing out backstory as they did, fleshing out backstory as they did. Since SFA is truly geared to the younger generation, it is nice to see them, reaching towards those who are different in so many ways and bringing them along for the ride. I loved it. Keith Riley definitely a ten boy. There's a real trend here, guys keeping the roots of Star Trek in the future years of the show. It is most definitely to bring in new young viewers, but even us they grew up with Toos through all Star Trek, can appreciate it. You just have to understand that it's a new generation and a show about a school. My favorite Star Trek is strange new worlds and I am so very hoping for a remake, not a reboot of TOS. Some stories deserve to live forever.

24:00 That will open the original movies for remake and keeping the same stories with the new actors will be a success. Thank you, Keith. True Star Trek fan there Susan Robbins gave it a ten for the series seven. Across all of the Trek series I've watched, self determination in the face of potential extinction is a tough topic. I think it was handled well. I also think this iteration of Trek is off to a good start. I look forward to seeing the cast, crew and writers grow together. Shannon bah absolutely and eleven. Same to you, Shannon, that's a ten, but thank you. This will go down as one of the best episodes of Trek, along with In the Pale Moonlight, Sitting on the Edge of Forever, the Inner Light, whoo Slinging.

24:43 Some big names there, Shannon, but I don't disagree with you. Alan Cross gave it a ten. Best Star Trek episode from any Star Trek series I've seen it in a very long time. Spencer Foulby Fublee Fuble a solid nine. The series has been good so far. I feel this episode sets a high bar for the rest of the season. Jordan Kim Karran said six, which is generous because the last ones were like a two, and Nick Van Aiken said eight. I wasn't expecting much greatness in this early in the season, but it seems they're finding they're footing quickly. Jim our fans score this week is ridiculous. It's a nine point two. It's a nine point two. That's like, I don't even know where that falls in the overall lexicon, but it's got to be right up there. Charles can probably calculate that really quickly, but it is. It is right up there. So that's what the fans thought, you should probably talk about it.

25:45 I guess well, we are definitely going to talk about it. But there was one thing I want to discuss. I want to get all of our collective reactors to one particular scene in this episod so and I want to get on my soapbox for just one minute before I play that scene and we talk about it, we get into our stores, and that is that. I think Starfleet Academy is perfect show for what we have going on right now, young people, you know, hope for the future, learning to deal with adversity and complexities and relationships. And for that, I wanted to play this clip where Where Where is it? Where is it? Where Darren teaches Jaden the breathing? So I want to play that for you guys, right.

26:46 Go away. Look, I'm just here to ask a favor. Whatever you've said to Caleb has got him stumping around our room. Now he's like super pissy with me. So I'm going to ask you hit me. What come on? You know you aren't. See you can pretend you're punching Caleb in the face. I do not want you want to punch Caleb in the face. Even Caleb wants to punch himself in the face. It's a it's a core tenant's personality. Jada, what are you. So scared of? Huh to show me what you got? Come on, hit me, show me, Come on.

27:27 I am not hitting you. It would be like squashing an infact. I felt good. And you know what they teach young fighters when fear takes hold mm hm, when. Battle breathing on your feet, trust me.

28:17 Chack who pet chat a bay whosh pe char by pay whosh peck child back pay whosh. Pet chat. Okay, p whosh pH p g p oose PECHERA whose peacher? I peck p oose pet char, I bet pose peacher, I bet. I bet bull picture a bet b betcher A big.

29:00 Get bit, big job, get bit. Us use it, Honorable Assembly. My opponent has argued that the Klingon Okay, that the Klingon Empire. Oh God.

29:43 So I wanted to play that quick because I think there's been a lot of miscommunication about that particular scene on the internet. I I wanted to get your take on it. I did not take that scene as a I didn't think there was any sexual attention in that scene in my opinion, to me, that was two warriors to two friends too, two men communicating, which I think is something that's missing from Star Trek. If it was two women to be one thing. But we very rarely do we see two men expressing that type of of relationship together, and I thought it was. It was beautifully done, and I didn't think that it was I didn't see anything there that would have that was sexual. I just saw two friends, a warrior helping another warrior overcome his his fear with a Kylonian. Is that the right word, Kylian?

30:47 So Jim, I had to reconnect and I missed your intro. Man, what was the thing about the scene that you had a point about? I missed it entirely what you said. A lot of people on the internet are saying that this is and they're going crazy over this scene where you have a gate pling on and I did not see it that way at all, and I wanted to play that scene for you guys to see if you agree with the way I saw it. The way I saw it was just two warriors, one warrior of helping another warrior, and I thought it was a great scene. Because Raymie has been the dick of the show, but I think in this particular scene, he's growing on me. He's come out of that dickiness, and you know, he's sincerely trying to help a friend deal with a situation.

31:35 And I thought the scene was beautifully active, beautifully portrayed, and I thought it was one of the many highlights of this particular episode. Was that scene right there, you know, two men having a platonic moment together is the way I saw it, and I thought it was it was just perfect for what we need today. So you know, what did you guys think about that scene? Am I seeing that's wrong? Or well, Jim, I don't. I don't think any of us are right right wing, like uh trolls who like, you know, are you know, living in our mom's basement. Well you know, I mean sometimes I mean I don't.

32:16 I mean, and we're not bots, we're not from a Russian troll farm. We don't like, we don't like uh jd Van. So this is none of us are going to agree with that. It's kind of silly. I mean, it's just because the only people who are going to object to the scene are people who are the same people are out there fat shaming people and the same people out there finding something to complain about. None of those are that's none of who us are. I mean, it's almost pointless to go around this crew, right, because we're all very much you know, I don't think any. Of us are uh. Yeah, intolerant ambles, right, because that's the person who's going to look at that and who's got is so and again, you know, folks around the globe, we're coming here from the United States. Okay, with this podcast, we are the most sexually present country on planet Earth. I mean we you know, we can have as much violence shit as you want on TV, right, violence all day long, But do you start talking about anything involving sex or intimacy, or anything involving like, you know, non buying, you know, non you know, heterosexual stuff, people losing they just cannot handle them.

33:19 Yeah, I don't know. I was, I was anyone agree with anyone disagree with you? No, I thought it was a beautiful scene. I was really quite frankly appalled when I saw the quite frankly, you know, like a bunch of uh eleven or twelve year old boys that are you know, snickering, Oh look at that, and to me. People who say that, first off, are you know, are what is it Danibian slime devils? But every man, every to me, every accusation is a confession with those folks. You know that's been proven over and over again. So you know what, just come on out.

34:04 Star Trek is a welcoming world. We won't shame you like you shame other people. So just get a grip and recognize because just because they've never had any sort of a you know, a true friendship with another man. That was That was beautiful and I of course cracked up at and he said, don't you want to punch Caleb in the face. Everybody wants to and he wants to. That was great. That was great. And then later on we'll see that both of them, Caleb and Raymie do something for really really nice for jade En. So yeah, anybody that that, you know, it's the same, the same pieces of tard poop that yeah, I don't know. I'm trying to think of, you know, trying to not use the vernacular like we've been having in this show, but try to come up with some inventive terms. But the people that were body shaming, uh, some of the female actors or the you know, the relationships.

35:10 And it's like they tell me that you don't know Star Trek when you cannot understand infinite diversity, infinite combinations. So I thought it was a beautiful scene. It was a beautiful scene. Yeah, I agree. I think that to me, that scene sums up Star Trek right there. We would never see a scene like that on any other starts. Well, we have it at this point later for putting that in there. Anybody want to have anything before Colonel David? No, okay, I mean, I guess the one thing I would like to add, Jim, is that you know, I agree with you all, like I didn't read the scene that way. I want to be careful that that we're not saying that if people read the scene that way, that they're wrong that you know, perhaps like if somebody in the future writes fan fiction about these two, I don't want to say that, like it's wrong, you know what I mean? Like I didn't I what's that's not even really important about this scene? Like what's important about this scene is that there are two friends, regardless of their like exact relationship to one another, one of them is recognizing seeing the other person, which is a theme in this entire episode, right and responding to their friend's needs in the moment, and there's nobody can possibly find

36:42 anything wrong with that, right, Oh. Yeah, that's true. Well I want to I want to start I want to go first with this episode. Obviously, what can I say? I love that, I'm going to start out. I'm going to give it an which is gonna round down. This is by far my favorite episode. Starfleet Academy just keeps amazing me as it just keeps getting better and better and better as they go along, and usually it takes some time to find their footing, but with this episode, they found it pretty quick and I was I was, I was like, yes, you know, I thought that was great. The friendships that we see forged in this episode are just are just phenomenally between, like the one we just saw between Remy and Jayden, and of course Beer and Jayden later become brothers. The flashbacks with Jaden's family on whatever that planet was with the Great Punt Jaden's brother urging him to follow his heart and go to Starfleet to become a healer. It was interesting that the Klingons now have a triad, which I thought was an interesting little twist on their on their family dynamic. The the I'm a little bit confused with the situation where their homeworld gets destroyed because all right,

38:14 I'm gonna be a little bit picky here. It doesn't take away from the episode at all. Loved it, loved it, loved it, loved it. But I wasn't on the impression that playing on Empire was like twenty four houses spread out across this vast like empire, so you know, for the delithium crystals to explode on cronles and destroy everything on in the universe except for these eight houses. I'm like, Okay, I don't know if I buy that, But that's not enough to sway me out of the awesomeness of this episode, of which was incredible. The scene where Laura Flock goes in mentors Jaden what an actress she is. She is incredible.

39:00 Ah yeah, I just uh yeah, I love this, Jaden. Or Jaden's picking the pepperoni out of the stew because he won't eat something that yeah, you know, I let Holly Hunter. I say this again. That woman is a totally force of acting. She is absolutely just top notch incredible. Well, she has the conversation with obi Obi. Check Obie, Obie something Obi want to check the klanion leader, not Obi Wan from obi Obi. I think it's war war Chok, that's it. And they're drinking the blood wine and the glasses all over the place and stuff like that. And there's definitely some sexual tension there between those two. You know that they got jiggy witted at some point time.

39:58 I really like the resolution and the Silver foxlevance for those of you don't know, shows up and they solve the Klingon problem in a Klingon. Loved it. I can't say anything bad about it. I loved it. I gave it an eleven, and I just hope that they continue on this path of greatness that they're currently on. So that's my score. I'm going with eleven. Which child's gonna roll after I. And the sure Well, first off, I appreciate the uh this is spinal tap reference with turning it up to eleven.

40:39 That's great. Yeah, this was a fantastic episode because it's all about you know, family and identity and expectation. So Jaden when he's I love that they flash back to his family and you know what, he's expected to be versus what he wanted to be. And oh no, I want to go back even to the very beginning with the doctor. I forgot to mention, Uh, did anybody miss the fact that he when he's talking to the students, he refers to them as zygots? That was that that cracked me up. So that was just a you know, funny little reference. And I read somewhere and I forgot to look it up exactly. But the the Sauti quote somehow got miss construed that he didn't say it the right way. Did anybody catch that? Was that correct? Or was that somebody you know, miss miss remembering the original quote?

41:49 Because they were. He was like, I saw that, but I didn't bother to go back and look, because I figures. You're going to have some some sort of missed, you know, lost in translation stuff right exactly. And when Picard quotes Settee in the drum Head, he actually like, there's a phrasing thing that Picard does that makes it sound like the I think. I think Picard doesn't do an exact Cete quote. And of course we never actually hear Sati say Satis quote right randomly here cards say it, so but just very just the.

42:38 Part with Jayden's brother and he has found that uh the that Federation technology which is forbidden, but it's that. What is it? It's the has atle I guess the advertisement for lack of a better term, talking about Starfleet Academy. And that's where his brother is encouraging him. So his brother is able to step out of the you know, Klingon warrior expectation and he recognizes what his brother needs, and of course that just makes it even more tragic when his brother dies as a result of getting uh stabbed because he was trying to get more Federation technology. So that was that was really rather heartrending. I like to know what Warrior stew is all about. That was that was interesting.

43:38 The only thing that I got from it is Jaden was eating it. It's it's very spicy, so uh well. And it looks like in the in the one scene they it looked like it had some white worms. Oh okay, okay, they. Sew okay, it's okay. So so he eats that, but he's picked about pepperoni. Go figure. That was fun. No, but but the Warrior Stu died in battle. Yeah, so that makes it. That's right, okay, okay. And I remember back in my gosh, I think it was junior high when I took debate, and I was very very very shy and seeing that scene where when Jaden is trying to speak and he's just like about ready to pass out. And I don't think anybody, I think a lot of people could relate to that because we've probably all been in one public speaking situation or another where he felt like he wanted to pass out or throw up or both, you know.

44:43 But you know, later on he's able to find his voice. And the whole solution to it's like, here's this perfect planet for them, but we can't give it to them because that's charity. And but we will have a battle and somehow, you know, everybody knows that this is just a mock battle, uh, but it's to to be able to have the Klingon say we claim, uh, this planet, you know, as our own. So that was just I thought that was an absolutely brilliant solution to finding them a new home. And I was I was also thinking about the d S nine episode called Sanctuary where the screens come through the wormhole and they have been displaced and their story sounds rather like, uh, you know, the Bajorans and they come to the realization that you know, bajor is our Katana and this was this is our planet and we want to you know, we want to occupy it. There's the Western Province or whatever that's just begging to be farmed. But you know, the the Bajoran the two people say, well, you know it used to be good, but that it was ruined and so we just can't have you. And so I just thought, how, you know, horribly that ended. They couldn't you know, they found another planet, but it wasn't you know, what these

46:14 screens wanted. And so. That had a very to me, a very sad ending to it. But so I like this this one much much better. And then at the very end, because his uh was it his say, I didn't quite understand. Does he have two fathers? Was that there were two fathers and one mother in Jaden's family? Is that what you were talking about? Okay, well, uncle, okay, I don't know whoever it was that, but they destroyed that that that orb that Jaden treasured because that was his only link to his brother. And then he has that, but he has the pieces of it and then at the end when uh so Caleb and Remi worked together and they fixed it for him, and I was just like, ah, that that just that was just so wonderful. And so I think that not only did Jayden get his treasured piece of technology back, but he also gained two brothers in remy In and Caleb. So I'll go with a trend.

47:26 It's absolute eleven. I'll turn it all the way up to eleven for that excellent, excellent episode. All right, excells, we have two eleven so far. Who wants to jump in there? Next? You want to go all. Okay? They pull out my notes. Uh, very beginning, you will move before these comment I love of the comments. Where the doctors uses the term chicken shit to the cadets, and.

48:09 One I like, the one with the glasses who looks like he's okay one of our nerds like, oh, can you really say that? And it's like, I've been around. Here for so long, for decades, I've got the right to what I can do, and if you don't like it, one day you might have that ability. I haven't quite figured out which. Which one did the doctor use in reference to his existence. I found out about four episodes and in Voyager where he works on condemned can trying to decide his true true existence, his version of measure of a man. But I thought interesting, also interesting. I did not realize this, but I looked up IMDb and IMDb reference fifteen different Star Trek episodes that had court cases. So court cases are not unusual in Star Trek. But of course, as I've mentioned before, one of my favorite court cases in Star Trek is measure of a man is data? Can we prove Data's existence? And that's what I thought when they saw this episode. It's like, that's what this episode

49:39 reminds me of, is that situation? Yeah, and I love how I love how Jdel goes against saving the Klingons, trying to say that they have their own existence. I thought this episode was interesting that it discusses how the Klingon society in ways have changed, but in ways have not changed. There's still a lot of similarities to what the Klingons have been for so many centuries. I know there was a comment reference that KALs was slightly mispronounced, but I lead that to the fact it's like, Okay, this is I was talking with David earlier it's like, okay, this is at least nine hundred years before main Trek.

50:32 I'm not exactly sure how far in the past KALs Kalis's stories first started or when he first existed. That was quite along. David kind of. Referenced, thinking it might have been even towards the our Roman era, and so hey were that far in the future there have been changes to. Their society. Well, and Charles, I'm not even sure that one stems from changes. I think that's just a matter of pronunciation. Like you go back to Discovery, they absolutely pronounced kless kaylash right, And I think it's no different from saying like beding versus peeking, or you know, it's it's a it's a mispronunciation, a common mispronunciation to say kyless in English, which I think is okay. But if you're pronouncing an in kling on just like versus chronomes right.

51:36 Oh definitely, it's all. But it was interesting what wants right, come on right? Oh easy? But I love how the fact that we had we started off with just a standard trial to seeing how things go. And I love how our one cadet proved himself. It's like and I love how he would later asked like, well, how did you know you just take this out of the air. It's like, no, I was stuck in prison. I studied this material. He knows Federation law, and I think that's interesting to prove the fact that he studied that much Federation law and understands it. I think that'll definitely put him towards an interesting direction in the future, and the fact that he knows this stuff.

52:39 But I love how we go through that. We went through the different explanations or the different people competing and trying to do opinions, and how we saw a little bit of each character and how they acted. And. I love Jdel came back and discuss the issue and it's like, well, there's only one way that this problem could be solved. And I love going to the Chancellor and it's like we don't see it, but he offers his opinion to her and she's like, Okay, we're not going to give this planet to them. We're going to make them fight to want this planet. And it's like, not much very often I've seen Trek actually do that.

53:40 Let's put up a battle and make them fight to take the planet, which is a plant. I think they would want to want to be on but they need to prove that they could earn the right to take that planet. And that battle, oh at the beginning or of the story of that battle, of the music that came in that was some beautiful battle music. And that would just caught my attention. That's a little bit of the. USS Riker was there, but I'm not sure if that was motion picture which one. But the music they chose in there to start it, which is great battle and we were new we were coming in for a fight, and it's like okay, yep, and we're not going to damage their ships.

54:39 Okay. It's I love it that it's at the end it's like, okay, well we didn't have any major damage, but lots of coincidence neither did we. It's like, okay, yeah, In fact, JD l doing something that I gathered most cadets don't get to do, and that's visit the bridge. Be getting up there and seeing the bridge and seeing the fight going on. I think it shows It's interesting. I think with Jim's comment about the breathing scene, I think I understand somebody's comment, but I'm gonna take a different direction. As much I think It's gonna be interesting to see the relationship, but see the relationship of more of a brother level between these two characters. I think they're gonna be cadets and maybe brothers. We may see some better interaction with these two where they work together.

55:41 And seeing these two different species working together, I should think should be interesting. And how do I go with this episode? I'm not taking all the way to eleven, but I will give it a ten. I will agree with that ten ones that and worthy. That's very impressive. How about you, Eric, what do you think? Wow? Yeah, So for me, this episode strikes pretty much a perfect balance between like high level federation diplomacy stuff and the personal character growth of Jaden and I love star Trek that does both of those things. This is very drumheady, of course, I mean the natural like reference to set erin Setia, of course, but like just in the way it sort of plays out, it kind of feels like that too, the so so big level themes. So to me, there were moments, guys in this episode where I shed tears and I think it was this like idea that so many of the themes that were explored in this episode had to do with seeing somebody and being willing to come to their table versus the idea of having a table that you make other people come to. And

57:12 to me, the coolest part about that is that this is actually almost like a split between old school federation ideals and kind of like twenty first twenty first slash thirty second century federation ideals. So back in the day, we had the Federation, and the Federation was the stable force in the galaxy, right, and if you wanted to not be in a shit storm of craziness, you needed to join the Federation because it was literally the only stable place that you could go. And that was a very like nineteen sixties way to kind of look at society, right, like, we have this stable society, democracy, you know, free elections, et cetera, et cetera. All of those themes kind of like provided real life evidence for this thing that was being explored in Star Trek Okay. So similarly, now we gener we we don't move forward now to our real twenty first century, and we say, what do we need you know, in this in this kind of time. And I think it's that it's this idea that you know, many different voices can come together I love the fact that this show has like multiple multi racial characters and multiple types of characters. I mean, we've got like a holographic character, and this kind of like idea of like diversity and stuff. But moreover, this idea that like connecting

58:45 to somebody on an intimate personal level, like this scene that we looked at here between these two guys, right, is okay. I think that we've been taught, especially I will tell you as dudes in the United States, that it's kind of taboo to like grab another man by the hands and look him in the eye and help him through an emotional situation. It's just not it's I. Think it's I think it's remiss to say that it's not actively discouraged, because I think it is so so anyway, I love the fact that they're embracing that in this in this episode. So yeah, four big themes. I see, you've got the Jaden backstory. I loved all the stuff with his family, kind of his connection with his brother house brother sees him. My favorite part of the Jaden backstory is the fact that he kind of grows up thinking that his dad, one of his dads especially, didn't support him, and then though, is able to completely reframe that for him and like blow his mind and where like that to me was like one of the most special moments of this episode. You've got the settee debates, which of course the doctor knew is going to be a loaded thing, right, and these two guys like eventually kind of yelling at each other, but out of it comes this brilliant idea of speaking like the Klingons, which for me was very Michael Burnham Battle of the Binary Stars, right,

1:00:19 Like she says at the beginning of Discovery, you got to attack the Klingons and if you don't, you're gonna regret it. And sure enough, that's what happens. And here Jaden, a Klingon, is like, dude, you got to do the Klingon thing. If you don't do the Klingon thing, you're going to fail. And they do the Klingon thing and it works, right, so freaking brilliant. I love that you get hit Jaden's like, uh, well, other characters, not just Jaden's but other characters developments, Jim, you already mentioned Mirr and ray MEI and kind of like how they're interacting with one another. So I love that Foch as the Cadet Master, just like I look at her and I see jim Head right because of her spikes and her like skin tone and stuff. But then like fifty percent of her is Klingon. And so I loved the fact that there was this person who didn't look like a Klingon, who identifies as Klingon helping the Klingon through the thing. Right, that felt very twenty first century to me. With so many like folks who are mixed race or come from different countries or whatever in the world, you know, eventually we're all going to be like the same shade, right, So I just I just totally dug that. And then finally I'll just say, the whole idea of finding out more about the Klingons. Remember when we first jettisoned or jettison jetted forward to the thirty second century and we said, where are the Klingons? I wish Discovery had Klingons in

1:01:49 the thirty second center. Well, now we know right there weren't any. And so that was a really cool kind of play on the whole Star Trek six practice thing. You know, it felt very familiar to kind of have the Klingons having this major crisis where they're in diaspora and that somebody understood that they had to unite under battle. So anyway, sorry I chatted so much about this one, but this was pretty much a perfect episode for me. You've got all of these amazing themes occurring that just you know, being seen, being heard, overcoming your and understanding your family's expectations, all of this stuff about the federation, the face of Federation changing, so just just absolutely perfect.

1:02:38 Ten out of ten. It absolutely blew my mind and I will watch this episode over and over again as the years go by. I only watched it full of times so far. I haven't had time, Jim, But I will get there. I will get there. So good you want to jump in here next to Hawk and bring up the kaboos? Sure? Yeah, can you guys? Okay, yeah, all right, yeah. So a couple of things I wanted to point out was we got a little bit of backstory of the dominion cleanon woman Talk I think her name is. She was saying that her lineage is from the Dominion on her father's side and the Cleanon on her mother's side, which kind of makes sense. And did you guys notice how she said the free Freedom Dominions or something like that, the Free Fighters or whatever. So it seems like there was a group of Domini or yeah, yeah, they just like broke off from the original clones. So somehow I guess they manipulated the genetics to have kids.

1:03:51 So I guess, becha, I thought, David, that went back to that DS nine episode VS watch more recently, but the one where the group there's a group of Dominion like yeah, warriors who break off and like break their addiction of the white. So I kind of like, that's what I. Was thinking of too, because I don't know if you guys noticed, but apparently her blood is white, so it makes me wonder if she actually has stilled that uh white drug that's just like. A white blood. Actually yeah, okay, I didn't know. She doesn't have the pink blood of her klingon side, She's got the white blood of her Yeah.

1:04:33 I got to carried off on from her father. But yeah, I'm glad that we got a little bit about what why she is how she is, So that actually kind of made me a little happy. I wish I would have gone a little deeper into it, but I got just what I'm hoping there's a little bit more about it in the future episode. But there was another thing I wanted to get off my back was when Jim was talking about that whole scene with Jayden and Raymond. At first, yes, I was like, Okay, this is kind of getting a little weird in like what Eric was saying, it is a little taboo. Was she fine? I mean we all grew up that way in America, So I mean it's just the idea that we're just starting to get into that form of like I mean, I get touched by people all the time because I was recently in the hospital, so doctors, male females, doesn't really matter.

1:05:30 I mean, you know, the best fun part was you're getting a fun pass that felt so good. But just. But other than that, oh my gosh. But yeah, to me, I grew up in that kind of taboo thing and I'm slowly getting myself out of that in a way. But at the same time, I wanted to make it clear that what Paul was mentioning that we're all this group of the like the left side, you know, well left wing. I'm not really technically left wing. I'm more independent, Just so everybody would know, because you know, I'm not either or so, but to me, this entire episode, for some odd reason, just did not resonate with me as much. However, I want to say this last episode, the one I missed because I'm hospital today. Ah, that one bug the jeebers out of me. I could not watch that for some reason. I'm guessing it would because of the high school drama. Possibly that would probably be the biggest thing I would have to say about it. But ticking to this episode, this episode was a lot better. I want to say that was a lot better from the last.

1:06:46 So to me, this episode in particular, I did like the fact that they started to develop the Kleanon culture in the thirty second century. I was under the impression that the Cleanon, and I agree with you, Jim, the whole idea that the Cleanon, for some odd reason shouldn't have been extinct because there was such a vast I mean, they own like who knows how many planets. They were almost a rival to the Federation at one point many times throughout history, and you know scar Tuk history that they were constantly fighting each other. And so to me, I'm just like, well, but but hold on. So so this is what I was talking about this is I didn't do a good enough job of describing this the practice connection. So remember in Star Trek six, the reason that practice blows up is that the Klingons use more risky power generation technology than anybody else uh in the universe does, right, And that's and something goes wrong, and that's what blows the moon up.

1:07:47 So to me, the fact that Kronos's main way of generating power would have you know, uh antimatter core or whatever, blew up during the burn, and that you would then replicate that technology on every other Klingon world that you start, right, you would like carry your portable antimatter generator there on your starship when you land, and that would be the way that you would generate power. So to me, it wasn't just that Chronos blew up. It was that all of the Kleon colonies blew up because that was the technology that they were using for their power to. Actually probably and so why switch to a different technology if one works so well? Kind of thing. And then once you blew up, I can understand that a bunch of plants probably would have blown but I don't know there might be because they only mentioned eight Housrid, right, So to me, I'm just like maybe the other houses out there that they just have not discovered yet again because of the bone and well, we.

1:08:44 Know in Discovery that there were thirty two houses, right, so we started at thirty two and we was it at thirty two or was it twenty four? Gym, I can't remember twenty four? Sorry? Sorry, twenty four houses? We so it sounds like two thirds of the houses have died out. In the life or just out there being nomadic like the rest of them. Possibly, I mean a lot can happen, so to me, yeah, this particular episode, I I don't know, there's just something I can't quite put my finger on it yet. I mean, if I keep watching it, maybe I'll discover it. But it was a little tough for me to get through because I'm just like, I just can't get over this high school drama. It's just something about me I just can't stand. So to me, I'm definitely gonna probably give this episode a little bit better score than that were originally gonna give it. So it's because you guys are hyping me off about it. But yeah, I like the thought thing that clean on Battle I did not really enjoy so much, because to me, I felt like that was a little a little strange how they handled that. It just to me, it kind of went by a little too fast. But other than that, I'm have to give this one a seven.

1:10:04 So yeah, all right, So Paul, you started us off with that excellent synopsis. You heard everybody else's scores an opinion, so wrap up for us. Okay, let's not beat a dead horse, right, because we've kind of been over a lot of the same ground and peppered with the equal dextures of minutia here and there. So real quickly though, this whole thing with the Jaden intimacy scene that everyone's hung up on, I just got to point out, guys, I don't know that folks are aware of a culture from New Zealand called the Maori at all. It's a warrior culture, but that is a lot of what's going on with these two. I mean that is very clearly, uh you know, evoking in Maori what's called the hakka, right, this kind of battle breathing thing.

1:10:51 It is a focused ritual of like energy to help prepare yourself and energize yourself as a warrior. Right, So if you are really freaked out by this, and you think this is kind of a homoerotic thing going on. Maybe check yourself and look into, like, you know, the Hakka and Maori and New Zealand culture of the indigenous people who live there and not be so uptight would be what I would recommend. So enough of that, though, I really think that this was a phenomenal showcase for the actor Karen Dane, who plays Jaden Crag Jaden, Let's let's get that right from here on, and he's a major character. It's Jaden, Okay, I think we should all really work on that. He did a phenomenal job as an actor in this work.

1:11:40 Right. There's a scene where he goes into an ala Ake's office, right, and she's telling him everything that happened, right, you know, about the potential loss of his family, right, and she's like, hey, this is gonna be really hard for you, right, you know you you know, we understand if you want to take some time off, right, And there is a moment where he delivers a line. At first you think he's telling her off right, She's like, you can leave if you want to, and he goes I said goodbye, And you think that he's telling her off, but then he continues the line He's like, I said goodbye to my family a long time ago, right, And you think he's throwing that at her kind of you a hostile way, but he's actually talking about his family. But it's just the way he played both sides of that emotionally was just absolutely amazing. He did a phenomenal job for this entire episode. I love that it was all about giving his identity a chance to come full circle and accept who he is and accept his place in Klingon culture and speak and using his confidence that he's able to find through debate and public speaking to actually be a voice for the part of his Klingon culture. He doesn't feel anyone hears right that it's just not about you know, it's not for the Federation's place to decide for us, right, and the Federation through Nala ake right as Chancellor, we see them do this very similar thing that they did when they were trying to get the Beta Z coalition together, right,

1:13:14 meet them on their terms. Like Eric was saying, right, it's just like dot don't insist that they do your way of doing things, acknowledge and do things their way. It's a form of respect, which I don't think we are seeing a lot of anymore these days. So I thought that was just sensational writing. Eric pointed that out, and I think it's a really important point to talk about because there's so much respect and it's you're not hitting people over the head with the writing here either. It's done in a very deft and a seamless way. Points for the folks and the production team. When the show began, the CBS Studios production logo was in part kling On graphic font. I don't know if anyone noticed that, but that was really somewhat delightful. I thought that Uncle Jim caught that right.

1:14:01 That was great. And again, Jaden's pacifist, a pacifist plan. It's phenomenal, right. I think it's really interesting to try something like that, right, I mean, he's got his own character, right, I'm one of anything that didn't die in fair fight. I think that's phenomenal. At one point, when his father says but aware of Romulins, but aware of Klingon's bearing gifts, kind of you know, evokes that whole McCoy line aware of Romulin's bearing. Gifts and Star trek too. So I just thought it was delightful, just super strong writing for me about something that matters, and when this show, I think, is willing to look at current conditions that we are seeing in the world now diaspora, when someone's i mean, when someone's homeland has been destroyed, their people are in need of an identity and trying to find their way, you know, dependent on the ability to communicate, the ability to make alliance, the ability to you know, be focused. Right, I just thought it splendid, did a great job, and just every single person in the cast.

1:15:08 I deleted an outstanding job. So the nitpick about an episode with this much half to it, I think would just be folly, I think, And this is just outstanding work from everybody. And I will point this out to anybody who's like, if you want to naysay and diss the show and think it's a kiddy show and we're uptight because you know it's a younger cast or whatever, you go for it. Right, They've proven themselves several times in a row here right now with this show, I think they're head in the right direction. Super excited to wrap up this podcast and see what they have in store. For us tonight with this new week's episode. So I have no hesitation. I think this one ranks among some of the greats, right, great episodes of next Gen original series. And I think a lot of people in our culture could really benefit from watching this and learn about the MAJORI okay, because that's really what's going on in that scene.

1:16:02 Out low. Yeah, people, it sells whoever you are, just stop learn so gratifying ten For me. I thought it was just splendid, wonderful work, and please keep making these kind of episodes. I think it's a lot. To offer and a huge amount of heart. Everyone who's ever felt like they didn't belong in their culture or their family can relate to Jade and Cragg in this episode. So I just very moved and appreciative of the work. All right, Childso hol with trucks fust Compared to our Facebook fans this week. Okay, well, the fans gave it a nine point two.

1:16:46 Now I actually record two different scores. I probably know which one is going to get posted. Our actual score was a nine point eight, but if we bring the elevens down, it comes to a nine point five. Nine point five. They have it respectable. Respect yes, very What was the fans score again, Charles ninth. Nine point two. Okay, so we're just a little bit above the fans. That's great, that's excellent. I mean that resonates. I think that's so. That seems to say that people felt felt something from this episode.

1:17:29 It spoke to people. Yeah, it's it was really good for sure. All right, guys, Well our evaluation, our discussion, our conversation on Starfleet Academy. And you know what time it is now it's time for star Trek birthdays, which. Means this.

1:18:09 That was done Klon's song. No, and you guys noticed that excellent video that David put together for us from his hospital. Anyway, this is a part of the show where we uh do our star Stark, but we always start out I sadly not remembering those members who are no longer let us for that returned here. Jim today, remember eight people who have gone before us in the sci fi realm. The first is actor David Optashu born David Opatowski. He was the actor who played on On seven in the TuS first season episode A Taste of Armageddon. He was originally considered by Gene Roddenberry for the role of doctor Phil Boyce in The Cage, but of course that didn't happen. He was also cast for an unspecified role in the Next Generation, but fell ill and that part was recast. So unfortunately we only got one instance of David, but it was a good one.

1:19:13 This man had a career that spanned over five decades, almost one hundred television guest appearances in forty five movies and television roles, and he put his knowledge of Yiddish to good use, often playing Jewish and Arabic characters. So thank you so much, David Optashu for your contributions. We lost him back in nineteen ninety six. Happy birthday to David. Happy birthday to James Franciscus. Not a Star Trek alumni, but he was, of course the American actor from Clayton, Missouri who played the role of Brent and Beneath the Planet of the Apes. Producers partially chose Franciscos because they believed he physically resembled his predecessor, Charlton Heston. And I think you can I think you can see that in a lot of these images is that we've got on the screen here. So James Franciscus, thank you so much for your science fiction contributions. We appreciate it. Lost back in nineteen ninety one, Happy birthday as well to bb Besh, best known to Star Trek fans for playing the role of doctor Carol Marcus in Star Trek two, The Wrath of Khan. Also, I believe Star Trek three, didn't she in that movie too. Born in Vienna, which was then annexed to Nazi Germany, as Bibiana Maria Clcert, she immigrated with her family to the United States after World War Two.

1:20:34 Big soap opera fan back in the sixties and seventies, but then after Star Trek two, she re teamed up with our good friend Nicholas Meyer. That's right front of the show on the acclaimed Jarring made for TV film that still gives me nightmares to this day. A day after she received one Emmy nomination as an Outstanding Supporting Actress for the TV special doing time on Maple Drive as well, she was also on Northern Exposure. Pretty good show. Bib Besh, thank you so much for your contributions to Star Trek and beyond Lost way too young at the age of fifty four years old, back in nineteen ninety six. Happy birthday to Paul Wallace Carr, the American actor who portrayed Lieutenant Lee Kelso in the TOS for season episode Where No Man Has Gone Before. Broke in acting back in nineteen fifty five and made well over a hundred television guest appearances, eight regular series roles, about thirty film roles, and a number of plays. But something that he's actually kind of better known for are his voice credits.

1:21:39 Yeah. They include roles like Matsuoka in the Japanese anime film Ghosts in the Shell standalone Complex and Screaming Mad George, the special effects wizard for science fiction horror films such as Bride of Re Animator Yes, starring Jeffrey Comes just as Back in the Day, as well as the voice of school Ad in the Japanese anime film Blood the Last Vampire. Thanks Paul for your contributions to Star Trek and anime. Happy birthday, Happy birthday as well to Farah Fawcett, a name that I think almost everybody who grew up during the nineteen seventies and eighties knows. She, of course, was the American actress and artist who played Holly thirteen in the nineteen seventy six film Logan's Run Wouldn't Know Still Haven't Seen It? Alex in Saturn three is best known as Jill Monroe in the first season of Charlie's Angels. Yes, okay, I remember her from Charlie's Angels for sure. Watch that show every single week. I thought it was great. The hair, the eyes. Are you kidding me? Farah Fawcett, a real icon of that era. Happy birthday to her. Happy birthday to John Donald Fieldler, the shrill voiced, bald, hated actor who played mister Hengist Hingist in the cost second seasonisode Wolf in the Fold. I remember his face, but not how they pronounced his name. He left behind, of course, an extraordinary career spanning fifty five years with nearly two

1:23:09 hundred film and television credits. Best remembered in his later years as mister Peter Peterson on the CBS comedy series The Bob Newhart Show. He gave his voice to the beloved character of Piglet in myriad Disney animated Winnie the Pooh Adventures. And despite these roles, and despite having appeared opposite lots and lots of really really famous people. He said that in a nineteen eighty five interview today on NBC's Today's Show, he said, one of my favorite parts was an episode of Star Trek where I played Jack the Ripper. So so many things this guy accomplished, but he loved his Star Trek appearance. Happy birthday to John Fieldler, Happy birthday to Sam Gilman. The actor who played Doc Holliday in the TOI third season episode Specter of the Gun.

1:24:02 Appeared in several films opposite Marlon Brando. Actually appeared in some stuff with defores Kelly two Along the Way, but was in the Wild One from nineteen fifty three, a really really great film, and that same year appeared in the biblical epic The Robes, starring guess who Gene Simmons. Not that one, Jim. We're gonna talk about her in a minute. Gilan made guest appearances on television series like The Untouchables, Gun Smoke, The Lifetimes of White Ear, etc. So Sam Gilman, you can tell that mustache is totally kicking. He's a Western guy through him through. Happy Birthday to Sam. Last, but not least, I would like to offer my sincere birthday wishes, and I wish I could have met hers to Jean Merlin Maryland. Excuse me, Gene Maryland. She spells it kind of funny. Simmons the British actress who played the retired Rear Admiral Norris at t in the next year four season episode The Drumhead. Over the course of her career, she received two Academy Award nominations, two Emmy Award nominations, winning one of those, two Golden Globes, five Golden Globe nominations, and two BAFTA Awards. So talented, So so talented. The nineteen eighties, she appeared primarily in television programs, winning an Emmy Award and Golden Globe for her portrayal of Fiona phi Cleary and ABC's acclaimed mini series The thorn Birds, which weirdly was like way above how old

1:25:37 I was when it came out. But I remember when that came out and it was kind of racing, right, I remember that. Yes, Richard Hamberlain, Yes, Richard Chamberlain. Yes, yes. Simmons was also in North and the South from that era, which I know y'all remember, Like that was just this huge epic. She was all so in the reimagining of the Gothic soap opera Dark Shadows from nineteen ninety one. So there are so many reasons to love what Gene Simmons has done in the acting world. I'll just say, happy birthday. I wish I could have met you, gal, I'm sure you were a super cool lady. Happy birthday to Jean Marilyn Simmons. And sorry that took a long time, but it was worth it. Happy birthday. I'm going to pass this flaming birthday candle over to be.

1:26:27 I wanted to add with Farah Fawcett. Does anybody remember when she was rather sort of briefly married to Lee Majors and she was known as Farah Fawson Majors. So and of course, yeah, yeah, so the six Million Dollar Man, which led also to one of my favorite shows, The Bionic Woman, So that whole thing. So that's kind of sci fi related. So I am going to wish a very happy birthday to Daphne Ashbrook. And I just watched this episode. I watched it fairly regularly since DS nine is pretty much on you know, I have it on Pluto TV app and it just runs constantly. But she played Melaura Paslar in the DS nine second season episode Melaura, where she was Robert Bristly to Doctor Basher at first, but she had lived in a she was somebody from a a low gravity world and so that was kind of interesting. Now she is recognized apparently as the eighth Doctor's companion, doctor Grace Allaway. So happy birthday to Daphne. Next, Happy birthday to Paul Sheer, American actor, comedian, writer, producer, director, and podcaster who portrayed Andy Billips on Lower Decks, one

1:28:00 of our favorite characters. He's such a goober on that, so he did that very well. He's married to actress June Raphael, who voiced his character's mother, Paulana in the second season episode Where Pleasant Fountains Lie. So happy birthday to you, Paul. Next, Happy birthday to Richard Lineback, he played Romas in the TNG for season episode Symbiosis. Selen appears in DS nine first season episode Dax and Kessick in enterprise third season episode The Zindi. Next, here's a special happy birthday to Brent J. Speiner, who pretty much constantly hits on me on Facebook, always say hey, send me a private message. I want to talk to you for whatever reason anyway. But of course, he was known for playing the android starfleet officer Lieutenant Commander Data on TNG in four Star Trek films, several episodes of Picard, and offscreen in these are the Voyages. He also played Data's brother law and father, doctor Nounian Sung in various episodes of TNG. In two thousand and two, he played be four in Star Trek Nemesis. He appeared as Eric

1:29:33 Sung in a three episode arc on Enterprise, as Alton Sung and Adam Sung on Picard and an alternate version of Data on Lower Decks. He's also known for playing doctor o'coun in Independence Day and the sequel Resurgence, and some of us may remember him early on when he was on Night Court. Also starred what's his name now? I just went out of my head John lear Riquette, who was the klingon in h Breath of con Or was it? No? It was? Sorry? Search for stock anyway, So there's that connection. So happy birthday to him, and just leave me. Stop bugging me on Facebook. Okay, I'm just not interested, dude. Of course, I I mean, I mean, of course, I know it's always scammers. But it's just out of all the ones, it's just always Prince Spiner. If I ever have to, if I ever get to meet him, I have to tell him that because probably get a kick out of that.

1:30:43 Okay, it's so great. You wouldn't believe how many times you've hit him. Yeah right, I mean, out of all the famous people, he's the one. Yeah. Anyway, So anyway, the last, but not least, Happy birthday to Caitlin Hopkins, who played Kalana India's nine fifth season episode The Ship. She also appeared in Voyager sixth sixth season episode Live Fast in and This Sorry, Live Fast and Prosper as Dala or she. She? What is it? She was a fake Jane Way that's right anyway, So happy birthday, all right now I send the flaming birthday candle of uh whatever to Paul I.

1:31:33 Sorry. I just hope that at some point we're able to get Ve to shed her inhibitions and come out of her shell and start expressing herself. Now, just think about it for future on social media as well. You're very restrained. I don't know anyhow, Let's get this. The social media is the best. If you're not on her page you need to get on it. If you don't, if you feel that there's not enough profanity in your life, maybe follow the socials.

1:32:14 That would be what I would recommend. You'll learn a few of that inside. Hey, I use I'm trying to use asterisks. I'm not always writing the words I try. It depends on its. Okay my mood. You're not fooling anybody. I have a lot of. There's a lot of press pressed rage. Yeah, I think you have a lot of express Let's continue on. Let's give a birthday reading to a member of our Starfleet Academy friend. Okay. Rebecca Quinn is actress, are you ready? Professional wrestler who plays Lieutenant mc yeah in the Star Trek Starfleet Academy first season episodes with Kids These Days and Vox and Excelso which.

1:33:07 We were just chatting about. Also known by her in the ring name Becky Lynch. That'll strike terror into the hearts of her opponent's, won't it. But anyhow, Rebecca Quinn ak Becky Lynch is a new member of Star Trek. Let's hope we see a lot more of her as a recurring character on the Bridge. Happy birthday to Villene Caine, Irish actors who played Lyra Riso, not Jin Erso, but Lyra Riso in Roguana Star Wars story On television, she gained prominence through her role as Rose Stagg in the BBC two series The Fall. So Hello and welcome Bileen. Very cool first name, very happy birthday indeed, and please don't hurt me. Beg you don't hurt me. Legendary Jonathan Banks okay, who we acknowledge on Star Trek for playing a Golden Shell in Deep Space nine's first season episode battle Lines, but of course gained international renown and eternal prominence as Hitman and fix Their Mike Ermantrout on the television series Breaking Bad and his subsequent work on Better Call Saw. What a scary mobo you can be when you want to be Jonathan Banks, I have seen if you really want to go on a rabbit hunt. I'm not going to go into a great detail. Go look at some of Jonathan Banks's early commercial television work when he was doing the TV commercials on YouTube. There are some just riotous ones out there

1:34:39 when you know it is it's just just go Jonathan Banks TV commercials and you will thank me later. But Primetime Any winner for Outstanding Supporting Actor in a Drama Series. Been nominated more times than I can ever guess, but he just brought the freaking grit to breaking bad. What a great actor this guy is. I love seeing him seeing work. He's just a real legend. Happy birthday to Stephen mccattye, a Canadian actor who played a Vreenak in Deep Space nine six season episode in the Pale Moonlight and the alien Foreman in an Enterprise third season episode, The Cindy. His will be regarded as Internet fame for delivery of Freena's line on Deep Space nine that forever made him a meme. Lord, he has become like an enduring Star Trek. Mean, you can just get no way about him. I think he probably never had to buy a drink for the rest of your life, is my guest, Steven.

1:35:37 People will always be buying a drink wherever you go. So a legend, to be sure. God, I love this person. This next person is amazing. The luminous, wonderful, expressive and favorite Jeanette Goldstein Okay, who we acknowledge for playing the scientist officer board the Enterprise b in Star Trek generations. But of course she really came out of the shoot with Jim Cameron in his films, right, I mean Near Dark. She was in Near Dark. She just exploded when she played Private Basquez and Aliens. Right, has there anyone ever been psyching you for a man? No? Have you? I mean she was just the best man. Just get to ask in every kind of name there and then she was of course a stepmom Janelle and Terminator too, you know, with the whole thing and the milk carton.

1:36:29 I mean, she's just the best, right. She is just a phenomenal performer and people love her at conventions. I have yet to meet her in person, but she's a wonderful, engaging person and what a career. So freaking cool. So happy birthday, Jeanette Goldstein. And Legend coming up next to folks Legend, the science fiction Legend. I watched this guy all the time on TV as a kid. Bill Moomey aka Billy Moomeey if you will, actor from California, who of course on star trek Ellen in Deep Space nine seven season episode ce j A R. Five eight, and Lanier in all five seasons of Bottle On five, which is a great series that a lot of people don't watch and don't know about and should ideally be restored.

1:37:14 But of course he is a sci fi guy. He just does everything. He's a producer, director, actor, podcaster, doing everything. But he is the iconic inhabitant of Will Robinson from the sixties classic TV show Lost in Space. How many scenes did this guy have to endure with Doctor Smith? I will never be able to count. I don't. I can't count that. I it's just crazy. But so many Doctor Smith's scenes just endless, just oh Will, the pay and the pain, it is just what a great guy do'll mom Me is uh and just a legend, a fixture of the science fiction community and frequent fan attendee.

1:37:56 So Will Robinson, we salute you, sir, and Uh. I think there's still some people getting older by the minute that they're just waiting in line to be acknowledged. So I better pass this over Uncle Jim. Well, thank you so much, Paul. I have a couple of Klingons and rather ship could be playing on it, so I want to start off by saying I'm happy their day. Christine Rose, the actress who played Draw on the TNG six season episode birth Right Part One, and birth Right Part two. He was born in Lynnwood, California, and graduated from Stanford University. Christine and I also want to stay.

1:38:36 Happy Birthday to John Ship. He played the Klingon ambassador that starts for the Voyage Home and starts with six the Undiscovered Country. They also played part in the DS nine second season episode The My Key Part two and Doctor Antack and Enterprise four season episode Affliction and Divergence. He's the guy that came up with the plastic surgery to get the clean on their ridges back after they all melted away. Happy Birthday to John shut that I believe. I believe that was he? Not on the night court? Was he the bailiff night that was? That was Richard Richard Bull was on? Was it was the Bayless?

1:39:20 Different guy? I don't think different? Uh yeah? The guy who played uh Richard or who played Bull was named Richard Richard Mall. That's right. Post Yeah. And last, not least on my list, we have Warwick Davis, O b E. English actor and television presented. He played the title character in Willow the Time film series, the characters in the Star Wars film, most notably in the Professor Phileas Wick in the Goblin get the in the Harry Potter film series, and they also played Willow in the short lived Willow TV series which was only the time episodes but was pretty damn good. I do enjoy it myself, and that my friends up our Star Trek birthday.

1:40:13 And now it's time for some Star Trek news. We do not have a flashy video for Star Trek news. We got to come up with one that any right, Okay. Well, I love the title of this article. Shat's about to get real in new Star Trek adjacent Super Bowl ad. Oh boy, the internet is popping off with a bunch of twenty twenty six Super Bowl ads, and between Kendall Jenner, Kardashian's Curse and Budweiser's Eagle, is going to be hard for other companies to get attention during the Big Game.

1:40:54 It's no surprise then, that kell Ogg's has broke out the big guns or should I say, and got William Shatner for a big Raisin Brand spot. Days after paparazzi caught him eating cereal in his car at a stop light staged I don't know, Raisin Brand has revealed that shatt is about to get Real and an ad for Super Bowl. Let me see LX. That's sixty right. We only see the actor for a brief moment, which clearly channels Star Trek as he's sitting in a captain's chair. Shatner may not be the man to take the reins of the Star Trek franchise, but damn he can make a great commercial. Remember how iconic his priceline ads were back in the day and the comedic flair he could bring simply by being himself. Of course, Shatner doesn't need to rely on his Star Trek knowledge or lack thereof, because he has done a phenomenal job of creating his own brand over the years. Playing William Shatner, the guy from a sci fi series and a commercial is just as valuable as pretending to be Captain Kirk, if not more so. It's a brand like Kellogg's. Is a brand like Kellogg's gonna go to over the top with its promotion considering it's already a household name in the serial industry.

1:42:13 I don't know. Well. That said, I'm eager to see what this ad brings to the table and whether Shatner can still sparkle amid all the conversation tied to Super Bowl sixty. Uh, let's take a look. Do we have a do we actually have this commercial? Jim? I do I have it? I love it? All right, let's do it. Well, Will Shadd here bringing fiber to the masses with Kellogg's raising. Beauty calls? Will Shad every darn day?

1:42:56 Well, bye, Will shadd in the house? Uh, let me just say that suit he's wearing is off the hook. I want one of those bringing fibers to the master of Kellogg's Raisin. Judy Coles, will shut every darn day? Whoa bye, will Shot. In the house. Okay, Jim, take your finger off the button. So so when I see when I he's going to be at the Galaxy con next month, should I take a box of Raisin pran and get him to sign it?

1:43:40 Oh my god, that is worth the. Yeah. Oh my words. Well okay, shouts about for get real. Wow hmm, I agree. Okay, this is a story that is rather close to my heart because of the yeah anyway. Star Trek actress has backlash pushes the show's wokeness to warp speed. A Star Trek actress has conti conservative backlash is pushing the franchise to lean harder into what she calls its super woke identity. Among the critics is White House Deputy chief of Staff No sperat I mean Stephen Miller, who has accused the franchise of abandoning its core audience. Gina Yuescher, who plays Laura Thok Yeah in the new Paramount series Star Trek Starfleet Academy, responded online. Of all of the hatred coming at us is from fred I love this.

1:44:57 I love this woman, fragile, angry white talking about either our non whiteness or our bodies. You, Sheer wrote in an Instagram post. It's frankly ridiculous. I agree with you, Gina, and it makes me want to lean even more into our wokeness. She added comments Miller made on X calling the show tragic and suggesting creative control be handed to William Shatner. Miller has been among critics online who have questioned the show's emphasis on diversity, including varied body types, ethnicities, and sexual orientations. Yeah, tell me you've never seen the show, Stephen, you have no clue anyway. In the series issues, character is in a same sex relationship with Tig Nataro's jet Reno.

1:45:50 Yashar also addresses her sexuality. I was practically born wearing a tool belt, she said, adding but if you could choose your sexuality, why would we choose men? Burn Later, she referred to herself on the show as a as a space lesbian, adding we woke, WOKEI woki, super woke, wokeust of the woke got I love that woman. Have I mentioned that? You know what? They didn't say, she said, A cacophony of woke. Okay, right, yes, I like that. I love this woman. So Shecher has repeatedly embraced the show's woke label. She defended the franchise during a CNN appearance, saying Star Trek has been woke from day one, which if Stephen Miller knew anything, he would know that woke is a good word.

1:46:44 It has been giving negative it has been given sorry, negative connotations. But woke just means you're awake and aware of everything that's going on in the world around you, she said, And I'll add to quote Jane Fonda who said woke basically means you give a damn about other people. So there you go, boom, all right, yeah, my job, Yes. Oh yeah, all right, Paul, Story of the Evening. Okay, so this headline says that Star Trek replaces Major Barrett with Stephen Colbert as a Starfleet computer. What kind of headline is that? Stephen Colbert is an unconventional casting for Star Trek, but his role in Starfleet Academy is unusually pivotal for the long running sci fi franchise. Best known for his witty political satire and hosting talk shows, he also routinely lends his talents to comedic actor. Even though Starfleet Academy isn't a comedy, it does have moments that allow Colbert to flex this muscle. He is featured in every episode so far and is slated to return for the remainder of season one. Although Star Trek's model an era has been far more willing to hire well known actors than the classic shows ever were, bringing Colbert aboard was still seen as uncharacteristic for the space opera Space Opera, However, he has fulfilled his role very well

1:48:15 so far. Furthermore, the responsibility has been had, it comes with a surprising amount of weight in the grand scheme of the Star Trek universe. Rather than playing a physical character. He voices the titular school's digital Dean. He can be heard throughout the show at various points making various announcements that the cadets need to be aware of. So the Dean has largely been a form of comic relief. What he is saying is rarely relevant to the story at hand, but instead allows colbert comic talents to shine in short bursts of world building dialogue. Colbert will never eclipse Barrett's profile within the franchise, but he has done very well in stepping into unfillable shoes. While Berrett's performance as the computer was intentioned only robotic for understandable reasons, Colbert is opted for a different approach. His Dean delivers the announcements in a much more human, quirky way. This doesn't just set him apart from MAJORL. Baron, but also suddenly establishes how far technology and tastes have advanced by the time of the thirty second century. That read like an AI written news article.

1:49:21 Wow. I will also mention that it makes no reference of all to what we just saw in the last episode from last week that we were just talking about. When Jaden is given that you know orb of Starfleet technology. It's it's like a recruit digital recruiting poster, you know. It is the digital dean's voice who he hears that inspires him to follow his bank to the stars and join Serta Fleet. So that's yet another Colbert bit in that bit of folly work there. So pretty cool, I would say, And I think it's working out really well so far. It's not distracting at all like some celebrity casting can be, and a nice side gig for Stephen Colbert in the tenuous environment that late night talk show hosting can be these days with so many medalsome.

1:50:07 Fox getting involved. So anyhow, I think that might wrap up our news coverage, unless we have a hidden news story I'm not privy to, which is always possible. What do you say, poop Bob nay Bob potentate. Jim Well, I think that wraps up another awesome, incredible podcast. I think we are done for tonight. We'll be back next week, guys, don't you worry. We're going to have the same battid, same bat channel. But before we go, I want to say thank you so much to Paul. We're having on and Trek talking with us tonight. Thank you so much, Paul. It's great, wonderful to have a really good piece of writing to talk about, sensational episode. Excited to see what's next.

1:50:54 I agree, and thank you so much to Eric hanging out and Shrek talking with us as well. Thank you so much, Eric h absolutely, thank you all, and. Thank you so much to Be for talking with us as well. Always as always, always a lot of fun. So it is great path of characters we have. Yeah, of course, thank you so much to David and welcome back. Thank sure, it's been fun. And I'm just beginning my second. Uh all right, and thank you so much the child as well, talking.

1:51:40 And as always, and I'll be. An excellent host. Uncle Jem saying to everybody please they say, can be good to each other. Ailing frequencies are closed. Good night everybody, good night, live. Long and prosper. I'm ready for departure, sir. Some problem righter, Just hoping this isn't the usual way our missions will go, sir, Oh, no, number one. I'm sure most will be much Yeah. Well, oh well that's we gotta thank you so much and we'll see you all next Greek bye bye,